Death of the Airshow?
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Sywell has now cancelled too, and that supported the air ambulance service.
A fascinating post off
http://forum.keypublishing.com/showt...ncements/page1
SO SIGN THE PETITION PLEASE
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/120628
This will have a knock on effect to the military airshows and maybe even the BBMFs survival, think about it, if a lot of airshows are priced out of existence where are you going to display the BBMF or the Reds? Once a year at Cosford? You then have problems justifying their military budgets as the airshow circuit dries up.
It also all has a knock on effect, without a plethora of airshows to offset the costs of owning and maintaining warbirds, owners will simply not be able to afford the operating costs, and sell off their aircraft, ( something that is already happening with some of the changes maintenance wise that has been foisted on them of late ) this will then in turn lead to a further demise of airshows as the acts are no longer in place to support them. And let's face it, the likes of Cosford would then be a pretty short show if you took the civilian side out of it, and who would pay to see that.
Shows cancelled so far
http://forum.keypublishing.com/showt...l-Airshow-2016
..
A fascinating post off
http://forum.keypublishing.com/showt...ncements/page1
This from Mark Jefferies - Display Pilot ( Organiser of annual Children In need Dispaly, Little Gransden)
Authority and responsibility
Is the over reaction based upon advice from Lawyers that said you are (CAA) liable?
CAA cashed the cheque, read the application, looked at the organisers submitted map and issued their own map and air show permission.
CAA looked at the list of submitted acts/ aircraft on the application and issued the permission.
CAA cashed the cheque and certified the aircraft.
CAA cashed the cheque and issued the DA
CAA cashed the cheque and issued a "Aircraft Type Rating Exemption" for permission to fly an aircraft "without being the holder of an appropriate type rating". (This is to do with Permit to Fly jet aircraft)
CAA approved (dont know if there is a fee involved) the DAE to act on their behalf
CAA cashed the cheque and granted the AME a licence to medicaly evaluate pilots
So, to reduce liability you pass the buck. i.e. make everyone else liable except yourself
To reduce the risk you reduce the number of shows
To reduce the number of qualified pilots you make it an unattractive profession
With reducing the number of shows increases the cost burden on those remaining (CAA will only reluctantly and slowly reduce staffing as managers need people to manage-pay structure etc)
With costs increasing it will be like a J curve on those remaining
All this has happened once before in history. People cut down the trees to move the giant heads (Easter Island) with no trees they could not support themselves and as a race they slowly but surely died out. Returning the island to a barren landscape
Is this the intended future our CAA would like?
There is a very significant industry with many jobs created in the UK restoring very historic aircraft for future genarations, lest we forget why these aircraft were built in the first place. The end user (temporary owner) recovers a small amount of his ownership costs flying air shows. Has the CAA done a projected jobs lost analysis of there proposed actions?
Authority without responsibility.
There are some sencible suggestions in the document but it does not justify 100% + cost in fees and an aditional post show tax.
Be it in this instance (Shoreham) or a multitude of other unfortunate disasters we (as a body and country) should all be on the same side pulling together for the better of everybody.
Authority and responsibility
Is the over reaction based upon advice from Lawyers that said you are (CAA) liable?
CAA cashed the cheque, read the application, looked at the organisers submitted map and issued their own map and air show permission.
CAA looked at the list of submitted acts/ aircraft on the application and issued the permission.
CAA cashed the cheque and certified the aircraft.
CAA cashed the cheque and issued the DA
CAA cashed the cheque and issued a "Aircraft Type Rating Exemption" for permission to fly an aircraft "without being the holder of an appropriate type rating". (This is to do with Permit to Fly jet aircraft)
CAA approved (dont know if there is a fee involved) the DAE to act on their behalf
CAA cashed the cheque and granted the AME a licence to medicaly evaluate pilots
So, to reduce liability you pass the buck. i.e. make everyone else liable except yourself
To reduce the risk you reduce the number of shows
To reduce the number of qualified pilots you make it an unattractive profession
With reducing the number of shows increases the cost burden on those remaining (CAA will only reluctantly and slowly reduce staffing as managers need people to manage-pay structure etc)
With costs increasing it will be like a J curve on those remaining
All this has happened once before in history. People cut down the trees to move the giant heads (Easter Island) with no trees they could not support themselves and as a race they slowly but surely died out. Returning the island to a barren landscape
Is this the intended future our CAA would like?
There is a very significant industry with many jobs created in the UK restoring very historic aircraft for future genarations, lest we forget why these aircraft were built in the first place. The end user (temporary owner) recovers a small amount of his ownership costs flying air shows. Has the CAA done a projected jobs lost analysis of there proposed actions?
Authority without responsibility.
There are some sencible suggestions in the document but it does not justify 100% + cost in fees and an aditional post show tax.
Be it in this instance (Shoreham) or a multitude of other unfortunate disasters we (as a body and country) should all be on the same side pulling together for the better of everybody.
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/120628
This will have a knock on effect to the military airshows and maybe even the BBMFs survival, think about it, if a lot of airshows are priced out of existence where are you going to display the BBMF or the Reds? Once a year at Cosford? You then have problems justifying their military budgets as the airshow circuit dries up.
It also all has a knock on effect, without a plethora of airshows to offset the costs of owning and maintaining warbirds, owners will simply not be able to afford the operating costs, and sell off their aircraft, ( something that is already happening with some of the changes maintenance wise that has been foisted on them of late ) this will then in turn lead to a further demise of airshows as the acts are no longer in place to support them. And let's face it, the likes of Cosford would then be a pretty short show if you took the civilian side out of it, and who would pay to see that.
Shows cancelled so far
http://forum.keypublishing.com/showt...l-Airshow-2016
..
Last edited by NutLoose; 9th Feb 2016 at 23:30.
Sywell cancelled
Sywell airshow
Barton cancelled
Barton air show
Reds cancel Torquay Regatta after 28 years...
Reds cancel
Sywell airshow
Barton cancelled
Barton air show
Reds cancel Torquay Regatta after 28 years...
Reds cancel
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
BBMF does a fair number of non air show events and probably not as dependent as the Reds.
As well as air show cancellations and the expense of maintaining warbirds, there is a whole industry out there with professional display teams and the industry support.
One event that could lose it display element it Battle Proms. Each event has one display by one Spitfire. The audience is necessarily small compared with an air show so the per capita increase could be huge. As the air element is a minor aspect the obvious thing is to cancel it. That would then put another war bird at risk.
As well as air show cancellations and the expense of maintaining warbirds, there is a whole industry out there with professional display teams and the industry support.
One event that could lose it display element it Battle Proms. Each event has one display by one Spitfire. The audience is necessarily small compared with an air show so the per capita increase could be huge. As the air element is a minor aspect the obvious thing is to cancel it. That would then put another war bird at risk.
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Llandudno cancelled
Llandudno Air Show 2016 cancelled due to safety changes - BBC News
The DH Club Moth Rally at Woburn Cancelled
Moths at Woburn
Who next?
http://www.peoplesmosquito.org.uk/20...he-uk-airshow/
Llandudno Air Show 2016 cancelled due to safety changes - BBC News
The DH Club Moth Rally at Woburn Cancelled
Moths at Woburn
Who next?
http://www.peoplesmosquito.org.uk/20...he-uk-airshow/
Rob Feeley on 6th Feb, 2016 at 17:54 said: UKAR have just tweeted that only 75 letters have been received by the CAA. Everyone must contact them
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Petition signed.
I don't go to air shows but do enjoy the Battle Prom sequence and our own Spitfire display at East Kirkby each year. I would miss both and of course the regular displays over my house.
I don't go to air shows but do enjoy the Battle Prom sequence and our own Spitfire display at East Kirkby each year. I would miss both and of course the regular displays over my house.
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It was cost and the uncertainty of the weather which killed Woburn for the Moth Club, not the CAA airshow fees. The Moth Club announced the demise of Woburn long before the CAA announced the hike in its fees.
Wonder how the CAA people are getting on at the BADA/CAA/MAA conference at Shrivenham today?
Wonder how the CAA people are getting on at the BADA/CAA/MAA conference at Shrivenham today?
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Ask what the purpose of an Air Show is.
Is it to raise awareness, understanding and air mindedness amongst the non-aviation community?
Is it to encourage the youth to fly or be involved in flying?
Is it to raise much-needed funds for charities various?
Is it to give something that's value-for-money back to the taxpayer for their ritual salary deduction?
Is it to showcase the skill and professionalism of our military and civilian pilots and entertain in the process?
I think it's all of these and more.
We are literally standing on a precipice of change that will remove every bit of goodness in that list. Forever. Once gone, it will be inordinately harder to reinstate Air Shows in future.
If the CAA are on these forums, please get a grip on reality. Did we stop doing Air Shows after Ramstein? No. We took stock of what went wrong and put defence mechanisms in place to make them safer. Don't use liability and reputation to drive up beaurocracy and cost and kill them off. That's weak and feeble.
Is it to raise awareness, understanding and air mindedness amongst the non-aviation community?
Is it to encourage the youth to fly or be involved in flying?
Is it to raise much-needed funds for charities various?
Is it to give something that's value-for-money back to the taxpayer for their ritual salary deduction?
Is it to showcase the skill and professionalism of our military and civilian pilots and entertain in the process?
I think it's all of these and more.
We are literally standing on a precipice of change that will remove every bit of goodness in that list. Forever. Once gone, it will be inordinately harder to reinstate Air Shows in future.
If the CAA are on these forums, please get a grip on reality. Did we stop doing Air Shows after Ramstein? No. We took stock of what went wrong and put defence mechanisms in place to make them safer. Don't use liability and reputation to drive up beaurocracy and cost and kill them off. That's weak and feeble.
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Trouble is they just do not see it is a double edged sword, put up the cost of a show prohibitively forcing them to cancel and you will see owners simply deciding to get out of the business and sell off their aircraft because the revenue stream that makes it viable to operate these aircraft by offsetting some of the costs by displaying them disappears, result,
Company owning the aircraft go
Company operating the aircraft go
Company maintaining the aircraft go
Companies supporting the Aircraft maintenance companies go
Air shows Go
Companies supporting the air shows go
And all the CAA REVENUE from all of those Companies goes too and I bet that amount will far exceed the £120K they are trying to generate through these new charges.
Plus all the jobs that will be lost, and everything that entails.
Company owning the aircraft go
Company operating the aircraft go
Company maintaining the aircraft go
Companies supporting the Aircraft maintenance companies go
Air shows Go
Companies supporting the air shows go
And all the CAA REVENUE from all of those Companies goes too and I bet that amount will far exceed the £120K they are trying to generate through these new charges.
Plus all the jobs that will be lost, and everything that entails.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Is it to raise awareness, understanding and air mindedness amongst the non-aviation community?
Is it to encourage the youth to fly or be involved in flying?
Is it to raise much-needed funds for charities various?
Is it to give something that's value-for-money back to the taxpayer for their ritual salary deduction?
Is it to showcase the skill and professionalism of our military and civilian pilots and entertain in the process?
Is it to encourage the youth to fly or be involved in flying?
Is it to raise much-needed funds for charities various?
Is it to give something that's value-for-money back to the taxpayer for their ritual salary deduction?
Is it to showcase the skill and professionalism of our military and civilian pilots and entertain in the process?
As the number of military shows is near vanishing point the RAF is hugely dependent on civilian shows which are much more commercial shows, even the 'free' ones where the pay off is tourism.
It really is a lose-lose situation and CAA will probably replace licence money lost with jobs lost
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The problem is the funding model that the government chose for the CAA. Costs have to be covered by the aviation industry. But the CAA exists to make aviation safe for every person who flies in or lives underneath a G registered aircraft. So "the public" should cover the CAA's costs.
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Herne Bay now under threat over the charges
New fees 'huge threat' to Herne Bay Air Show's future | Canterbury Times
Bridgenorth Wings and Wheels cancelled due to News Paper saying it was an air show
https://www.facebook.com/Bridgnorth-...27586080871030
Remember without all of these shows how long will the BBMF and Red Arrows survive.
Links to write to your MP's BELOW, and please Email the CAA
please comment
CAA 2016/17 Statutory Air Display and Low Flying Permission Charges Consultation
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/120628
Write to your MP. Template Letter -and how to do it. CAA Airshow Charges etc....
New fees 'huge threat' to Herne Bay Air Show's future | Canterbury Times
Bridgenorth Wings and Wheels cancelled due to News Paper saying it was an air show
https://www.facebook.com/Bridgnorth-...27586080871030
THIS EVENT IS NOW CANCELLED. Owing to the Express and Star and the Shropshire Star using the words 'Air Show' in their report of the new venue the local villagers have been in uproar, and Roy, who, naturally, does not wish to upset his neighbours has cancelled. The event never was an 'Air Show' not even a Fly-in, we would have had a handful of invited light aircraft owners land, and that is all. The event was planned more on the scale of a large village Fete, but now this is not to be, and the charities involved will have to look elsewhere to raise money.
Links to write to your MP's BELOW, and please Email the CAA
please comment
CAA 2016/17 Statutory Air Display and Low Flying Permission Charges Consultation
https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/120628
Write to your MP. Template Letter -and how to do it. CAA Airshow Charges etc....
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Torbay Airshow now losing the Red Arrows
Torbay Royal Regatta says the Red Arrows are too busy to appear this year after 30 years of displays at the event.
"The Red Arrows have a very hectic programme over the summer and a lot of organisations, air displays and regattas all bid for them and they are oversubscribed," said regatta spokesman Julian Chandler. The Red Arrows are yet to comment.
"The Red Arrows have a very hectic programme over the summer and a lot of organisations, air displays and regattas all bid for them and they are oversubscribed," said regatta spokesman Julian Chandler. The Red Arrows are yet to comment.
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Add Little Gransden to the list of possibly ceasing
Little Gransden Air & Car Show 2016
BBC Local Live: Cambridgeshire on Thursday, 11 February 2016 - BBC News
Little Gransden Air & Car Show 2016
The CAA paperwork takes approximately 30 minutes to issue. £1497 is extortionate but £6994 is eye watering.
we have been running our show since 1992 and have raised over £300,000 for charity over the years - including a whopping £60,558 for Children in Need in 2015!
One of the organisers of The Little Gransden Air and Car Show has warned that this year's event on 28 August could be their last. Dave Polie says a rise in insurance costs and flying permits means they're paying out about £9,000 just in fees.
There is little, if any point in targeting the CAA for criticism in this case. The Government, or more specifically, G Osborne esq. is raising indirect taxes/reducing services in all areas, the CAA is just one. This is surprising only in as much as people appear surprised, and if the final outcome is less air shows then George is happy because CAA staff numbers/costs can be reduced even further, thus saving him more money.
'It is not the role of the state to provide or support air shows' would be his line. Watch this space as things are unlikely to get better, am just disappointed that so many of our Conservative MP's seem happy to go along with this.
'It is not the role of the state to provide or support air shows' would be his line. Watch this space as things are unlikely to get better, am just disappointed that so many of our Conservative MP's seem happy to go along with this.
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connoisseur and HH
The CAA does not cost Osborne a bean .. all CAA costs are paid by the aviation industry. The group makes a profit and has £millions in retained earnings.
The CAA does not cost Osborne a bean .. all CAA costs are paid by the aviation industry. The group makes a profit and has £millions in retained earnings.