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Old 7th Jan 2017, 10:53   #21 (permalink)
 
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Don't know if it's the well known one but will this do ?

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Old 7th Jan 2017, 10:55   #22 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tankertrashnav
So you can see, whatever the original intention, in its WW2 form the Iron Cross was far from classless, and you can bet there were no gefreiters wearing the Knight's Cross in any of its variations.
ISTR that one had to 'move up the ladder' with the Iron Cross, i.e. You couldn't get the Knight's Cross unless you had already been awarded the 1st Class [etc etc]. I believe there were a few exceptions, however.

I wish I could recall which book I was reading when I saw that ... something on tanks on the Eastern front?

(EDIT = Thank you Wiki ... "The Iron Cross 1st Class and the Iron Cross 2nd Class were awarded without regard to rank. One had to possess the 2nd Class already in order to receive the 1st Class (though in some cases both could be awarded simultaneously)."

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Originally Posted by handsfree
Don't know if it's the well known one but will this do ?
They're lightweights ... nothing on their trouser legs, for a start!
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Old 7th Jan 2017, 12:03   #23 (permalink)
 
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Quote:

They're lightweights ... nothing on their trouser legs, for a start!
I'd hate to put that jacket through the Dry-Cleaners.
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Old 7th Jan 2017, 16:27   #24 (permalink)
 
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That's the one, handsfree
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Old 7th Jan 2017, 17:57   #25 (permalink)
 
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76 Gefreite decorated with the Iron Cross, according to this:

Die Träger des Ritterkreuzes des Eisernen Kreuzes 1939 - 1945

All ranks listed here:

Die Träger des Ritterkreuzes des Eisernen Kreuzes 1939 - 1945

With "Eichenlaub" (oak leaves) - lowest rank were NCOs - out of 516 ICs only 26 were given to soldiers ranking below lieutenant

Die Träger des Ritterkreuzes des Eisernen Kreuzes 1939 - 1945

With "Schwerter" (Swords) Only one non commissioned officer received one, Luftwaffe, after 99 kills on the eastern front...

Die Träger des Ritterkreuzes des Eisernen Kreuzes 1939 - 1945

With "Brillianten" (diamonds) - lowest rank lieutenant

Die Träger des Ritterkreuzes des Eisernen Kreuzes 1939 - 1945
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Old 7th Jan 2017, 18:30   #26 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by reds & greens View Post
I'd hate to put that jacket through the Dry-Cleaners.
The real problem would be putting them all back in the right order

Do I see a few a slopping shoulders not to mention shoddy drill
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Old 7th Jan 2017, 20:08   #27 (permalink)
 
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Do I see a few a slopping shoulders not to mention shoddy drill
Let's be honest, I don't think that's just the North Koreans
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Old 7th Jan 2017, 22:53   #28 (permalink)
 
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His dudeness - I stand corrected that there were awards of the Knights Cross to lower ranks. However 76 out of just over 7,300 awarded means that almost 99% went to officers, so my general point that in WW2 at least the addition of these higher grades of the Iron Cross meant it was no longer an all ranks award, in the accepted understanding of what that term means.
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Old 8th Jan 2017, 08:37   #29 (permalink)
 
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More Generals of the Korean People's Army - including the legendary General Gong-on-Dong?

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Old 8th Jan 2017, 10:17   #30 (permalink)
 
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@ His dudeness ... thanks for posting those links.
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Old 8th Jan 2017, 10:52   #31 (permalink)
 
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That is one of the best comments I have seen on PPRuNe, Beags.

Absolutely priceless.

May I suggest Beags gets an award in the next honours list for "services to humour".
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Old 8th Jan 2017, 13:01   #32 (permalink)
 
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three well-known awards to SOE operatives Odette Sansom, Violette Szabo and Nora Inayat Khan (the last two posthumous)
Noor Inayat Khan
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Old 8th Jan 2017, 16:06   #33 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by finncapt View Post

May I suggest Beags gets an award in the next honours list for "services to humour".
His nomination was rejected after his post in the thread on bodily functions.
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Old 8th Jan 2017, 21:10   #34 (permalink)
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Interestingly there is an obituary today for John Gregson, an apprentice at the age of 19 swan 600 yards with an injured colleague. He was awarded a GC.
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Old 9th Jan 2017, 09:45   #35 (permalink)
 
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In 1977 or thereabouts I met Jack Bamford, who in 1952 became the youngest recipient of the George Cross at the age of 15, for rescuing several members of his family from a fire at their house. He was badly burned, and still carried the scars on his arms and face 25 years later.

olympus - you are correct, I was misled by the fact that she sometimes used the pseudonym Nora Baker, an extension of Ora Baker, her American mother's name, and I suspect she was known as Nora during her WAAF service.
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Old 9th Jan 2017, 10:53   #36 (permalink)


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I think Noor means 'Diamond' in Hindi.
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Old 9th Jan 2017, 11:02   #37 (permalink)
 
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How about some of the BOAC pilots who operated the Swedish "ball bearing run" during WW2? Very few gongs or recognition despite a casualty rate not far off RAF ops. And no, not just in speedy Mosquitoes; much of the traffic was in Whitleys, Venturas, all by legal necessity completely unarmed.

Edit: ditto for merchant navy...vast majority, nada. Even on a convoy with disastrous loss rate - unless carrying munitions. For instance, carrying wooden rifle butts qualified crew for medals but hold full of aviation fuel stored in foil lined hardboard cases didn't!

Last edited by ShotOne; 9th Jan 2017 at 14:44.
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Old 9th Jan 2017, 13:23   #38 (permalink)
 
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I was once nommed for an Air Medal, but it got downgraded to an ass chewing in lieu of first award. Does that count?
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Old 9th Jan 2017, 14:23   #39 (permalink)
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LW, indeed as I expect a few posthumous bravery awards might have merited a hats on interview had they survived.
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Old 9th Jan 2017, 23:32   #40 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Edit: ditto for merchant navy...vast majority, nada. Even on a convoy with disastrous loss rate - unless carrying munitions. For instance, carrying wooden rifle butts qualified crew for medals but hold full of aviation fuel stored in foil lined hardboard cases didn't!
I am not sure if you are referring to gallantry medals or campaign medals, but in the case of the latter, the Merchant Navy was entitled to the same campaign medals and stars as the Royal Navy, with similar periods and areas of qualification. The type of cargo being carried was not a factor.

I have only ever physically seen a few groups of WW2 medals which contained the then maximum of five campaign stars, and they were all to Merchant Navy recipients, who tended to "get around" more than their RN equivalents. I suspect that with the introduction of the Arctic Star in recent years there will a few six star Merchant Navy groups around.
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