piloton

So it's official.... After 12/13/2007 FAA goes 65....

MungoP

MODS...
Weren't there a couple of responses to this which appear to have disappeared ? Or am I really getting too old... or too drunk for this ?

FLCHG

A pilot due to retire at AA or at anyother US airline as of 31st December 2007 due to being 60, may he now remain in his present position (and progress) / airline until his 65th birthday?

piloton

That's right.....

pilotusa

Not quite. The date is December 13, 2007. As soon as the president lifted his pen from the paper, the law took effect and the FAR prohibiting using pilots over 60 became non-existent.

LEMD

Just cuz the law has changed does that mean it will automatically be changed in all collective agreements?

Two_Kids

Who has a contract that requires their pilots to retire at 60?

FLCHG

Thats what I am asking... Is that United Pilot going to get out of his seat upon reaching 60... Will his name be scratched off the seniority list???.... My understanding is , as there is no manadtory retirement age negotiated in the contract he stays.... or as discrimination is illegal in the US, he stays... Any United, AA, Fed Ex, Southwest pilot wishing to comment?

White Owl

You would be correct. Most contract specify when "normal" retirement kicks in. An example would be Age 60 or 25 years, for example.

However, most do not specify a mandatory retirement age, so pilots may work as long as they can maintain qualifications. That's how over 60 pilots managed to return to the F/E panel.

Now, those guys who are still on seniority lists (mostly at FedEx, UPS or other freight operators) may now bid back to their Captain's seats upon the first bid opening.

timbob

Agree Whiteowl: Additionally, some carriers dumped their entire pension obligation on the U.S. government in bankruptcy court, so those "smoking gun" contracts have no retirement language whatsover, at least as far as pensions, etc. are concerned. United, USAir, Continental, Eastern, PanAm, Delta, TWA.......can't type anymore.....

nudger

Excellent news!

Now the contract world will be left without a steady supply of retiring US pilots (Captains) and either up their conditions or promote from within to solve their crewing requirements.

About time.

Glad I'm not a US based F/O though... that would suck!

El Lobo Solo

WWWWWWWWWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! Now I can work another 5 years to make up for all the lost benefits and wage cuts!

Raas767

All you guys working past 60 at major airlines need to look yourselves in the mirror! You are taking money from the guy in the right seat and putting it in your own. Not to mention prolonging furloughs for guys on the street.

JetA

Does this mean that I will have to get my own carts at Walmart?

poorwanderingwun

RAAS...
YOU no doubt will hand in your ATPL at the age of 60 ... just to allow some ambitious little tyke in the right hand seat to get a new view of the ground...
Get used to it.. the 60 yr olds are the baby-boomers who changed the world in the 60s ... they were never going to put up with this 60 yr old retirement crap...

BelArgUSA

By any chance, could you remove your foot from my 02 mask hose... ¿?¿?
Sorry to steal "your wages" until I will hit 65 next November 2008.
xxx
I strapped myself in June 1958 in a J3C-65 Piper Cub, first lesson, age 14...
A few years later it was a F-104G, scared myself a few times.
Then with PanAm, my check-captains were ex P-51 or... C-54, Berlin Airlift 1949...
They had crossed oceans with Loran-A on Stratocruisers and DC-6/7s...
I worshipped them. I cried at their retirement parties, and missed all the experience they gave me.
Sure, flying sideways, I dreamed of a window seat... occasionally could swap seats.
It was a long time before I ended-up in the LH seat of a 747...
Furlough years too, never saw the B-2707s PanAm told me I would fly one day...
Selling used cars, CFI-ing in Learjets, contracts in Jeddah, inviting camels for a dance in the night-clubs.
For a retirement that I never got - (Chapter 7 bankruptcy excuses)...
xxx
With 49 years in the skies, I still fly these old 747s... and often teach old tricks to "PlayStation Graduates"...
Do you think our passengers prefer a 27 years old captain and 300 hrs F/Os...?
And besides... unlike some who use your respectful vocabulary, I do not use the F word.
But thanks for educating me, I reciprocate my best F wishes to you.
May your "gases" be passed by your outflow valve, in a "dry form"...
xxx
Ppruners, my apologies. Had to change "his" diapers, to keep the RH seat clean for decent F/Os...

Happy contrails

White Owl

raas,

Maybe, but we earned it. Your generation is rightly called the "entitlement" generation. You want everything and you want it right now. Perhaps you should earn it like some of the other Gentlemen here.

Personally, I spent 11.5 years on Active Duty. 3.5 years in the Reserves. I flew the panel on 727s and then sat in the right seat for 7 years.

Your time will come. And then, when YOU decide to work until you're 65, YOU can have young whippersnappers bark at you. Because YOU will be stealing THEIR money.

What goes around, comes around, Son.

TangoUniform

If you guys moaning because of delay in upgrade due to this age change, you are really barking up the wrong tree. Maybe you should hope for a bankruptcy, a termination of your defined benifit retirement plan, and 2500 pilots retireing early as they did at Delta. Now that creates movement. Or what you really want is a solid company that has serious expansion plans, that has a secure retirement, that makes it attractive for guys to leave early. Waiting for pilots to retire for you to move up, is not what I would want to hope for.

Rotorhead1026

If a guy (or gal) is able to fly until 65, I certainly don't begrudge the right to do so. He's not taking anything from anyone. Saying otherwise is akin to denying his right to exist.

Does anybody have numbers on how many actually MAKE it to age sixty? Some lose their medicals, others - like me - quit in frustration. My overall (and very unscientific) impression is that most are going to quit well before 65 unless financial circumstances force them to stick around. Also, data on Class One (equivalent) medicals from age 65 countries would be interesting ... how do over 60 pilots fare on these?

Low-Pass

BelArgUSA I lament every time we lose a "good" experienced captain. Sadly, they may grow progressively harder to come by....

Rotorhead1026 They've just improved the life expectancy of pilots from 62 to 67 (i.e. add 2 years to retirement age) with a slash of the pen.