ADS-B stuff that I have found II
Thread Starter
Remember this thread from two years ago?
ADS-B Costs
T28D, you now want broadband in your cockpit but you want AirServices to give it to you for nix? Is this the new thrust of your argument?
Re-post for FIS-B above. I was mearly pointing out what can be done within a limited bandwidth. The best programmers can write code that uses the minimum resource possible. Bloat ware is what makes a joke of broadband and high performance PCs.
ADS-B Costs
T28D, you now want broadband in your cockpit but you want AirServices to give it to you for nix? Is this the new thrust of your argument?
Re-post for FIS-B above. I was mearly pointing out what can be done within a limited bandwidth. The best programmers can write code that uses the minimum resource possible. Bloat ware is what makes a joke of broadband and high performance PCs.
Thread Starter
Press release from Trig Avionics
Trig Avionics - Ready today for Australian Airspace changes.
Edinburgh, 11 September 2012
Many pilots are excited by the surveillance benefits that Australia’s ADS-B network offers. Trig Avionics Limited, the UK transponder manufacturer has released new ADS-B compatible software across their TT31, TT22 and TT21 transponder range. This software provides pilots with a simple upgrade path to ADS-B featuring enhanced compatibility with associated aircraft avionics.*
A comprehensive flight test programme has proven Trig’s compatibility with popular Garmin GPS units. This means GA pilots now have a clear route to install a complete ADS-B Out capability, at a competitive cost and with the minimum of inconvenience.
Brad Granger, Head of Engineering at Pacific Avionics in New South Wales ran these recent flight trials. “We used a Trig TT31 transponder with the latest Trig 3.4 software. This equipment formed the hub of our ADS-B install and easily integrated with our GNS 530W Garmin avionics. The results were great; there had been some compatibility issues with earlier software versions which Trig quickly addressed with this latest release. We’ve shown that Trig technology works in our own airspace, providing the visibility and accuracy of surveillance that pilots want to have. Trig equipment complies with the latest ADS-B certification standards, using Mode S 1090 ES (Extended Squitter). Air traffic controllers used the 1090 ES ADS-B transmissions and the latest Trig 3.4 software delivered faultless performance.”*
Greg Dunstone, ADS-B Program Manager at Airservices Australia, confirmed that Airservices monitored the air traffic during the trial. “Airservices is now delivering ADS-B services to a number of aircraft with Trig transponders. The installation of ADS-B into general aviation aircraft will allow our air traffic controllers to provide separation and safety services across vast areas of the country where no conventional radar services exist. Airservices encourages GA pilots to consider the fitment of ADS-B Out to further enhance the safe operation of all aircraft in Australian airspace.”
Brad Granger said “All Trig transponders are ADS-B Out capable; the TT31 is an ideal retro-fit for an existing transponder. The TT21 and TT22 transponders are highly compact lightweight units, ideal where panel space is tight. Trig transponders can utilise an existing transponder antenna and with the addition of a suitable WAAS GPS an aircraft can become ADS-B compliant.”
Aircraft owners who wish to consider a Trig ADS-B solution should contact their Approved Trig Dealer who can advise them on upgrading their specific aircraft. There are currently nine Approved Trig Dealers in Australia. Pacific Avionics are an Approved Trig Dealer and Trig Service Centre. Hawker Pacific - Australian Avionics have recently been appointed too, becoming an Approved Trig Service Centre and Approved Trig Dealer.* Jeff Gribble Avionics Sales Manager at Hawker Pacific - Australian Avionics said, “We’re delighted to have become a Trig dealer and we anticipate a lot of interest in Trig products. We’ve been really impressed with Trig’s compact and retro-fit transponder solutions that are smart, affordable and future proof.”
Trig Avionics - Ready today for Australian Airspace changes.
Edinburgh, 11 September 2012
Many pilots are excited by the surveillance benefits that Australia’s ADS-B network offers. Trig Avionics Limited, the UK transponder manufacturer has released new ADS-B compatible software across their TT31, TT22 and TT21 transponder range. This software provides pilots with a simple upgrade path to ADS-B featuring enhanced compatibility with associated aircraft avionics.*
A comprehensive flight test programme has proven Trig’s compatibility with popular Garmin GPS units. This means GA pilots now have a clear route to install a complete ADS-B Out capability, at a competitive cost and with the minimum of inconvenience.
Brad Granger, Head of Engineering at Pacific Avionics in New South Wales ran these recent flight trials. “We used a Trig TT31 transponder with the latest Trig 3.4 software. This equipment formed the hub of our ADS-B install and easily integrated with our GNS 530W Garmin avionics. The results were great; there had been some compatibility issues with earlier software versions which Trig quickly addressed with this latest release. We’ve shown that Trig technology works in our own airspace, providing the visibility and accuracy of surveillance that pilots want to have. Trig equipment complies with the latest ADS-B certification standards, using Mode S 1090 ES (Extended Squitter). Air traffic controllers used the 1090 ES ADS-B transmissions and the latest Trig 3.4 software delivered faultless performance.”*
Greg Dunstone, ADS-B Program Manager at Airservices Australia, confirmed that Airservices monitored the air traffic during the trial. “Airservices is now delivering ADS-B services to a number of aircraft with Trig transponders. The installation of ADS-B into general aviation aircraft will allow our air traffic controllers to provide separation and safety services across vast areas of the country where no conventional radar services exist. Airservices encourages GA pilots to consider the fitment of ADS-B Out to further enhance the safe operation of all aircraft in Australian airspace.”
Brad Granger said “All Trig transponders are ADS-B Out capable; the TT31 is an ideal retro-fit for an existing transponder. The TT21 and TT22 transponders are highly compact lightweight units, ideal where panel space is tight. Trig transponders can utilise an existing transponder antenna and with the addition of a suitable WAAS GPS an aircraft can become ADS-B compliant.”
Aircraft owners who wish to consider a Trig ADS-B solution should contact their Approved Trig Dealer who can advise them on upgrading their specific aircraft. There are currently nine Approved Trig Dealers in Australia. Pacific Avionics are an Approved Trig Dealer and Trig Service Centre. Hawker Pacific - Australian Avionics have recently been appointed too, becoming an Approved Trig Service Centre and Approved Trig Dealer.* Jeff Gribble Avionics Sales Manager at Hawker Pacific - Australian Avionics said, “We’re delighted to have become a Trig dealer and we anticipate a lot of interest in Trig products. We’ve been really impressed with Trig’s compact and retro-fit transponder solutions that are smart, affordable and future proof.”
Last edited by OZBUSDRIVER; 9th Oct 2012 at 09:02.
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Bas, you'll enjoy this-
FIS-B for 1090es
FIS-B for 1090es
Besides, we're not going to get any of that anyway.
Thread Starter
Garmin ADS-B academy
Resources available from Garmin.
But Bas, Lincoln labs looked at it. Matters not that you would even want data this way. Look at it this way...if I was in the states I would seriously not even bother with UAT. 1090es fulfills my legal requirement. I would be far better served with an XM subscription.
Resources available from Garmin.
But Bas, Lincoln labs looked at it. Matters not that you would even want data this way. Look at it this way...if I was in the states I would seriously not even bother with UAT. 1090es fulfills my legal requirement. I would be far better served with an XM subscription.
Last edited by OZBUSDRIVER; 10th Oct 2012 at 04:07.
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if I was in the states I would seriously not even bother with UAT. 1090es fulfills my legal requirement. I would be far better served with an XM subscription.
Nobody cares about ADS-B OUT; there is no legal obligation to cover for them yet.
They are going absolutely gaga over buying $1000 receivers for their iPads, or $2500 NavWorx transceivers hooked up to their existing GPS/EFIS/MFD that gets them traffic! (and ADS-B out to boot if they have a c145 source)
They *love* the fact they see all mode-C traffic around them in areas with radar coverage. (I have seen this myself, flying around Chicago. It rocks.)
Not to mention not having to pay a minimum $35/month for the XM subscriptions they seem to be cancelling en-masse.
UAT with TIS and FIS gives them a reason to buy ABS-B now and most people seem to be very enthusiastic about it. It's good value.
Now if we had that technology and buying incentive here ... we probably wouldn't be having this conversation.
Thread Starter
It would appear after a quick google. Some like, some don't. It would appear the game changer is the GDL39 receiver. Gets FIS but relies on other transmitters to receive TIS from the ground station. One poster put the line 1090es for the legal bit and the 39 for the freebies. Some posters like the NEXRAD depictions others prefer XM. Gotta be airborne to get info and in the mountains pretty high up where XM still works on the ground. However, I have never come across anyone complain about how long it takes for XM to load and/or refresh as much as just recently....interesting!
All,
A very interesting article in the latest US AOPA magazine about the time delays for XM weather to refresh, upwards of nine (9) minutes. The articles is all about a fatal as a result of a pilot using XM near a line of CBs, and not taking the advice of ATC.
XM ain't weather radar, and this was weather that you should not go anywhere near, in any kind of aircraft, even with weather radar.
Tootle pip!!
A very interesting article in the latest US AOPA magazine about the time delays for XM weather to refresh, upwards of nine (9) minutes. The articles is all about a fatal as a result of a pilot using XM near a line of CBs, and not taking the advice of ATC.
XM ain't weather radar, and this was weather that you should not go anywhere near, in any kind of aircraft, even with weather radar.
Tootle pip!!
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Seems to me we are all heading into a techo void that has well meaning intention but no real backing from any form of genuine regulation.
It is not all about ADSB, in fact the alphabet soup of acronyms confuses the real virtue of any or inded all of the ground based applications one might purchaseat the lowest price / month as asubscription service.
Personally having had some reasonable experience with the delivery of broadband services and the false expectations that consumers develop I am really personally wedded to my stance of 5 years ago, nothing has really changed, ADSB below 5000 is still a dream and subscription services such as the various weather uplinks in the U.S. just won't occur here, (a) the weather in general is too benign and (b) the market ( consumers) is too small for commercial viability.
So folks play with the dream, I just hope it isn't wet at the end !!!!!
It is not all about ADSB, in fact the alphabet soup of acronyms confuses the real virtue of any or inded all of the ground based applications one might purchaseat the lowest price / month as asubscription service.
Personally having had some reasonable experience with the delivery of broadband services and the false expectations that consumers develop I am really personally wedded to my stance of 5 years ago, nothing has really changed, ADSB below 5000 is still a dream and subscription services such as the various weather uplinks in the U.S. just won't occur here, (a) the weather in general is too benign and (b) the market ( consumers) is too small for commercial viability.
So folks play with the dream, I just hope it isn't wet at the end !!!!!
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subscription services such as the various weather uplinks in the U.S. just won't occur here,
the market ( consumers) is too small for commercial viability.
Anyway, where the bad weather occurs in Australia and NOTAMs matter, you are generally never too far away from a Telstra tower, so get your weather and NOTAMs that way.
Traffic I guess will never happen here. The majority of flying is VFR in G and without a requirement, nobody is going to spend quite that much money on equipment that only has value if everybody else buys it too.
Thread Starter
OK, we will ignore the other two nutters for a bit. Who said anything about weather radar?
Bas, how true! Avidyne had a demo a number of years ago on satellite wx for Aus. Pretty exi when you look at what is available for smart devices with a broadband connection.
As far as traffic, it will always depend on widespread fitment. However, as an aid to mark1a eyeball, any little help is good. That GDL39 is looking good for that application.
Bas, how true! Avidyne had a demo a number of years ago on satellite wx for Aus. Pretty exi when you look at what is available for smart devices with a broadband connection.
As far as traffic, it will always depend on widespread fitment. However, as an aid to mark1a eyeball, any little help is good. That GDL39 is looking good for that application.
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As far as traffic, it will always depend on widespread fitment.
And to get back to T28D: it ain't over till the fat lady sings. There are still those powers who *really* want us to have ADS-B. (although it is debatable whether this is because they actually want us to have it for safety reasons or they just want there to be a *requirement* for ADS-B and if we can't afford it and stop flying, that's an even better outcome for them.)
If 2020 rolls around and in the US every GA aircraft has UAT ADS-B because it is affordable and useful to them (free WX, traffic) they may just think: "hey, maybe we should put those UAT cards in the racks and provide FIS and TIS, people might buy this stuff then".
Thread Starter
My bad. Was referring to Aus airspace in that last post.
I take it you are in Vic, Bas? Go talk to Hans at Enigma over at Moorabbin( if he is still there?) and ask him how difficult it is to get access to AirService's feed. He had a TIS setup that would work a treat if he could only get access.
I take it you are in Vic, Bas? Go talk to Hans at Enigma over at Moorabbin( if he is still there?) and ask him how difficult it is to get access to AirService's feed. He had a TIS setup that would work a treat if he could only get access.
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This new Airservices document provides a brief overview of the Australian ADS-B setup and reasons for going that way. Addresses several recurring arguments in this thread from Airservices point of view.
http://www.airservicesaustralia.com/...IRSERVICES.pdf
http://www.airservicesaustralia.com/...IRSERVICES.pdf
Thread Starter
Latest news from Trig Avionics
Hmmmm....this equipment is getting pretty well widely available. I am noting some of my links are starting to look like advertising. Anyway, TA60 1090Rx looks like being available Q2 2013. And that will be my last product plug.
Can I say that given the CAAP as linked above and product availability for just about any level of aviation. Methinks this issue is no longer an issue
Now if we can convince certain members of parliament to look at the idea of joining up with the Japanese government. Gets some ground stations set up with the ADS-B sites and uplink to the MTSAT we may get WAAS and FINALLY get some approach aids out in the bush that WILL save lives.
AC21-45(1)
Civil Aviation Order 20.18 Amendment Instrument 2012 (No. 1)
Download Instrument and Explanatory Statement
Andrew Anderson has valid point for delaying mandatory fitment for VFR till affordable equipment availability...just a question on what is cheap enough
Hmmmm....this equipment is getting pretty well widely available. I am noting some of my links are starting to look like advertising. Anyway, TA60 1090Rx looks like being available Q2 2013. And that will be my last product plug.
Can I say that given the CAAP as linked above and product availability for just about any level of aviation. Methinks this issue is no longer an issue
Now if we can convince certain members of parliament to look at the idea of joining up with the Japanese government. Gets some ground stations set up with the ADS-B sites and uplink to the MTSAT we may get WAAS and FINALLY get some approach aids out in the bush that WILL save lives.
AC21-45(1)
Civil Aviation Order 20.18 Amendment Instrument 2012 (No. 1)
Download Instrument and Explanatory Statement
Andrew Anderson has valid point for delaying mandatory fitment for VFR till affordable equipment availability...just a question on what is cheap enough
Last edited by OZBUSDRIVER; 15th Nov 2012 at 03:04.
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Still waiting for those sub-$1000 c145 GPS units, though. Those have always been the most expensive part of the equation by far.
A transceiver would be nice too, why have two boxes duplicating lots of components?
A transceiver would be nice too, why have two boxes duplicating lots of components?
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Baswell, we keep tripping over those nasty TSO specs/requirements , there is way more technology in a modern touch screen phone ( digital transciever ) than is needed for ADSB.
Problem is we just can't let go of the conservative past and allow new thinking to evolve new user friendly kit.
In the 1960's Aviation led the technology, now it is a very lost second or third cousin.
Problem is we just can't let go of the conservative past and allow new thinking to evolve new user friendly kit.
In the 1960's Aviation led the technology, now it is a very lost second or third cousin.