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good thread and some good info.
I am currently flying in Nepal. I have an immigrant visa and work permit through the diversity visa.
I however have flown on a two crew-single engine turbo prop aircraft(as per the requirement of our aviation authority due to terrain). Flying to places like Lukla which is considered most dangerous airport in the world and other airfields similar to that.
both the pilots hold aircraft specific pic type rating for the aircraft. one pilot flies one leg of the flight and me usually the sector back or vice versa. who ever flies the leg logs it as PIC and rest is logged as SIC if your doing the radios and duties of SIC.
with a TT of 1800 hrs and a total of 1200 hrs pic and 600 hrs sic (including 1000 hrs pic on turbo prop). But i am not current on Instrument nor current on multi engine and only have about 20 hrs of ME time.
I plan to come to US get my BFR, IPC and ATP done. What are the chances of getting a job then? and what kinda jobs would i get?
Any suggestions?
I however have flown on a two crew-single engine turbo prop aircraft(as per the requirement of our aviation authority due to terrain). Flying to places like Lukla which is considered most dangerous airport in the world and other airfields similar to that.
both the pilots hold aircraft specific pic type rating for the aircraft. one pilot flies one leg of the flight and me usually the sector back or vice versa. who ever flies the leg logs it as PIC and rest is logged as SIC if your doing the radios and duties of SIC.
with a TT of 1800 hrs and a total of 1200 hrs pic and 600 hrs sic (including 1000 hrs pic on turbo prop). But i am not current on Instrument nor current on multi engine and only have about 20 hrs of ME time.
I plan to come to US get my BFR, IPC and ATP done. What are the chances of getting a job then? and what kinda jobs would i get?
Any suggestions?
Last edited by jackcarls0n; 8th Nov 2012 at 16:05.
First, welcome to America.
The good news that getting your ATP will count for your Flight Review (the B was dropped from the official title years ago) and IPC.
The bad news is your multi time is low. All the RJ operators are going to want 100 hours MEL. Even Cape Air flying CE-402s wants 25 MEL for their F/Os. You will have to find some way to up your MEL time to be competive.
The good news that getting your ATP will count for your Flight Review (the B was dropped from the official title years ago) and IPC.
The bad news is your multi time is low. All the RJ operators are going to want 100 hours MEL. Even Cape Air flying CE-402s wants 25 MEL for their F/Os. You will have to find some way to up your MEL time to be competive.
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Thank you.
Thanks for the info. Taking the ATP checkride would make me instrument current. But i need to log some night and multi hours plus instrument. Thus, i guess i need a bfr and ipc to fly solo. I am also planning to log about 50 mel hrs to meet the night and instrument hours on a be 76, this should make proficient on ME and instrument flying i hope.
Would then i be legible for some kinda job if yes, what kind RJ or Multi piston on 91 or 135 like cape air?
Thanks for the info. Taking the ATP checkride would make me instrument current. But i need to log some night and multi hours plus instrument. Thus, i guess i need a bfr and ipc to fly solo. I am also planning to log about 50 mel hrs to meet the night and instrument hours on a be 76, this should make proficient on ME and instrument flying i hope.
Would then i be legible for some kinda job if yes, what kind RJ or Multi piston on 91 or 135 like cape air?
Ah, there are always details. You can get a private certificate based on your Nepal license by having your CAA verify your license to the FAA. Part of the FAA guidance to their Inspectors is to remind the new certifcate holder that that certificate is only good as long as their foreign license is valid and that they need a flight review before they fly under their FAA cert. While the regs only say that a flight review has to have one hour ground school and one hour flight training, I'd think the FR for a 61.75 pilot could go on most of a day to cover all the differences. In order to have an instrument rating on your 61.75 private certificate you will have to pass a knowledge test, either a foreign pilot differences test or the regular instrument written. But there is no checkride.
If you have 25 hours MEL now and log 50 hours to fill all the sub-totals for the ATP you'll still only have 75 hours MEL so you'll still be short the MEL time for most RJ jobs and most likely be looking at a recip or turboprop F/O position.
If you have 25 hours MEL now and log 50 hours to fill all the sub-totals for the ATP you'll still only have 75 hours MEL so you'll still be short the MEL time for most RJ jobs and most likely be looking at a recip or turboprop F/O position.
Last edited by MarkerInbound; 9th Nov 2012 at 20:33.
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I already have a FAA CPL with IR and MEL.
I did my initials in USA
what is min mel hour requirement to get a job to fly multi engine aircrafts? Not necessarily at Regional level?
I did my initials in USA
what is min mel hour requirement to get a job to fly multi engine aircrafts? Not necessarily at Regional level?
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Originally Posted by edie
With 12 million illegal Mexicans in the US what do you have to lose? Head to the US, get married and don't leave the country until you get your green card. If you are flexible and willing to work you will get a job. This thread might be an indication that supply is starting to catch up with demand. $5000 sign on bonus at Eagle - Airline Pilot Central Forums
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Ah, disregard.
Every job will be different. You meet the legal requirements by holding a commercial MEL. Requirements above that are normally driven by the company's insurance and training program. Some companies want 50 hours, some want 200. If they can get enough applicants they have no reason to change their requirements.
what is min mel hour requirement to get a job to fly multi engine aircrafts? Not necessarily at Regional level?
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Hi Guys me again
Just wondering if you need your FAA Commercial license in order to instruct? I currently have a European ATP..... it sounds like I can't convert my license to anything higher than a FAA PPL, it would then take me ages to build time towards a CPL if that's the minimum I need in order to teach?
Any idea how many hours difference the two licenses are??
Cheers all
Just wondering if you need your FAA Commercial license in order to instruct? I currently have a European ATP..... it sounds like I can't convert my license to anything higher than a FAA PPL, it would then take me ages to build time towards a CPL if that's the minimum I need in order to teach?
Any idea how many hours difference the two licenses are??
Cheers all
Last edited by captain two-holds; 12th Nov 2012 at 13:52.
You must hold an FAA CPL + IR, or an ATP, to hold an FAA instructor rating.
You wrote earlier that you have something like 250 hours. How can you have an ATPL with only those hours? Conversely, if you hold a CPL, why do you keep referring to it as an ATP?
You wrote earlier that you have something like 250 hours. How can you have an ATPL with only those hours? Conversely, if you hold a CPL, why do you keep referring to it as an ATP?
Last edited by Tinstaafl; 12th Nov 2012 at 14:09.
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Tinstaafl
We seem to do things very differently in this part of the world. I hold an EASA ATPL (made up of CPL+IR+MCC, the later being a multi crew course on a B737 sim,) which is the equivalent to an FAA ATP, and obviously requires much less hours to get.
I was referring to the FAA CPL, and how many hours I may need to build to get the FAA equivalent of the CPL +IR. For example if I need to build another 300 hours just to get my FAA licenses then I may as well stay over here until I get 1000+ hours.
Cheers for your info by the way
I was referring to the FAA CPL, and how many hours I may need to build to get the FAA equivalent of the CPL +IR. For example if I need to build another 300 hours just to get my FAA licenses then I may as well stay over here until I get 1000+ hours.
Cheers for your info by the way
I hold a UK ATPL as well as an FAA ATP so I think I have some familiarity with the system(s). The minimum hours required for a UK/JAA/EASA, FAA, Australian & pretty much every other ATPL is 1,500 (with various minima within that 1,500 hours) and requires a skills test. I bet a pound to a penny you *don't* hold an ATPL if you only have 250 hours. A JAA CPL+IR+MCC (with or without passes in the ATPL exams) is not an ATPL, and is not equivalent to an FAA ATP.
Check what's written on your licence.
The minimum hours for a Part 61 (equivalent to the UK's 'self improver/modular' route) FAA Commercial licence is 250 , with various breakdowns within that amount. You shouldn't need 300 hours to get it, just what ever is needed to meet the breakdowns and enough skill to pass a recommendation check for the flight test. Similarly for the Instrument Rating - check what the minimum requirements are then compare them to your log book + enough skill to pass a recommendation and then a check ride.
The instructor rating will require some amount of training (there's a requirement for a certain amount of instruction from an FAA licenced instructor, but it's not much.
The FARs allow for all training done overseas, by an appropriately qualified instructor, to count towards FAA required training. Only instances where a sign-off from an FAA instructor is required has to be given by an FAA instructor.
Check what's written on your licence.
The minimum hours for a Part 61 (equivalent to the UK's 'self improver/modular' route) FAA Commercial licence is 250 , with various breakdowns within that amount. You shouldn't need 300 hours to get it, just what ever is needed to meet the breakdowns and enough skill to pass a recommendation check for the flight test. Similarly for the Instrument Rating - check what the minimum requirements are then compare them to your log book + enough skill to pass a recommendation and then a check ride.
The instructor rating will require some amount of training (there's a requirement for a certain amount of instruction from an FAA licenced instructor, but it's not much.
The FARs allow for all training done overseas, by an appropriately qualified instructor, to count towards FAA required training. Only instances where a sign-off from an FAA instructor is required has to be given by an FAA instructor.
Last edited by Tinstaafl; 12th Nov 2012 at 16:08.
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Apologies Tinstaafl, I forgot to write that it was a "Frozen ATPL" (meaning until you get 1500 hours you can't be legal PIC,) I did write that earlier in the thread but not in my recent post. I did not mean 'equivalent' in terms of hours or experience, just in terms of title, anyway I wasn't clear so I apologize again.
Cheers for your info, all useful stuff
Cheers for your info, all useful stuff
Still not equivalent then. You hold a *Commercial* licence + IR + ATPL theory. You can be legal PIC in public transport operations, but you are limited to PIC in single pilot aircraft. No different to the holder of an FAA Commercial licence + Instrument + ATP theory, for all practical purposes, so that's what you're equivalent to. The whole 'frozen ATPL' language is nothing more than a European (well, it started as a UK thing, I seem to recall) shorthand for CPL+IR+ATPL exams. In recent years it has broadened to often include MCC as well. I also think I remember it started as a marketing & advertising ploy by the CAP509 (integrated, in JAA speak) schools, as a way to improve the perception of what they were selling. I saw it start to happen in Australia too. The idea is no different to someone with a PPL & passes in CPL theory saying that they have a 'Frozen CPL', or a student pilot with passes in the PPL exams having a 'frozen PPL'.
If you're serious about a move to the US - or anywhere away from the European terminology - I strongly suggest you use the correct name for your qualifications. 'fATPL' is a meaningless term here and leaves the impression you're trying to deceive about what level of licence you actually hold. Bear in mind that your ATPL exams & MCC aren't worth anything in the US (except your understanding of the theory will be rather better than a typical CPL candidate here). Only the licence you have been issued counts. Which, by the way, is no different to some one trying to get credits for their ICAO licence(s) to get a UK/JAR/EASA licence. It's much easier going from ICAO to FAA than ICAO to UK/JAR/EASA, though.
If you go to FAA: Home and look for the links to the regulations you can find exactly what hours you need for an FAA CPL & an IR. Pay particular attention to how the cross-country time is defined for each licence & rating - it varies! Part 61 of CFR14 (often referred to as FAR61) is the section you need.
In fact, here's the link to Part 61. Definitions at the beginning, and the requirements for each certificate further down:eCFR — Code of Federal Regulations
If you're serious about a move to the US - or anywhere away from the European terminology - I strongly suggest you use the correct name for your qualifications. 'fATPL' is a meaningless term here and leaves the impression you're trying to deceive about what level of licence you actually hold. Bear in mind that your ATPL exams & MCC aren't worth anything in the US (except your understanding of the theory will be rather better than a typical CPL candidate here). Only the licence you have been issued counts. Which, by the way, is no different to some one trying to get credits for their ICAO licence(s) to get a UK/JAR/EASA licence. It's much easier going from ICAO to FAA than ICAO to UK/JAR/EASA, though.
If you go to FAA: Home and look for the links to the regulations you can find exactly what hours you need for an FAA CPL & an IR. Pay particular attention to how the cross-country time is defined for each licence & rating - it varies! Part 61 of CFR14 (often referred to as FAR61) is the section you need.
In fact, here's the link to Part 61. Definitions at the beginning, and the requirements for each certificate further down:eCFR — Code of Federal Regulations
Last edited by Tinstaafl; 13th Nov 2012 at 03:48.
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Ok so we've established my license is crap, but I haven't been pulling the wool over anyone's eyes, like I said if you bothered to read back through the thread you'll see the first time I wrote 'ATP' instead of 'Frozen' was a few days ago, and I certainly won't be doing that again.....
I agree, it's a way of selling the qualification better and people including myself fall for it. The difference is that here you can be an FO on an A320 with this damn "Frozen ATPL", and obviously in America you can't, which I agree with anyway as it means more experienced guys at the front. I've always known that Airlines seem to need around 1500+ hours before they'll look at you over there, I'm just trying to find a way into US aviation, regardless of what I fly.
Thanks for the link!
I agree, it's a way of selling the qualification better and people including myself fall for it. The difference is that here you can be an FO on an A320 with this damn "Frozen ATPL", and obviously in America you can't, which I agree with anyway as it means more experienced guys at the front. I've always known that Airlines seem to need around 1500+ hours before they'll look at you over there, I'm just trying to find a way into US aviation, regardless of what I fly.
Thanks for the link!
No, I didn't write that your licence was crap. I wrote that it was not an ATP and nor was it the equivalent of an FAA ATP. Your first post in this thread
stated that you hold an ATP. Later, it transpired that you don't, in fact, hold an ATPL, but a CPL. Nothing wrong with that (I held one for years) but it's not an ATPL. You also wrote that your CPL + IR + MCC is the equivalent of an FAA ATP, which it's not. It seems you have (or had) a degree of misunderstanding about the privileges & limitations for these licences, possibly including your own licence.
Your CPL qualifies you to fly as PIC in public transport for *single pilot* certificated aircraft, and SIC in multi-crew types. Much the same as an FAA CPL**. In some ways, slightly better: JAR requires 700 hours for PIC in public transport ops. FAR requires 1200 for IFR Part 135 ops (that's charter/air taxi ops) so you're slightly better off in that respect.
Better you get it sorted out now, than when you're in front of an interviewer who you led to believe in your application that you hold an ATP(L) but who then reads what's printed on your licence. What qualification(s) you actually hold also affects converting to another jurisdiction's licence. What you can or can't do to convert to an FAA depends on your licence & hours. If you held a JAR ATPL like you originally wrote then chances are you have the required hours for an FAA ATP, in which case the conversion is remarkably simple (one theory exam, one checkride that's pretty much like an IR flight test, no instructor recommendation required). Converting a CPL + IR, however, is a bit more complicated & expensive (two checkrides + 2 instructor recommendations + two theory exams *and* the required cross country experience is more specific. The Commercial checkride also involves manoeuvres that just aren't done for any JAR licence so practice will probably be needed for those)
Lots of opportunities for FAA CPLs, even those who don't meet the Part 135 requirements. Aerial survey & photography, para dropping, power & pipeline inspection, VFR Part 135 in some places (500 hrs needed though). Even instructing, which is a cheaper rating to get in the US than in JAR-land.
**There is a rule change coming that affects FAA CPLs that will prevent them being an SIC in airline ops in large aircraft (>12,500 lb MTOW). Can't remember the exact details because it doesn't affect me, but it's either that you'll need to hold an ATP to be an SIC, or you'll need ATP hours with your CPL ie 1500 hrs. CPLs still will be able to be an SIC in >12,500 lb types, but just not in Part 121 air transport ops ie airline stuff. Didn't used to be the case, but this law was enacted as a reaction to a regional airline fatal crash and takes effect over the next couple of years.
Hi Guys
I'm a JAA/EASA ATP holder...
I'm a JAA/EASA ATP holder...
Your CPL qualifies you to fly as PIC in public transport for *single pilot* certificated aircraft, and SIC in multi-crew types. Much the same as an FAA CPL**. In some ways, slightly better: JAR requires 700 hours for PIC in public transport ops. FAR requires 1200 for IFR Part 135 ops (that's charter/air taxi ops) so you're slightly better off in that respect.
Better you get it sorted out now, than when you're in front of an interviewer who you led to believe in your application that you hold an ATP(L) but who then reads what's printed on your licence. What qualification(s) you actually hold also affects converting to another jurisdiction's licence. What you can or can't do to convert to an FAA depends on your licence & hours. If you held a JAR ATPL like you originally wrote then chances are you have the required hours for an FAA ATP, in which case the conversion is remarkably simple (one theory exam, one checkride that's pretty much like an IR flight test, no instructor recommendation required). Converting a CPL + IR, however, is a bit more complicated & expensive (two checkrides + 2 instructor recommendations + two theory exams *and* the required cross country experience is more specific. The Commercial checkride also involves manoeuvres that just aren't done for any JAR licence so practice will probably be needed for those)
Lots of opportunities for FAA CPLs, even those who don't meet the Part 135 requirements. Aerial survey & photography, para dropping, power & pipeline inspection, VFR Part 135 in some places (500 hrs needed though). Even instructing, which is a cheaper rating to get in the US than in JAR-land.
**There is a rule change coming that affects FAA CPLs that will prevent them being an SIC in airline ops in large aircraft (>12,500 lb MTOW). Can't remember the exact details because it doesn't affect me, but it's either that you'll need to hold an ATP to be an SIC, or you'll need ATP hours with your CPL ie 1500 hrs. CPLs still will be able to be an SIC in >12,500 lb types, but just not in Part 121 air transport ops ie airline stuff. Didn't used to be the case, but this law was enacted as a reaction to a regional airline fatal crash and takes effect over the next couple of years.
Last edited by Tinstaafl; 13th Nov 2012 at 17:32.
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You must hold an FAA CPL + IR, or an ATP, to hold an FAA instructor rating.
As far as I was aware you could have a CFI(H) with CPL and FI exam/checkride passes and around 150 hours.
HTC
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Haha well touche' I guess! Read PONTIUS' comment if you don't believe me, I know what I meant but it clearly wasn't the first time I wrote it, but there's no way I would have mixed this up for job purposes. I really appreciate the amount of info you're still providing me haha, despite my obvious lack of broad knowledge!
I think I'll have to put all my eggs in the instructor basket, and hope my license is transferable into an FAA CPL, earlier in this thread someone wrote that you can only convert to a PPL regardless of what license you carry, but I did most of my hours in Goodyear-Arizona and someone I know is going to check if they're transferable........
Found a place in Florida to do an Instructor Course, pre-requisites are:
"FAA Single and Multi-engine Commercial Ratings with a minimum of 15 hours Multi-Engine PIC time." So apart from the multi PIC time I should be ok providing I can somehow get my CPL instead of PPL!
It sounds like there are indeed opportunities for VFR work for a CPL holder, I wouldn't be against any of the things you listed.
Thanks again!
I think I'll have to put all my eggs in the instructor basket, and hope my license is transferable into an FAA CPL, earlier in this thread someone wrote that you can only convert to a PPL regardless of what license you carry, but I did most of my hours in Goodyear-Arizona and someone I know is going to check if they're transferable........
Found a place in Florida to do an Instructor Course, pre-requisites are:
"FAA Single and Multi-engine Commercial Ratings with a minimum of 15 hours Multi-Engine PIC time." So apart from the multi PIC time I should be ok providing I can somehow get my CPL instead of PPL!
It sounds like there are indeed opportunities for VFR work for a CPL holder, I wouldn't be against any of the things you listed.
Thanks again!