The Queen strips an Army Major of his MC
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Roadster, neither proposing or recommending, but offering an informed opinion. Hopefully it has changed now but we had one officer to Strike who would send out confidential documents but omit the grading.
Nutty, you surely jest. The MoD is one of the slowest adopters of new technology. They wait for at least 12 months before considering a change. I don't know the OS being used but suspect OS 7.
With the network the PC storage will be at the data centre so reasonably secure a nd USB disabled.
Nutty, you surely jest. The MoD is one of the slowest adopters of new technology. They wait for at least 12 months before considering a change. I don't know the OS being used but suspect OS 7.
With the network the PC storage will be at the data centre so reasonably secure a nd USB disabled.
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a RESTRICTED copy of say, routine orders offers very low level intelligence, but intelligence none the less.
RESTRICTED doesnt exist any more...
link
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VR, RTFQ, we were discussing the galloping major and his computer from 5 years ago. We were not discussing security today.
IIRC a security evasion was to remove the classification (for the purist nothing is classified anymore), email the document home, then reinstate the grading.
PS
Roadster is not in UK nor subject to UK rules.
IIRC a security evasion was to remove the classification (for the purist nothing is classified anymore), email the document home, then reinstate the grading.
PS
Roadster is not in UK nor subject to UK rules.
Thank you Vin for that link. Interesting that Restricted and Confidential don't exist anymore. Keen MoD watchers will KNOW that this will be used as an excuse to burn embarrassing Restricted and Confidential papers!
The new regs seem comprehensive but, as ever, the implementation will be variable simply because MoD doesn't have the resources.
I agree with other posters about people holding MoD papers of whatever classification on home PCs. In the late 90s it was common to be instructed to conduct entire programmes at home, in the evening and at weekends, and the raft of files this meant carrying back and forth, and electronic versions on PCs, was completely ignored. Especially after the move to AbbeyWood. Security was laughable, with contractors who were bidding for work being given blanket access to our new IT system. Each time I left a job I simply asked IT to give me a backup of all my work and they handed me a CD. This was in effect the main backup, because ABW's own backup system failed regularly, with years of data lost at a stroke. I retain all my home e-mail backups going back to when I first got a PC and I'm pretty sure if I dug deep enough I've got many e-mails FROM MoD referring to secret and devious subjects. I once asked if I was liable if I didn't delete it securely and they said no, the MoD sender was. But I'm not sure they understood the question. A nightmare.
The new regs seem comprehensive but, as ever, the implementation will be variable simply because MoD doesn't have the resources.
I agree with other posters about people holding MoD papers of whatever classification on home PCs. In the late 90s it was common to be instructed to conduct entire programmes at home, in the evening and at weekends, and the raft of files this meant carrying back and forth, and electronic versions on PCs, was completely ignored. Especially after the move to AbbeyWood. Security was laughable, with contractors who were bidding for work being given blanket access to our new IT system. Each time I left a job I simply asked IT to give me a backup of all my work and they handed me a CD. This was in effect the main backup, because ABW's own backup system failed regularly, with years of data lost at a stroke. I retain all my home e-mail backups going back to when I first got a PC and I'm pretty sure if I dug deep enough I've got many e-mails FROM MoD referring to secret and devious subjects. I once asked if I was liable if I didn't delete it securely and they said no, the MoD sender was. But I'm not sure they understood the question. A nightmare.
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Any men in black Omegas knocking at the door Tucumseh and asking for their secrets back yet?
Any men in black Omegas knocking at the door Tucumseh and asking for their secrets back yet?
gr4techie
Wasn't there a Fairey Battle with a crew of 3... The 2 commissioned got a posthumous VC while the LAC rear gunner did not?
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The way the man was treated by the newspapers and media was disgraceful. He didn't deserve that. I couldn't even be bothered to pry into the story. So he received a medal which later was withdrawn, its not, in the present scheme of things, a big deal. Hope he has gone outside and moved on with his life, quite frankly.
12 Sqn Fairey Battle, 12 May 1940. 6 Battles were tasked to bomb bridges over the Albert Canal. Fg Off Garland pilot, Sgt Gray Navigator, LAC Reynolds was the Gunner. Apparently, LAC Reynolds was deemed to have "not been in a decision making position".
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LAC Reynolds only option would have been to bail out, and be Court Martialled for cowardice. Sad but true ...the guys at the front earn the medals on these occasions. I think things got better for the AG fraternity later, when they were being stitched by Luftwaffe night fighters [and other hairy events in those dark skies over Occupied Europe].
As for the former RA major ... on a scale of 1>>TotalPrat, I think I know where he sits.
As for the former RA major ... on a scale of 1>>TotalPrat, I think I know where he sits.
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MPN, As BEagle keeps telling us, no stick no vote. Many aircraft captains were awarded gongs with the SLF rarely recognized. I wonder who did the citations as they were probably not present.
So he received a medal which later was withdrawn, its not, in the present scheme of things, a big deal
I personally have no sympathy whatsoever for the man - I think he deserves all the public contempt that has been heaped upon him.
The classified document business I think is totally irrelevant to the false claim for the MC, and I have no comment to make about that.
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A very interesting debate about crew members who were undeniably present yet not fufilling a role that ultimately determined where the aircraft went, nor what it did.
How would this line of thought run if we were talking about a warship? Should the entire crew earn an award in similar circumstances?
Not designed to be inflammatory - more a useful extrapolation.
How would this line of thought run if we were talking about a warship? Should the entire crew earn an award in similar circumstances?
Not designed to be inflammatory - more a useful extrapolation.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
TTN, done.
Orca, that would have been relevant to my father in law. I don't think any gongs were awarded as the action was a disaster where his force illuminated his ship and they in turn illuminated the flag ship. The Germans sank both.
There were lots of brave actions that night, including another destroyer that remained to rescue survivors. As it was wartime and a major disaster late in the war it was played down.
To answer your question, say a collective award like Malta GC, or perhaps issue MiD to everyone that didn't qualify for the major award.
I knew a nav rad who had an MiD. I don't know the circumstances but he was on 543 and did post-Grapple sampling etc etc. I must try and find if my uncle, who was mentioned in Wynn' s book got one.
Orca, that would have been relevant to my father in law. I don't think any gongs were awarded as the action was a disaster where his force illuminated his ship and they in turn illuminated the flag ship. The Germans sank both.
There were lots of brave actions that night, including another destroyer that remained to rescue survivors. As it was wartime and a major disaster late in the war it was played down.
To answer your question, say a collective award like Malta GC, or perhaps issue MiD to everyone that didn't qualify for the major award.
I knew a nav rad who had an MiD. I don't know the circumstances but he was on 543 and did post-Grapple sampling etc etc. I must try and find if my uncle, who was mentioned in Wynn' s book got one.
How would this line of thought run if we were talking about a warship? Should the entire crew earn an award in similar circumstances?
Unit citations are mainly an American idea, although these have been awarded to British Forces, notably the Glosters, who were awarded theirs in Korea by the Americans and subsequently wore a blue patch on their uniforms to commemorate the fact.
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With regard to awarding a medal to the whole ships company, battalion or every aircrew member for bravery in action, then,
To quote from 'The Gondoliers'
'When everyone is somebody, then no one's anybody.'
As for the ex major, deserved all he got!
To quote from 'The Gondoliers'
'When everyone is somebody, then no one's anybody.'
As for the ex major, deserved all he got!
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Goudie. While that seems true, consider, everyone that serves in the theatre gets a medal. Some, closer to the action, get a rosette as well.
Where a unit is in action, say HMS Liverpool in the Med, then there is a world of difference between my aunt serving in Cairo and in action at sea. If the captain be deemed worthy of an honour so too should all the followers. Drawing lots might satisfy the top needy but cheese off the indians. I know, been there at both ends. The last had this young woman 'attack' me spitting feathers.
Rosettes, bars, MiD oak leaf or whatever would signify special service.
Where a unit is in action, say HMS Liverpool in the Med, then there is a world of difference between my aunt serving in Cairo and in action at sea. If the captain be deemed worthy of an honour so too should all the followers. Drawing lots might satisfy the top needy but cheese off the indians. I know, been there at both ends. The last had this young woman 'attack' me spitting feathers.
Rosettes, bars, MiD oak leaf or whatever would signify special service.
There are precedents for giving everyone who participates in a battle either a medal or a clasp. The Waterloo Medal was given to every soldier of the British Army (including Kings German Legion) who took part in any or all of the Battles of Ligny, Quatre Bras or Waterloo. The Navy gave a clasp for each action any sailor or marine took part in to be attached to the ribbon of the Naval General Service Medal (231 separate clasps were issued). If that had been perpetuated, then clasps for participation in each action for which a Battle Honour was awarded could perhaps have been issued. However, except for Nelson who was awarded the clasp for Trafalgar, clasps have not been awarded posthumously.