Loganair passengers are upset
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Loganair passengers are upset
There is now a Farcebook group "Islanders against Flybe & Loganair's excessive prices". Local MPs and MSPs have joined in the debate
There was an excellent editorial in the "Shetland News"
There was an excellent editorial in the "Shetland News"
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are these prices "excessive" as in the company is making a 25% rate of return on capital or "excessive" as in "we want to pay nothing"?
If the profits were so high you'd get EasyJet or RyanAir there in a flash - but you don't so maybe the profits are pretty grim
the various islanders could use everyone's local taxes to reduce fares but that would be the many subsiding the few
I've been in lots of remote spots around the world and unsubsidised fares are ALWAYS higher than STN-Ibiza
If the profits were so high you'd get EasyJet or RyanAir there in a flash - but you don't so maybe the profits are pretty grim
the various islanders could use everyone's local taxes to reduce fares but that would be the many subsiding the few
I've been in lots of remote spots around the world and unsubsidised fares are ALWAYS higher than STN-Ibiza
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The other 'side of the coin' is that there is a captive audience and fares reflect this but there again airlines are there to make a (reasonable) profit. Lets hope they do not use this route to subsidise less profitable routes.
I've been using those routes on a semi-regular basis for 15 years and they have always been costly - in fact the prices have remained fairly static in that time.
I know there was a hope in the Islands when they switched from a BA franchise to a Flybe franchise it might mean a drop in prices, but that never happened (and was unlikely to anyway).
Truth is, flights with 34 people per trip will never be 'low cost'
I know there was a hope in the Islands when they switched from a BA franchise to a Flybe franchise it might mean a drop in prices, but that never happened (and was unlikely to anyway).
Truth is, flights with 34 people per trip will never be 'low cost'
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You can't have it all unfortunately. I've been visiting the western isles for 30 years as my father is from there. A nice place, with very nice people who are very quick to boast about how great a place it is and how wonderful it is living on an island. Unfortunately there are pros and cons no matter where you choose to live, and expensive flights are just part of living on an island.
Just like social media campaigns a few years back to protest about high petrol costs it is a fact of life that supplying products to the islands are high and that must be passed on to those who consume these products and that includes the flying up there.
You're never going to get a £19.99 all in flight up there. The closest was BMI Regional once time when I paid £56 return and that route lasted five minutes.
A lot of the times people are complaining about the cost of last minute fares which are traditionally higher anyway. That's the same for any airline. If I wanted a Ryanair flight tomorrow I'd probably pay a fortune.
Just like social media campaigns a few years back to protest about high petrol costs it is a fact of life that supplying products to the islands are high and that must be passed on to those who consume these products and that includes the flying up there.
You're never going to get a £19.99 all in flight up there. The closest was BMI Regional once time when I paid £56 return and that route lasted five minutes.
A lot of the times people are complaining about the cost of last minute fares which are traditionally higher anyway. That's the same for any airline. If I wanted a Ryanair flight tomorrow I'd probably pay a fortune.
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Might be time for the islanders to knock their heads together and think about a non-profit airline.
There have been a few, always small and serving a particular niche ( assuming we disregard Aeroflot ) other than Freelandia which was just crazy and should also probably be disregarded.
However it would probably require a different approach to covering costs; perhaps a 'membership subscription' for those intending to fly, plus cost of flight.
Loganair raised margin to a tidy 8% in 2014 despite over £5 million in extraordinary charges, so they're not going to be particularly interested in reducing fares.
There have been a few, always small and serving a particular niche ( assuming we disregard Aeroflot ) other than Freelandia which was just crazy and should also probably be disregarded.
However it would probably require a different approach to covering costs; perhaps a 'membership subscription' for those intending to fly, plus cost of flight.
Loganair raised margin to a tidy 8% in 2014 despite over £5 million in extraordinary charges, so they're not going to be particularly interested in reducing fares.
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TBH all airlines flying to places like the Shetland Islands are non-profit
What can you ring out of any airline to make serious difference?
Lower salaries, nothing paid to shareholders - that's about it
you still have to buy the planes, pay any borrowings, buy fuel, fulfill all the paperwork, stay safe
At the end of the day it's bums on seats, how much cargo you can squeeze in and getting enough full fare passengers to squeak by - profit or non-profit doesn't change these factors
What can you ring out of any airline to make serious difference?
Lower salaries, nothing paid to shareholders - that's about it
you still have to buy the planes, pay any borrowings, buy fuel, fulfill all the paperwork, stay safe
At the end of the day it's bums on seats, how much cargo you can squeeze in and getting enough full fare passengers to squeak by - profit or non-profit doesn't change these factors
It's strange they don't comment about their own products like single malts or Harris Tweed clothing, all of which seem substantially highly priced.
The various carriers serving the islands over time seem to have made minimal margins, and really not much of a return on capital. Aircraft mostly have to be secondhand. I doubt that ATR or Bombardier, as current main manufacturers of local service propeller airliners, spend much time with Loganair.
These sort of stories often tend to emerge in August, during the brief tourist season. Look at the loads they get up there in February, along with all the costs of weather diversions and cancellations, which get them not a penny of extra revenue.
Anyway, there's a long tradition of whinging up there about transport links (and probably everything else). I recall back in the 1970s there was a magazine which always contained pages of whining about Caledonian MacBrayne, the substantially state-subsidised shipping operator there. There was also, after a private enterprise company built the first bridge across to Skye, a vitriolic campaign against their levying tolls (the same as the replaced and unreliable adjacent car ferry), to the extent that one of the companies involved, who I was involved with, had to mount substantial security precautions around their premises.
The various carriers serving the islands over time seem to have made minimal margins, and really not much of a return on capital. Aircraft mostly have to be secondhand. I doubt that ATR or Bombardier, as current main manufacturers of local service propeller airliners, spend much time with Loganair.
These sort of stories often tend to emerge in August, during the brief tourist season. Look at the loads they get up there in February, along with all the costs of weather diversions and cancellations, which get them not a penny of extra revenue.
Anyway, there's a long tradition of whinging up there about transport links (and probably everything else). I recall back in the 1970s there was a magazine which always contained pages of whining about Caledonian MacBrayne, the substantially state-subsidised shipping operator there. There was also, after a private enterprise company built the first bridge across to Skye, a vitriolic campaign against their levying tolls (the same as the replaced and unreliable adjacent car ferry), to the extent that one of the companies involved, who I was involved with, had to mount substantial security precautions around their premises.
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aaaaaa CalMac....
"no taxation without transportation" was the cry IIRC
But then their conditions of carriage specifically excluded claims for " the Captain & Crew conspriing together to defraud the owners and passengers" and also nothing for damage caused by "The plunging, sweating & vice of horses..." never mind "the restraints of Princes"
No doubt they knew the many hazards of their own business...........
"no taxation without transportation" was the cry IIRC
But then their conditions of carriage specifically excluded claims for " the Captain & Crew conspriing together to defraud the owners and passengers" and also nothing for damage caused by "The plunging, sweating & vice of horses..." never mind "the restraints of Princes"
No doubt they knew the many hazards of their own business...........
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Interesting that the folk whinging the most on this thread are from London 
And WHBM, if you were "involved" in that scandal of the Skye Bridge, you
would know the true story of the foreign investors/banks who were doing Thatchers bidding and the end result of the highest tolls in Europe
Internet is full of misinformation, let's keep it off this thread...
And WHBM, if you were "involved" in that scandal of the Skye Bridge, you
would know the true story of the foreign investors/banks who were doing Thatchers bidding and the end result of the highest tolls in Europe
Internet is full of misinformation, let's keep it off this thread...
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Just had to book the mother onto a flight to Stornoway for tomorrow to see an uncle who's seriously unwel. These compassionate trips seem to be the most contentious amongst the FB campaign as you really need to make them.
The cheapest one way was £120 leaving GLA at 0700. Too early to make the connection so it's a £190 flight in the afternoon.
Just out of interest, I checked BA from my local airport to LHR tomorrow and £210 one way is the going rate.
Whilst the rates to the islands are high, they're comparable with domestic flights within the mainland. Booking last minute will always set you back a lot more than booking in advance.
The cheapest one way was £120 leaving GLA at 0700. Too early to make the connection so it's a £190 flight in the afternoon.
Just out of interest, I checked BA from my local airport to LHR tomorrow and £210 one way is the going rate.
Whilst the rates to the islands are high, they're comparable with domestic flights within the mainland. Booking last minute will always set you back a lot more than booking in advance.
