Admiral Lord West Trident demands
Not the first time that a missile test has failed due to range safety equipment failure / operator error by a long shot.
Last edited by MAINJAFAD; 24th Jan 2017 at 06:55.
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I wonder if his documentary security skills have improved since '86?
I've no wish to badmouth a brave and gallant officer but I do wish he'd remained silent on this matter.
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Will some people now want test results for all Trident missile training launches reported to the house of commons?
As I see it the report says HMS Vengeance has successfully completed her post refit work up..
As I see it the report says HMS Vengeance has successfully completed her post refit work up..
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CC my point was the USN has tested a fair number of Tridents, there have been some failed launches, as both navies use the same system, why not report the USN launches as well. I did hear yesterday that there was a group of VIPs watching the launch, so that the press release could be put out.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
You mean like this? They brag about the 161 successful launches - no mention about the failures. But given the limited number of launches per year the failure rate must be below 1%.
Successful Trident II D5 Missile Flight Test Supports Navy Submarine Certification for Strategic Patrol · Lockheed Martin
"...... The missile was converted into a test configuration using a test missile kit produced by Lockheed Martin that contains range safety devices, tracking systems and flight telemetry instrumentation."........
Successful Trident II D5 Missile Flight Test Supports Navy Submarine Certification for Strategic Patrol · Lockheed Martin
"...... The missile was converted into a test configuration using a test missile kit produced by Lockheed Martin that contains range safety devices, tracking systems and flight telemetry instrumentation."........
There's a rather smug radio talk show host on LBC 9.73 FM, his name is James O'Brien, he normally succeeds in getting quite far up my nose and I expected his take on this particular incident/saga to be predictable. But instead, yesterday lunch time he produced a brilliant argument in defence of Theresa May's position on Trident. His criticism was purely reserved for how she floundered like a... well a Flounder on the end of a line. His own suggestion was simple and one I couldn't help but agree with; that is, instead of making yourself look utterly incapable of affording Mr Marr and his wider audience the credibility to spot frantic waffle when its present in overdrive but simply own up. Say, yes I did know, these tests are carried out for this very purpose, to determine whether anything will go wrong and when it does, to resolve the issue.
I would add, that by way of further explanation, to have mentioned this at the time of the Trident Submarine renewal debate may well have unduly prejudiced the debate alarming toward the anti-nuclear sentiments of the Labour front bench.
There, simple
FB
I would add, that by way of further explanation, to have mentioned this at the time of the Trident Submarine renewal debate may well have unduly prejudiced the debate alarming toward the anti-nuclear sentiments of the Labour front bench.
There, simple
FB
Around 358 Trident C-4 and D-5 missiles have be fired in both R&D work and operational tests up to the end of 2015. Total number of failures was 12 (7 of which were C-4's). The 5 D-5 failures were all in the R&D and early operational testing phases (like the first SSBN launch in the video below) and up to the end of 2015, 184 D-5 missiles had been fired, including all of the R&D firings at the start of the program, plus missiles used for ABM target use.
The 161 launches quoted are operational systems tests from SSBN's and this is most likely the first confirmed failure. This gives a failure rate of 0.6% which isn't bad for any guided weapon system
All listed here Trident
The 161 launches quoted are operational systems tests from SSBN's and this is most likely the first confirmed failure. This gives a failure rate of 0.6% which isn't bad for any guided weapon system
All listed here Trident
I'm not sure if I was a potential aggressor that news of a failed missile test would make me anymore likely to 'take a chance' it might happen if the missiles were used in anger.....
There's an awful lot of sunshine that would be potentially be incoming....I guess that deterrence for you?
There's an awful lot of sunshine that would be potentially be incoming....I guess that deterrence for you?
The British American Security Information Council (BASIC) has an interesting take on this. It's worth a read.
The Implications Of The Trident Test Failure | British American Security Information Council
Amongst other things, the author, Paul Ingram, talks about
airsound
The Implications Of The Trident Test Failure | British American Security Information Council
Amongst other things, the author, Paul Ingram, talks about
.... so much irrational fear within Downing Street that puncturing that collective bubble of confidence in the Trident system could lead to mass defections in the forthcoming vote to renew it. They must have known the long term damage this would cause to their reputation ..... It certainly tarnishes the image of a Prime Minister attempting to develop a reputation for straight-talking and openness. Theresa May’s refusal to deny or to clarify the issue yesterday has only made matters worse .... The government could have turned it into an asset by demonstrating its openness. As it is, this episode leaves anyone with an open mind feeling manipulated, and must surely magnify existing cynicism.
Well, if you don't like BASIC, HH, (and I confess I don't always agree with their strictures) - here's what the editor of defense-aerospace.com says in response to the UK MoD statement on the subject.
I believe that what some PPRuNers may be missing is that this a political spat, and not really a military or technical one.
If you're a real sucker for punishment, here's the record of the 'urgent question' to the Sec Def in the House of Commons (and the many answers).
https://hansard.parliament.uk/common...dentTestFiring
airsound
EDITOR’S NOTE: The British government’s “absolute confidence” in the “unquestionable” capability of the Trident missile, is more appropriate to a religion than to a man-made system.
The fact that MoD can claim that HMS Vengeance and her crew were “successfully tested and certified” -- and that the submarine was allowed to return to service -- when its Trident missiles suffered their first failure in 40 years is one of the recurring mysteries of British political life.
The fact that MoD can claim that HMS Vengeance and her crew were “successfully tested and certified” -- and that the submarine was allowed to return to service -- when its Trident missiles suffered their first failure in 40 years is one of the recurring mysteries of British political life.
If you're a real sucker for punishment, here's the record of the 'urgent question' to the Sec Def in the House of Commons (and the many answers).
https://hansard.parliament.uk/common...dentTestFiring
airsound
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From the BBC News Website....
"According to the Sunday Times, an unarmed Trident II D5 missile veered off in the wrong direction towards the US - instead of towards Africa - when it was launched from a British submarine off the coast of Florida."
Perhaps they fed the wrong coordinates into it's navigation hoofer-doofer..... Or maybe they didn't
"According to the Sunday Times, an unarmed Trident II D5 missile veered off in the wrong direction towards the US - instead of towards Africa - when it was launched from a British submarine off the coast of Florida."
Perhaps they fed the wrong coordinates into it's navigation hoofer-doofer..... Or maybe they didn't
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The primary objective of a DASO is to examine the competency of the Boat's Company to safely, successfully and competently launch a missile under simulated operational conditions. It also tests the Boat's Weapon System post Upkeep. A failure in the firing range's telemetry calls for a safety destruction of the missile. It does not invalidate the Boat's DASO and operational fitness. It's an opportunistic exercise in political point scoring and sod all to do with the Andrew's day job nor the effectiveness of the weapon.
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Gather round while I sing you of Wernher von Braun,
A man whose allegiance
Is ruled by expedience.
Call him a Nazi, he won't even frown.
"ha, Nazi sch-mazi," says Wernher von Braun.
Don't say that he's hypocritical,
Say rather that he's apolitical.
"once the rockets are up, who cares where they come down?
That's not my department," says Wernher von Braun.
Tom lehrer
A man whose allegiance
Is ruled by expedience.
Call him a Nazi, he won't even frown.
"ha, Nazi sch-mazi," says Wernher von Braun.
Don't say that he's hypocritical,
Say rather that he's apolitical.
"once the rockets are up, who cares where they come down?
That's not my department," says Wernher von Braun.
Tom lehrer
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HH,
OK, though von Braun perhaps did not care, it was his boss - Walter Dornberger who cared. And whose role in applied rocket science/industry is, IMHO, underestimated (only von Braun's name is in the air). In fact, Dornberger was, using modern terminology, the project manager. He hired young and talented Werner in 1932 who then became his tech. lead for V-2/A4.
OK, though von Braun perhaps did not care, it was his boss - Walter Dornberger who cared. And whose role in applied rocket science/industry is, IMHO, underestimated (only von Braun's name is in the air). In fact, Dornberger was, using modern terminology, the project manager. He hired young and talented Werner in 1932 who then became his tech. lead for V-2/A4.
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he's not "late" - still lives near Santa Cruz I beleive aged 88......
"If, after hearing my songs, just one human being is inspired to say something nasty to a friend, or perhaps to strike a loved one, it will all have been worth the while."
"If, after hearing my songs, just one human being is inspired to say something nasty to a friend, or perhaps to strike a loved one, it will all have been worth the while."