FAA certified instrument ground instructor

[Jay_solo]

I know that a Certified IGI (instrument gound instructor) can teach theoretcial knowlege of the instument rating and endorse log books for the written exam. But can they train students in a FlightTraining Device or simulator for the issuance of a FAA instrument rating or during instrument ground training?

thanks

[Check 6]

No, see 14 CFR 61.211-217.

[SNS3Guppy]

Yes. The chief privilege, in fact the only additional privilege above the AGI of the Instrument Ground Instructor (IGI) rating on the Ground Instructor certificate is that it enables the holder to recommend an applicant for the knowledge ("written") exam.

§ 61.215 Ground instructor privileges.

(c) A person who holds an instrument ground instructor rating is authorized to provide:

(1) Ground training in the aeronautical knowledge areas required for the issuance of an instrument rating under this part;

(2) Ground training required for an instrument proficiency check; and

(3) A recommendation for a knowledge test required for the issuance of an instrument rating under this part.

[Jay_solo]

ok, so they cannot do ground training at all using a flight training device or sim? Not talking about flying with the students in the air, just ground training for IR and proficiency training. I ask, because the regs do not specifically say, but people in other forums and Wikipedia mention that they can train in a sim or FTD.

[SNS3Guppy]

ok, so they cannot do ground training at all using a flight training device or sim? Not talking about flying with the students in the air, just ground training for IR and proficiency training. I ask, because the regs do not specifically say, but people in other forums and Wikipedia mention that they can train in a sim or FTD.

Your original question regards whether the holder of a ground instructor certificate with an instrument ground instructor rating on it can conduct ground training in a simulator or flight training device.

The answer, given and quoted in the regulation above, is YES; the ground instructor can do that. The IGI can provide ground instruction for the instrument rating, or for the instrument proficiency check.

[robthree]

Sorry, no you can't.

A ground instructor can provide only ground training, that is theoretical knowledge in preparation for a written test or the required ground component of a recurrent training event.

Not sim training.

Of course anyone could provide such sim training - even a licensed beautician! But the student can only log such time as a requirement for any experience or currency requirements if it is conducted and properly endorsed by a CFI-I.

[SNS3Guppy]

From a FAA Chief Legal Counsel letter of interpretation, stating that simulator instruction CAN be provided by the holder of a Ground Instructor certificate:

FEB. 28, 1980

MRS. M. J. RUTH

Dear Mrs. Ruth:

This is in response to your letter in which you ask what are the appropriate instructor ratings required by the Federal Aviation Regulations for flight instruction in a simulator.
The following regulations provide for the crediting of flight instruction in a simulator toward required flight instruction.
Section 61.65 requires an applicant for an instrument rating to have at least 40 hours of simulated or actual instrument time, of which not more than 20 hours may be instrument instruction by an authorized instructor in an instrument ground trainer acceptable to the Administrator. These 20 hours may be given by ground instructor with an instrument ground instructor rating or by an instrument flight instructor.
Section 61.129(b)(2)(i) requires an applicant for a commercial pilot certificate with an airplane rating to have at least 10 hours of instrument instruction, of which 5 hours must be in flight in airplanes. The 5 hours which may be given in a simulator may only be given by a ground instructor with an instrument ground instructor rating or by an instrument flight instructor.
The appendices of Part 141, Schools and Other Certificated Agencies, allow certain flight training and instruction to be given in a pilot ground trainer that meets the requirements of section 141.41(a)(1) or (2). Section 141.33(a)(3) requires that instructors used for this instruction must hold a flight or ground instructor certificate as appropriate. The appropriate certificates and ratings for instruction in a ground trainer are as follows:
1. For a private pilot certification course (airplanes) [section 3(a) of Appendix A], a ground instructor certificate with any rating or a flight instructor certificate with an airplane rating.
2. For an instrument rating course (airplanes) [section 3 of Appendix C], a ground instructor certificate with an instrument ground instructor rating or a flight instructor certificate with an instrument rating.
3. For a commercial pilot certification course (airplanes) or a commercial test course (airplanes) [section 3 of Appendix D and section 4 of Appendix E], a ground instructor certificate with an advanced ground instructor rating or an instrument ground instructor rating, or a flight instructor certificate with an airplane rating.
We hope this information will be helpful to you.

Sincerely,

EDWARD P. FABERMAN
Acting Assistant Chief Counsel
Regulations and Enforcement Division

[MarkerInbound]

The simple ones first. No, a Ground Instructor does not need to be a pilot. Just 18 years old, R, W, S, and understand English and pass the knowledge test(s).

Now it gets fun. I got my GI certs under Part 143. In the late 1990s there was a major rewrite of 61 and GI stuff was moved there and 143 went away. One of the things in the NPRM is:

"Section 61.223 Ground Instructor Endorsements and Authorizations

This proposed section would list the endorsements and authorizations that a ground instructor could give. A similar section does not appear in part 143."

Note the last sentence, which is probably why Mrs. Ruth wrote her letter. The numbering got off, there were plans to make GI certs category and class specific that didn't happen but we now have 61.215 which post dates the Chief Counsel letter.

So now if we break down 61.215:

c) A person who holds an instrument ground instructor rating is authorized to provide:

(1) Ground training in the aeronautical knowledge areas required for the issuance of an instrument rating under this part;

Aeronautical knowledge is FAA speak for the written test so an IGI can run a ground school class.

(2) Ground training required for an instrument proficiency check; and

Ok, that's great but when you look up a IPC, there's no requirement for any ground training!

(3) A recommendation for a knowledge test required for the issuance of an instrument rating under this part.

Sign, date and put your cert number on the dotted line.

But nothing about any flight proficiency training. So I'd say to the OP, they could but not for the last 10 years or so.

[Peter PanPan]

Interesting thread!

Please keep exchanging views.

[Pilipshen]

IGI Cannot give training in a simulator

SEP 2 4 2010

Dear Mr. Gatlin:

This is in response to your inquiry concerning whether an Advanced Ground Instructor or Instrument Ground Instructor is an "Authorized Instructor," as defined in 14 C.F.R. §61.1 (b)(2), for purposes of giving instrument instruction to candidates for Private Pilot, Instrument Pilot, and Commercial Pilot certificates in a flight simulator, flight training device or advanced aviation training device.
In your letter you base your interpretation of which types of training are permissible for a Advanced Ground Instructor/Instrument Ground Instructor on the definition of an "Authorized Instructor" under 14 C.F.R. §61.1(b)(2). This section states that,
"Authorized Instructor means (i) A person who holds a ground instructor
certificate issued under Part 61 of this chapter and is in compliance with
§61.217, when conducting ground training in accordance with the privileges
and limitations of his or her ground instructor certificate.
(ii) A person who holds a flight instructor certificate issued under Part 61 of
this chapter and is in compliance with §61.217, when conducting ground
training or flight training in accordance with the privileges and limitations of
his or her flight instructor certificate."
In addition, the definition of ground training, in §61.1 (b)(8) is as follows, "Ground training means that training, other than flight training, received from an authorized instructor."

The privileges of a ground instructor are specifically listed in §61.215(b), which states that, "a person who holds an advanced ground instructor rating is authorized to provide: (1) ground training on the aeronautical knowledge areas required for the issuance of any certificate or rating under this part." Section 61.215( c) likewise states that "a person who holds an instrument ground instructor rating is authorized to provide: (1) Ground training in the aeronautical knowledge areas required for the issuance of an instrument rating under this part. "
2 Section 61.215 - Ground Instructor Privileges, is silent regarding whether the privileges of a ground instructor permit supervision of training in a flight simulator or flight training device. As this section is an exhaustive listing of the privileges granted to persons holding ground instructor certificates, the omission of any grant of authority allowing ground instructors to supervise flight training time in a flight simulator or flight training device is evidence that ground instructors are not authorized instructors for purposes of conducting flight training in flight simulators or flight training devices. Therefore, the interpretation of the regulations by the FAA designee is correct, and you would not be permitted to supervise flight training for purposes of logging time toward an instrument rating or pilot certificate.
We trust that the above response addresses your concerns. If you need further assistance, please contact my staff at [phone]. This response was prepared by Neal O'Hara, an Attorney in the Regulations Division of the Office of the Chief Counsel, and was coordinated with the Certification and General Aviation Operations Branch of the Flight Standards Service.
Assistant Chief Counsel for Regulation, AGC-200