Medical Suspended Indefinitely - CPL Holder
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Medical Suspended Indefinitely - CPL Holder
Hi Guys,
We all dread it, and unfortunately it has become something of a reality. My medical has been suspended due to a recent spell of Migraine's (aura). I'm reasonably optimistic of overcoming these by eliminating triggers, diet, exercise etc. but in the interim, I am left with a CPL, in the cold.
So from this point, I am looking to stay relevant within the industry, or in the worst case scenario, forge an alternative career path.
I'm essentially looking for advice, insight, options etc. of putting my CPL to use, and developing within, preferably, a technical role. I would really love to get a foot in as an Operations or Load Controller, but am somewhat in the dark as to how or where. I have considered ATC in the past few days, but don't feel as though it is aligned with my direction. For what it is worth, I'm Melbourne based.
Appreciative of any replies in advance
We all dread it, and unfortunately it has become something of a reality. My medical has been suspended due to a recent spell of Migraine's (aura). I'm reasonably optimistic of overcoming these by eliminating triggers, diet, exercise etc. but in the interim, I am left with a CPL, in the cold.
So from this point, I am looking to stay relevant within the industry, or in the worst case scenario, forge an alternative career path.
I'm essentially looking for advice, insight, options etc. of putting my CPL to use, and developing within, preferably, a technical role. I would really love to get a foot in as an Operations or Load Controller, but am somewhat in the dark as to how or where. I have considered ATC in the past few days, but don't feel as though it is aligned with my direction. For what it is worth, I'm Melbourne based.
Appreciative of any replies in advance
Ah yes well you see.... where you went wrong is you admitted something.
That's the IQ component of the medical.
I'm nursing a drug habit, a heart condition, childhood athsma, migranes, alcoholism, erectile dysfunction, a funny tingling sensation in one toe and a bit of a limp.
And alcoholism.
But I still have a Class 1.
Deny, deny, deny.
That's the IQ component of the medical.
I'm nursing a drug habit, a heart condition, childhood athsma, migranes, alcoholism, erectile dysfunction, a funny tingling sensation in one toe and a bit of a limp.
And alcoholism.
But I still have a Class 1.
Deny, deny, deny.
Last edited by Horatio Leafblower; 8th Apr 2013 at 12:15. Reason: ...joking. Just joking.
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You've got loads of options 
And Fathom's right, I've got one student who's taking CASA to VCAT over his medical, he'll win. I've got another student who did a bit of research and found a Cardiologist who's aware of CASA's tactics, he got his medical back. You're too young to be letting them decide your future!
And Fathom's right, I've got one student who's taking CASA to VCAT over his medical, he'll win. I've got another student who did a bit of research and found a Cardiologist who's aware of CASA's tactics, he got his medical back. You're too young to be letting them decide your future!
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Haha, sure it'd be naive to think that most of us aren't hiding something in the closet, but this was more a genuine concern towards my health, and overall safety when flying if an when one was to occur.
I become more or less incapacitated during, with a large chunk of my central and/or peripheral vision being impaired, following by significant confusion etc. Whilst they are irregular and few and far between (3-4 a year), the possibility of suffering one, particularly in Single Pilot Ops becomes the stuff of nightmares. Have read of various airliners being impacted by a Flight Crew member going down with one.
I become more or less incapacitated during, with a large chunk of my central and/or peripheral vision being impaired, following by significant confusion etc. Whilst they are irregular and few and far between (3-4 a year), the possibility of suffering one, particularly in Single Pilot Ops becomes the stuff of nightmares. Have read of various airliners being impacted by a Flight Crew member going down with one.
I think you might need to lawyer up. Its certainly a time (both professionally & personally) to get the very best medical advice you can. This will inevitably be a specialist.
Get the best medical advice you can. Fully investigate it. Do whatever tests you need. Figure out a treatment regime. Involve CASA only after you have it sorted. They are not here to help.
CASA has taken down the old (useful) DAME handbook and put up something bland and of little use as a guideline. I'd study the FAA one and see what drugs can be used.
Guide for Aviation Medical Examiners
The CASA medical group is difficult to deal with. You are going to need the biggest gorilla you can find (ie a specialist with impeccable credentials) to do battle with CASA combined with a good DAME who will go into battle for you. Make no mistake, it will be a battle. But, if you get your health stable and the drugs required are not too bad, you should give it a go.
My advice would be to do as much investigation of your syndrome outside the CASA system and go back into the CASA system only after you have it sorted.
Migranes are not well understood. You may spend years looking for triggers and never find them. It is even possible that its just a stress related episode. I'd do some reading. Look for US not-for-profits and the Mayo clinic as starting points.
Get the best medical advice you can. Fully investigate it. Do whatever tests you need. Figure out a treatment regime. Involve CASA only after you have it sorted. They are not here to help.
CASA has taken down the old (useful) DAME handbook and put up something bland and of little use as a guideline. I'd study the FAA one and see what drugs can be used.
Guide for Aviation Medical Examiners
The CASA medical group is difficult to deal with. You are going to need the biggest gorilla you can find (ie a specialist with impeccable credentials) to do battle with CASA combined with a good DAME who will go into battle for you. Make no mistake, it will be a battle. But, if you get your health stable and the drugs required are not too bad, you should give it a go.
My advice would be to do as much investigation of your syndrome outside the CASA system and go back into the CASA system only after you have it sorted.
Migranes are not well understood. You may spend years looking for triggers and never find them. It is even possible that its just a stress related episode. I'd do some reading. Look for US not-for-profits and the Mayo clinic as starting points.
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Lets be brutally honest.
You have a medical problem and a potentially serious one and we are all talking about AAT / suing CASA, specialists etc!
There's a reason why they don't want you flying an aircraft right now.
I applaud your approach of finding what is actually wrong and setting up yourself with some alternatives in the mean time. Smart thinking.
Perhaps try AMCO at Virgin or similar although not sure if they are still running that out of Melbourne now. Your experience may help you a little.
Good luck and I hope you get to the bottom of it.
You have a medical problem and a potentially serious one and we are all talking about AAT / suing CASA, specialists etc!
There's a reason why they don't want you flying an aircraft right now.
I applaud your approach of finding what is actually wrong and setting up yourself with some alternatives in the mean time. Smart thinking.
Perhaps try AMCO at Virgin or similar although not sure if they are still running that out of Melbourne now. Your experience may help you a little.
Good luck and I hope you get to the bottom of it.
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Get better, go to another doc, get your medical back and never tell anyone your a pilot. Especially a doc.
Also always go to a doc that is way less fit than you. Overweight, drinking problem, high blood pressure and smokes. There are plenty around.
Good luck. I am being serious.
Also always go to a doc that is way less fit than you. Overweight, drinking problem, high blood pressure and smokes. There are plenty around.
Good luck. I am being serious.
I've always used two Dr's, one for genuine ailments, the other for class 1's.
And just like wives and girl friends, never let them meet!
That little stamped piece of expensive paper is easy to loose, and nigh on impossible to get back once lost.
A not so bright friend slipped in the bath and knocked himself out for literally just a few minutes, he went to his Doc, (who was also his avmed examiner). Doc wrote out report mentioning head injury involving loss of consciousness and concussion. Medical 'temporarily' pulled. I think that was 2 yrs ago, and casa are still waiting to see 'proof' that he'll never have an epileptic episode?!?
Like Old Akro said, they're not here to help, and certainly not practical or, it seems sensible. And as is the CASA way, you're 'guilty' until you prove yourself innocent, or in this case, fit to fly, by their definition of the term.
Best of luck getting better. And the same for getting your medical back.
And just like wives and girl friends, never let them meet!
That little stamped piece of expensive paper is easy to loose, and nigh on impossible to get back once lost.
A not so bright friend slipped in the bath and knocked himself out for literally just a few minutes, he went to his Doc, (who was also his avmed examiner). Doc wrote out report mentioning head injury involving loss of consciousness and concussion. Medical 'temporarily' pulled. I think that was 2 yrs ago, and casa are still waiting to see 'proof' that he'll never have an epileptic episode?!?
Like Old Akro said, they're not here to help, and certainly not practical or, it seems sensible. And as is the CASA way, you're 'guilty' until you prove yourself innocent, or in this case, fit to fly, by their definition of the term.
Best of luck getting better. And the same for getting your medical back.
Last edited by Unusual-Attitude; 10th Apr 2013 at 07:55. Reason: OK, im being slightly facetious... ;)
Just be aware what the motivation of CASA is in this matter; they don't give a flying **** about you or the general public either.
What the medical group cares about is the very large boot up the backside they will get if the morning paper runs the headline "Passengers terrified when pilot blacks out" because the Minister doesn't like headlines.
Their only defence is "we tried to take his medical away but the AAT made us give it back!"
First get a specialists opinion and develop a treatment plan if required. I read somewhere that there is a pill that can be taken if the sufferer recognises the onset of a migraine, so perhaps that might help your case, but you and your specialist must both be sure that you have a real remedy. Don't try to con CASA or anyone else.
What the medical group cares about is the very large boot up the backside they will get if the morning paper runs the headline "Passengers terrified when pilot blacks out" because the Minister doesn't like headlines.
Their only defence is "we tried to take his medical away but the AAT made us give it back!"
First get a specialists opinion and develop a treatment plan if required. I read somewhere that there is a pill that can be taken if the sufferer recognises the onset of a migraine, so perhaps that might help your case, but you and your specialist must both be sure that you have a real remedy. Don't try to con CASA or anyone else.
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Listen to VH-XXX and give a flying F to all those who recommend covering up the issue with CASA. 
I am sure you don't want to be the schmuk who takes a plane load of pax down with him when that migraine turns out to be something more catastrophic.
I have had a couple of medical issues over the past few years, all of which have been sorted out with the assistance of the appropriate medical specialists. I have never hidden the issues from CASA, in fact, they were revealed during the annual medical (another benefit from having a licence given the average Oz males rate of having an annual medical). In all cases the support staff at CASA were excellent at advising me where the issue was with the medical advisory group and as soon as the medical was renewed they emailed me a copy of the decision immediately.
Get that medical issue sorted. You need to know that it is not a major issue far more than you need a pilots licence. There are no second chances with your life. Good luck with it.
I am sure you don't want to be the schmuk who takes a plane load of pax down with him when that migraine turns out to be something more catastrophic. I have had a couple of medical issues over the past few years, all of which have been sorted out with the assistance of the appropriate medical specialists. I have never hidden the issues from CASA, in fact, they were revealed during the annual medical (another benefit from having a licence given the average Oz males rate of having an annual medical). In all cases the support staff at CASA were excellent at advising me where the issue was with the medical advisory group and as soon as the medical was renewed they emailed me a copy of the decision immediately.
Get that medical issue sorted. You need to know that it is not a major issue far more than you need a pilots licence. There are no second chances with your life. Good luck with it.
Deny, deny, deny.
I've always used two Dr's, one for genuine ailments, the other for class 1's.
There are some questions on the AVMED application form that you must be answering falsely. That’s a very, very big risk to take.
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I agree with PLovett and XXX... if you have a medical condition you should get it attended to not covered up. Anyone who suggests you hide it is a bloody idiot.
If you're sick you should not be flying. This much you owe to your pax and others.
Years ago I had a pilot working for me with a serious inner ear problem, who kept it a secret. He ended up scaring half of the customers he flew and ended up costing us a couple of our best clients. Thankfully he did not kill anyone.
Anyway he ended up in CASA. Seriously!
So in addition to operations & ATC, which are pretty competitive, don't rule out CASA.
Also ground training, go and see the folks at the various TAFEs in Melbourne that do aviation studies.
Talk to the airports... having a CPL makes for a good basis for aerodrome works reporting & safety officers.
I also know several guys that for various reasons that did not go on with their CPLs get successful careers as refuellers and cabin crew, which have less stringent medical requirements.
Just don't bull**** about your health.
If you're sick you should not be flying. This much you owe to your pax and others.
Years ago I had a pilot working for me with a serious inner ear problem, who kept it a secret. He ended up scaring half of the customers he flew and ended up costing us a couple of our best clients. Thankfully he did not kill anyone.
Anyway he ended up in CASA. Seriously!
So in addition to operations & ATC, which are pretty competitive, don't rule out CASA.
Also ground training, go and see the folks at the various TAFEs in Melbourne that do aviation studies.
Talk to the airports... having a CPL makes for a good basis for aerodrome works reporting & safety officers.
I also know several guys that for various reasons that did not go on with their CPLs get successful careers as refuellers and cabin crew, which have less stringent medical requirements.
Just don't bull**** about your health.
Last edited by hiwaytohell; 8th Apr 2013 at 22:35.
In all cases the support staff at CASA were excellent
Some years ago Stan Tilley wrote an excellent (and brave) article for one of the magazines about his experience dealing with CASA. The thing is that most pilots who have grief with CASA do not speak up, because it means revealing their medical issue.
Our you CPL said his issue is
recent spell of Migraine's
I maintain that this is a time to assertively investigate this issue with the best specialists you can find. This may still be an episodic attack due to something in your life. Migranes have huge variation. They don't necessarily involve pain, nor are bad headache's necessarily migranes.
There is nothing transparent, objective or consistent about the CASA medical group. You only need to go online and read the Australian DAME manual vs the FAA one to get a sense of this. I would encourage you to do this and learn as much as you can.
I would still recommend you treat this like its going to be a battle. Its better to do that and be pleasantly surprised if its easy than the other way around. There is a strong chance you'll need a fist full of specialist (probably neurologist) letters to present to CASA, so you might as well start seeing one of the heavy hitters now who can work up your history.
I still maintain you should go to CASA when you have the solution - not when you only have the problem. They can issue a suspension with the flick of a pen that might take 18 months of solid effort to undo. If you can find Stan Tilleys article, it illustrates this point. My experience echoes this and my DAME mates will privately give the same advice.
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My experience is that if your problem is something "out of the box", junior CASA staff get overly cautious and can be a pain.
I got messed around for months getting my medical back after LASIK surgery. A courteous call to a supervisor in the relevant CASA section had my medical restored after a 15 minute explanation over the phone.
The CASA woman I spoke to knew her stuff, and being a supervisor just sorted it out on the spot. She was helpful and a pleasure to deal with.
Always be polite and patient dealing with CASA, use email as much as possible for the paper-trail, and try and get past the front line staff to deal with the more senior ones for tricky issues.
I got messed around for months getting my medical back after LASIK surgery. A courteous call to a supervisor in the relevant CASA section had my medical restored after a 15 minute explanation over the phone.
The CASA woman I spoke to knew her stuff, and being a supervisor just sorted it out on the spot. She was helpful and a pleasure to deal with.
Always be polite and patient dealing with CASA, use email as much as possible for the paper-trail, and try and get past the front line staff to deal with the more senior ones for tricky issues.
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flvckoflyer, I hope you are well atm. Migraines can be induced by many, many external initiators. I hope your dr sent you immediately for a brain CT? If not get a new dr. It is more common to get migraines and grow out of them as you get older (if you are lucky) than to suddenly start getting them once an adult. You need to find that trigger and get your health sorted out. No point only having half a life because of this sinister afflication.