Sense of Humo(u)r failure?
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Sense of Humo(u)r failure?
Apologies if already covered. Didn't see it posted.
I understand tradition and this can lead to copycat/one upmanship attempts, but c'mon.
Other than some additional marching/serious shouting at, is it that serious? Looks like a bored squaddie that can be cured with some remedial 'adult' language.
Completely unknowing about what the soldier's record actually is, so maybe this was his last chance. But if not...
Dancing Buckingham Palace Guard Faces Prison for Protocol Breach
And yes, I would not be amused to see our equivalent - The Old Guard at the Tomb of the Unknown - doing such.
But correcting such with formal punishment for a first infraction?
I understand tradition and this can lead to copycat/one upmanship attempts, but c'mon.
Other than some additional marching/serious shouting at, is it that serious? Looks like a bored squaddie that can be cured with some remedial 'adult' language.
Completely unknowing about what the soldier's record actually is, so maybe this was his last chance. But if not...
Dancing Buckingham Palace Guard Faces Prison for Protocol Breach
And yes, I would not be amused to see our equivalent - The Old Guard at the Tomb of the Unknown - doing such.
But correcting such with formal punishment for a first infraction?
Discipline dear boy, discipline. If a soldier lacks the integrity of self discipline, it is for the Army to instil it in him whilst at the same time letting others know that indiscipline will not be tolerated. He knew full well that what he was doing was wrong and therefore it is for him to suffer the consequences. You, by your very words, say you would not be amused if this were to happen at the Tomb of the Unknown - I am equally unamused at this individual bringing my Nations Armed Forces reputation into disrepute, his actions in a high profile position in the public eye should have been beyond reproach. I have no sympathy.
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No argument against "discipline" and/or punishment for breaking the rules.
Proportionality and/or informal discipline as a better method than a court-martial?
In the larger picture, I guess I see more and more an inability for leadership's discretion on how to handle buffoonery rather than going the 'full Monty' with military legal proceedings.
In the old days, some 'wall to wall' counseling saved many a good soldier/airman from a bit of stupidity ending a career.
Proportionality and/or informal discipline as a better method than a court-martial?
In the larger picture, I guess I see more and more an inability for leadership's discretion on how to handle buffoonery rather than going the 'full Monty' with military legal proceedings.
In the old days, some 'wall to wall' counseling saved many a good soldier/airman from a bit of stupidity ending a career.
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As a Canadian, let me see if Ive got this right, its OK for one of the Royal family children to run around nude with a bunch of Hookers whilst representing the UK on exchange as an officer with a foriegn airforce, but dare a non- member of the inbred English elite shows a bit of bad judjment you all want to crucify him? Canada moves ever closer to becoming a Republic every time this sort of crap makes the news!
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My dear Clunckdriver. It is the duty of young male royalty to run around naked, bedding wenches and generally being a cad - for a while at least. It is the role of a Guardsman to act like one.
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What is informal discipline? Code Red? He will not be court martialled. He will be dealt with summarily at unit level by his CO who can award 21 days and forfeiture of pay.
There goes his LSGC. Yes, amusing to watch but what does it say to the public about the standards of discipline and responsibility in his regiment and the UK armed forces? He has broken the code and has no honour! He'll regret his idiocy when he gets to MCTC.
There goes his LSGC. Yes, amusing to watch but what does it say to the public about the standards of discipline and responsibility in his regiment and the UK armed forces? He has broken the code and has no honour! He'll regret his idiocy when he gets to MCTC.
Proportionality and/or informal discipline as a better method than a court-martial?
Sorry Clockwork Mouse, you beat me to it!
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He will be dealt with summarily at unit level by his CO who can award 21 days and forfeiture of pay.
I assumed that taking money took a formal court-martial which would be OTT, in my opinion.
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But correcting such with formal punishment for a first infraction?
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As 'Clockwork Mouse' says, this won't go to court martial, but for such a public breach of discipline, punishment must be seen to have been carried out.
If the Guardsmen was caught dicking about solely by an NCO out of the public eye then I'm sure a bit of "wall to wall" counselling as you put it 'Brickhistory' would be adequate. Dicking about in front of one of the most photographed/filmed buildings in London, and allowing evidence of such actions to be broadcast around the world, is a slightly different matter.
This is a Guardsman who is a member of the Household Division on Ceremonial Duties. The very title Guardsman implies what he should be doing, not acting like a ****.
If the Guardsmen was caught dicking about solely by an NCO out of the public eye then I'm sure a bit of "wall to wall" counselling as you put it 'Brickhistory' would be adequate. Dicking about in front of one of the most photographed/filmed buildings in London, and allowing evidence of such actions to be broadcast around the world, is a slightly different matter.
This is a Guardsman who is a member of the Household Division on Ceremonial Duties. The very title Guardsman implies what he should be doing, not acting like a ****.
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Stacker, how can he guard anything with half a dead bear on his head, obscuring his vision and no live rounds up the spout? What next, no "zapping" visiting aircraft, wearing red hairpieces on April the first? {this done by a well known Air Force display team} Ah, but we in the in the "Empire" must remember that there are two sets of rules in the UK, one for the elite, and one for the "Great Unwashed", cant wait for the day we dump the whole royalty crap! {Ex RCAF Aircrew by the way.}
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Heavens no!
Bliar and Camoron are the only officially approved British clowns allowed on the world stage right now.
After severely reprimanding him, I'd have bought him a pint.
(But then, I'm only an old Sar' Major from the colonies, perhaps I'm a bit out of date.)
.
Bliar and Camoron are the only officially approved British clowns allowed on the world stage right now.
After severely reprimanding him, I'd have bought him a pint.
(But then, I'm only an old Sar' Major from the colonies, perhaps I'm a bit out of date.)
.
Last edited by Stanwell; 15th Sep 2014 at 18:13.
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I don't have a huge amount of sympathy. Mainly because of the stupidity of doing something so obvious!
I do think it's a leap to suggest he's got no honour though!
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I do think it's a leap to suggest he's got no honour though!
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Clunckdriver
OK, we get it. You favour a republic rather than a constitutional monarchy for the UK. But wait a minute, you aren't a brit, so what are you worried about and why are you being so bloody rude about our system and the members of the Royal Family?
if you want Canada to renounce the British Monarch as your titular head and sever the relationship with the UK, then vote for it. We brits won't object. in the meantime wash your mouth out and stop being an arse.
OK, we get it. You favour a republic rather than a constitutional monarchy for the UK. But wait a minute, you aren't a brit, so what are you worried about and why are you being so bloody rude about our system and the members of the Royal Family?
if you want Canada to renounce the British Monarch as your titular head and sever the relationship with the UK, then vote for it. We brits won't object. in the meantime wash your mouth out and stop being an arse.
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"I do think it's a leap to suggest he's got no honour though!"
Just watched "A Few Good Men" on Sky so I was talking the talk! Code Red. Code. Honor. Great film!
"I do think it's a leap to suggest he's got no honour though!"
Just watched "A Few Good Men" on Sky so I was talking the talk! Code Red. Code. Honor. Great film!
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Stacker, how can he guard anything with half a dead bear on his head, obscuring his vision and no live rounds up the spout?
What next, no "zapping" visiting aircraft, wearing red hairpieces on April the first? {this done by a well known Air Force display team}
Ah, but we in the in the "Empire" must remember that there are two sets of rules in the UK, one for the elite, and one for the "Great Unwashed", cant wait for the day we dump the whole royalty crap! {Ex RCAF Aircrew by the way.}
The land of my birth has as much if not more inequality than the land in which I serve. Perhaps its not a Republicanism/Royalty thing huh?
Are you sure you're not a French-Canadian? You sure whine like one.
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There's a difference between detention and imprisonment. Not much a difference, mind.
This guy (according to arrse) got 21 days' detention. For any non-UK pers, this means 21 days in jail. As it was over 14 days, he would probably have served this in the Military Corrective Training Centre. Which is not quite a prison. But does lock the miscreants up at night and finds tiring military training for them to do during the day.
The prisoners are not paid, therefore they are effectively fined, although the CO can award a fine as well as detention. Periods in detention have to be "paid back" at the end of one's service too, so when the guy gives notice to leave, he would have to do another 3 weeks (paid) to account for his "non-service" over and above the notice period.
This guy (according to arrse) got 21 days' detention. For any non-UK pers, this means 21 days in jail. As it was over 14 days, he would probably have served this in the Military Corrective Training Centre. Which is not quite a prison. But does lock the miscreants up at night and finds tiring military training for them to do during the day.
The prisoners are not paid, therefore they are effectively fined, although the CO can award a fine as well as detention. Periods in detention have to be "paid back" at the end of one's service too, so when the guy gives notice to leave, he would have to do another 3 weeks (paid) to account for his "non-service" over and above the notice period.