Global Aviation Magazine : 60 Years of the Hercules
When I was on 33 at Middleton St George I recall an old Derwent engine being used to 'de-ice' the runway. But my recollection is of a much smaller rig than the one shown in the picture. It was a waste of time of course as Mother Nature could refreeze the runway faster then the rig could unfreeze it.
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Often in Jersey, but mainly in the past.
Age: 79
Posts: 7,808
Received 135 Likes
on
63 Posts
Ahh, the MRD - "The Destroyer of Worlds" *
Also quite good at turning snow into sheets of immovable ice.
* OK, airfield surfaces, light fittings and anything caught by flying hunks of ice.
Also quite good at turning snow into sheets of immovable ice.
* OK, airfield surfaces, light fittings and anything caught by flying hunks of ice.
Aha the MRD
Lindholme, winter 69/70. All 6 co-pilots were on a shift rota to operate the radios in the MRDs. A 3 man operation, a tanker driver, a MRD operator in a little cab between the jet engines and a radio operator to talk to ATC, in the tanker cab. We trundled up and down the runway most of the weekend.
Come Monday the blacktop was clear, the weather was CAVOK but we did not fly because no one else in 1Gp had wasted their weekend and so we had no divs!
We never bothered again.
It's true they were really good at changing snow into sheet ice and the MRD then shifted the sheets of ice like a giant paint scraper, only, as above, with considerable force.
Twin Derwents ex Meteors IIRC.
Slight thread drift but 2 of the Hastings at Lindholme had come straight from Colerne when the Herc replaced them, so a slight connection.
1066
Come Monday the blacktop was clear, the weather was CAVOK but we did not fly because no one else in 1Gp had wasted their weekend and so we had no divs!
We never bothered again.
It's true they were really good at changing snow into sheet ice and the MRD then shifted the sheets of ice like a giant paint scraper, only, as above, with considerable force.
Twin Derwents ex Meteors IIRC.
Slight thread drift but 2 of the Hastings at Lindholme had come straight from Colerne when the Herc replaced them, so a slight connection.
1066
C130 icing tale
Back to the thread.
Op banner inbound to Wunstorf from Belfast. Went through some v heavy rain ice about 30 mins out. Dropped off the troops but as the R & R stops had a guaranteed time in Germany it was not possible to bring forward the departure to get away before the freezing rain fell. And it did! In a couple on minutes it was half a inch thick on the windscreens and the parking area. A total no go. We have to night stop.
Ops normal, pick up a crate, taxi to local gasthof where rumour had it that the owner had been a U boat captain in a previous life.
Kapitan spots our crate, goes berserk. You are not staying here. Tried to placate him by offering him to take control of the beer until our departure the next day but NO there was no room at the inn for us.
Hanover it would have to be but by now the Germans had closed the Autobahns after much ice induced crashing and taxis had prudently decided to stop running.
Off to the local station, where the only way to buy tickets was in books of 10. So there were some tickets left over which made handing in the unused tickets as part of the imprest a challenge.
Made it to Hanover, found a hotel via the Bahnhof accommodation bureau, drank the beer and had a good night. Can't remember if we told Group our new address. Took a couple of taxis back to Wunsdorf the next morning. We thought getting a train that stopped at Wunsdorf might be too much of a challenge for our limited language skills. Happy troops after an extra night out or NI.
1066
Op banner inbound to Wunstorf from Belfast. Went through some v heavy rain ice about 30 mins out. Dropped off the troops but as the R & R stops had a guaranteed time in Germany it was not possible to bring forward the departure to get away before the freezing rain fell. And it did! In a couple on minutes it was half a inch thick on the windscreens and the parking area. A total no go. We have to night stop.
Ops normal, pick up a crate, taxi to local gasthof where rumour had it that the owner had been a U boat captain in a previous life.
Kapitan spots our crate, goes berserk. You are not staying here. Tried to placate him by offering him to take control of the beer until our departure the next day but NO there was no room at the inn for us.
Hanover it would have to be but by now the Germans had closed the Autobahns after much ice induced crashing and taxis had prudently decided to stop running.
Off to the local station, where the only way to buy tickets was in books of 10. So there were some tickets left over which made handing in the unused tickets as part of the imprest a challenge.
Made it to Hanover, found a hotel via the Bahnhof accommodation bureau, drank the beer and had a good night. Can't remember if we told Group our new address. Took a couple of taxis back to Wunsdorf the next morning. We thought getting a train that stopped at Wunsdorf might be too much of a challenge for our limited language skills. Happy troops after an extra night out or NI.
1066
1066,
wonderful story about your German train journey. Went to Rosenmontag
Festival (beer) during one Wildenrath nightstop. No taxi driver would take us back.
So we walked in the freezing conditions. Only the alcoholic antifreeze in our blood could have kept us alive.
wonderful story about your German train journey. Went to Rosenmontag
Festival (beer) during one Wildenrath nightstop. No taxi driver would take us back.
So we walked in the freezing conditions. Only the alcoholic antifreeze in our blood could have kept us alive.
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: M4 Corridor
Posts: 561
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Some years ago when the Sarajevo airlift was on, a number of crews were delayed at Wildenrath waiting for a weather clearance in the December murk in Bosnia. The Christmas fair was on and all the usual celebrations were on in the town. All of this seasonal goodwill and snowy surroundings was silently observed by thirty or more Ascoteers sipping their coffee or apfelsaft in roadside hostelries. The more the band oompahed the more glum the boys looked. After what seemed an age the Detco was espied approaching the festivities and we all watched him as he made his way into the square amongst us all. He took a deep breath and in his unmistakeable Rhodesian accent bellowed. "Black flag! 24 hour delay on everything. Bar's open!"
There followed some very serious catching up in the bier tent.
I do recall waking up with a Christmas tree in my room, with lights!
There followed some very serious catching up in the bier tent.
I do recall waking up with a Christmas tree in my room, with lights!
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: East Sussex UK
Age: 66
Posts: 6,995
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
Gentlemen ...
Just a thought on where we might go next with these wonderful RAF Albert stories
We've had tales of poor Albert feeling unwell in far flung places and how parts have been flown out and then fitted by our gallant band of GE's ... But how about when RAF Albert is seriously unwell/bent in exotic locations (other than NATO or other Mil/Civ Bases/Aiports). There must have be some fun-n-games securing Albert, repatriating the crew to Blighty and ultimately getting Engineers on site to do the necessary
Who's first ...
Just a thought on where we might go next with these wonderful RAF Albert stories
We've had tales of poor Albert feeling unwell in far flung places and how parts have been flown out and then fitted by our gallant band of GE's ... But how about when RAF Albert is seriously unwell/bent in exotic locations (other than NATO or other Mil/Civ Bases/Aiports). There must have be some fun-n-games securing Albert, repatriating the crew to Blighty and ultimately getting Engineers on site to do the necessary
Who's first ...
Coff,
Good question, and I'm sure many more experienced than myself will be along with tales of derring do. All I can offer, which might possibly approach your query would be as follows;
Myself and a fellow Ground Engineer had been allocated to ASCOT 4502 departing LYN on 8 October 1994. The aircraft was the splendid XV210, which I had coincidentally completed a Bruggen/Aldergrove banner run in, two days prior to the "big trip". The only other thing worthy of note was that our Navigator was a gentleman of genuine professionalism, and needs no further "gollying" to. Off we set, and the route, as I recall gave us night stops at a Mediterranean place with kebabs, somewhere along the way we had to run through a jungle, with real insects and animals, to win a beer, and eventually our (for me at least) first landfall in the land of Ned Kelly, Darwin. The purpose of the route was to recover the remnants of the Nimrods, Fincastle trophy detachment, and returns it to Kinloss. The plan was,on reaching Darwin, to fly to Adelaide, load up and recover via Darwin to points north.
As we had travelled South, we had experienced a continuous leak of hydraulic fluid from the No2 propellor. It remained a fairly constant loss rate, and with betwixt flight replenishment offered no hazard to our continued progression. Things were about to change. The crew, particularly our Flight Engineer, a young lady who was exceptionally competent, were aware of the leak on No2 prop, and the limitations in leg duration it imposed on us. For my fellow GE and myself, it added an hour or so to the After flight servicing each night, both cleaning down the cowlings and rear engine nacelles, and re establishing the full level of the prop. The only other "must" we had to consider was that the Captain had told us, in no uncertain terms, that he had to be back at Lyneham, on time, as he had unmissable commitments.
The leg from Darwin to Adelaide was long, but normal, from the point of view of those of us who "commanded" the progress of the route
from our hammocks down the back. On our descent to Adelaide, the Eng noted a swing on No2 prop that exceeded the permitted 1%. She duly informed us on landing, and we ensured that we would "look at it", after we had bedded Albert down for the night. On examination, No2 Engine had a really good covering of OM15, and on checking contents had lost more than double the loss rate we had noted during previous legs. We also noted that the reported prop swing had exceeded acceptable norms, on a 6 hour leg as I recall (Doug ?). Anyway, between us, TT and myself worked out that the fault causing the leak was our old friend the rear GITZ seal. Replacement of the seal involved the removal of the propellor, replacement of the seal and the refitment of the prop. As usual, we GEs did not have a spare seal, prop sling or crane, and needed to consider our return to Lyneham. Certainly, legs exceeding 6 hours were planned, possibly leading to the shutdown of No2, and our subsequent request for recovery in places exotic. Or we had an option. Now, a couple of Chief Techs in this situation, and unable to contact the crew in the hotel (probably due to their already doing an ASCOT shuffle) must do the best they can, so, we phoned Eng Ops at RAAF Richmond and spoke to the duty Eng O. Explained our situation, and he immediately offered to facilitate a team and all the required equipment to repair No2 prop, our arrival the next day was OK'd and we, on behalf of our Captain accepted the offer. The next phone call was to FATCOCK, informing them of our situation, the resolution that we, the GEs had found, and asked for their "guidance". The Richmond plot is approved they said, a 1 hour transit next morning, and a 24 delay on the route would put us back on track. Our arrival in the hotel bar, and informing our Captain of the itinerary for tomorrow was not received with good grace, as I recall, and his phone call to FATCOCK to cancel such plans was turned down, as he could not refute the prop leak. The next morning, we flew to Richmond, a team of Aussie sumpies met us and helped us remove the prop, replace the seal, refit the prop and carry out full post prop change EGRs. 14 hours, and my only glimpse of Sydney, where the crew spent their 24 off, was between 2300 and 0500 local. I enjoyed it though. And there's your, how do we deal with bent Albert in exotic locations Coff. Find the nearest, Albert unit (whatever the nationality) and ask for help.
To finish this lengthy missive (for which my apologies gentlemen, I understand the short attention span of trained aircrew) we departed Richmond, fully serviceable, having been given a new itinerary which involved a night stop Darwin, then a progression North. Both of us GEs welcomed the N/S Darwin, as a break, away from an airfield, but we're gobsmacked when on awaking the next day, we were informed that our Air Eng had been grounded with a medical problem (another 24 hour minimum delay). As I recall, an enjoyable day off was taken, with a round of golf and a few bevvies by several of us. We eventually headed back home, with the final victim of the route being myself, who ended up grounded by the medics at Akronelli, with a chest virus, that stopped me getting home for a further 4 days. Thankfully TT was still fit and the aircraft eventually arrived back at Lyneham, complete with one GE. You will all be glad to know that I am off for a couple of weeks to Scotland for a change to Wiltshire, I will as always only eat the Haggis with the shorter left legs, but retain full control of my distillery selections. Best to all, and keep posting gentlemen.
Smudge
PS. Just read a book on Kindle, Not a natural Pilot, by Laurie Tallack. Some interesting insights to Albert, particularly reading stuff that perhaps should have conformed to the unwritten down route rules ? Anyone else have an opinion ? Perhaps I am the last one who should criticise !
Good question, and I'm sure many more experienced than myself will be along with tales of derring do. All I can offer, which might possibly approach your query would be as follows;
Myself and a fellow Ground Engineer had been allocated to ASCOT 4502 departing LYN on 8 October 1994. The aircraft was the splendid XV210, which I had coincidentally completed a Bruggen/Aldergrove banner run in, two days prior to the "big trip". The only other thing worthy of note was that our Navigator was a gentleman of genuine professionalism, and needs no further "gollying" to. Off we set, and the route, as I recall gave us night stops at a Mediterranean place with kebabs, somewhere along the way we had to run through a jungle, with real insects and animals, to win a beer, and eventually our (for me at least) first landfall in the land of Ned Kelly, Darwin. The purpose of the route was to recover the remnants of the Nimrods, Fincastle trophy detachment, and returns it to Kinloss. The plan was,on reaching Darwin, to fly to Adelaide, load up and recover via Darwin to points north.
As we had travelled South, we had experienced a continuous leak of hydraulic fluid from the No2 propellor. It remained a fairly constant loss rate, and with betwixt flight replenishment offered no hazard to our continued progression. Things were about to change. The crew, particularly our Flight Engineer, a young lady who was exceptionally competent, were aware of the leak on No2 prop, and the limitations in leg duration it imposed on us. For my fellow GE and myself, it added an hour or so to the After flight servicing each night, both cleaning down the cowlings and rear engine nacelles, and re establishing the full level of the prop. The only other "must" we had to consider was that the Captain had told us, in no uncertain terms, that he had to be back at Lyneham, on time, as he had unmissable commitments.
The leg from Darwin to Adelaide was long, but normal, from the point of view of those of us who "commanded" the progress of the route
from our hammocks down the back. On our descent to Adelaide, the Eng noted a swing on No2 prop that exceeded the permitted 1%. She duly informed us on landing, and we ensured that we would "look at it", after we had bedded Albert down for the night. On examination, No2 Engine had a really good covering of OM15, and on checking contents had lost more than double the loss rate we had noted during previous legs. We also noted that the reported prop swing had exceeded acceptable norms, on a 6 hour leg as I recall (Doug ?). Anyway, between us, TT and myself worked out that the fault causing the leak was our old friend the rear GITZ seal. Replacement of the seal involved the removal of the propellor, replacement of the seal and the refitment of the prop. As usual, we GEs did not have a spare seal, prop sling or crane, and needed to consider our return to Lyneham. Certainly, legs exceeding 6 hours were planned, possibly leading to the shutdown of No2, and our subsequent request for recovery in places exotic. Or we had an option. Now, a couple of Chief Techs in this situation, and unable to contact the crew in the hotel (probably due to their already doing an ASCOT shuffle) must do the best they can, so, we phoned Eng Ops at RAAF Richmond and spoke to the duty Eng O. Explained our situation, and he immediately offered to facilitate a team and all the required equipment to repair No2 prop, our arrival the next day was OK'd and we, on behalf of our Captain accepted the offer. The next phone call was to FATCOCK, informing them of our situation, the resolution that we, the GEs had found, and asked for their "guidance". The Richmond plot is approved they said, a 1 hour transit next morning, and a 24 delay on the route would put us back on track. Our arrival in the hotel bar, and informing our Captain of the itinerary for tomorrow was not received with good grace, as I recall, and his phone call to FATCOCK to cancel such plans was turned down, as he could not refute the prop leak. The next morning, we flew to Richmond, a team of Aussie sumpies met us and helped us remove the prop, replace the seal, refit the prop and carry out full post prop change EGRs. 14 hours, and my only glimpse of Sydney, where the crew spent their 24 off, was between 2300 and 0500 local. I enjoyed it though. And there's your, how do we deal with bent Albert in exotic locations Coff. Find the nearest, Albert unit (whatever the nationality) and ask for help.To finish this lengthy missive (for which my apologies gentlemen, I understand the short attention span of trained aircrew) we departed Richmond, fully serviceable, having been given a new itinerary which involved a night stop Darwin, then a progression North. Both of us GEs welcomed the N/S Darwin, as a break, away from an airfield, but we're gobsmacked when on awaking the next day, we were informed that our Air Eng had been grounded with a medical problem (another 24 hour minimum delay). As I recall, an enjoyable day off was taken, with a round of golf and a few bevvies by several of us. We eventually headed back home, with the final victim of the route being myself, who ended up grounded by the medics at Akronelli, with a chest virus, that stopped me getting home for a further 4 days. Thankfully TT was still fit and the aircraft eventually arrived back at Lyneham, complete with one GE. You will all be glad to know that I am off for a couple of weeks to Scotland for a change to Wiltshire, I will as always only eat the Haggis with the shorter left legs, but retain full control of my distillery selections. Best to all, and keep posting gentlemen.
Smudge
PS. Just read a book on Kindle, Not a natural Pilot, by Laurie Tallack. Some interesting insights to Albert, particularly reading stuff that perhaps should have conformed to the unwritten down route rules ? Anyone else have an opinion ? Perhaps I am the last one who should criticise !
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: M4 Corridor
Posts: 561
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
West Africa
One of the hazards of skimming the surface of the planet is that there are sometimes some natural events that occupy the same airspace. In my case it was a swarm of locusts. We were on a det in the Cameroons which was under a military dictatorship and not helpful. The sudden encounter with the swarm was heralded by the effect of flying through a custard tart fight. All forward visibility disappeared in yellow goo. The engine temps went up and a very nasty smell of well done locusts pervaded the flight deck. As in the song The only way was up. We landed at Douala with the DV windows open and both pilots craning over to see. A serious inspection followed with crispy insects being retrieved from all Albert's forward facing orifices. Piles of them dropped from the flaps and undercarriage bay. It was at this point that one of the AGEs said "Perhaps this isn't the best time to say that we will be out of LOX soon"
Cosmic.
The Cameroons used gaseous oxygen and we had no dip clearance for anywhere in Africa because we arrived over the sea.
" Only option is to go to Asi" I said
"Rude word" said the captain. However,the case was put to our customers and the boss (whom we sprang from jail for not having his "laissez passer special" on him) said we could take a day off while he stopped his mountain boys going for a swim in the lake which emitted poisonous gas bubbles from the volcanic magma it sat on.
Off we went then on a 5hr each way LOX run to Asi. The GEs had loaded up with fake Rolex watches to flog to the ground crew there. The charging was very slick and we re-rationed for the rest of the det. The GE's came back rich and we were back in Africa only 17 hours after we left. Hell of a day off.
Cosmic.
The Cameroons used gaseous oxygen and we had no dip clearance for anywhere in Africa because we arrived over the sea.
" Only option is to go to Asi" I said
"Rude word" said the captain. However,the case was put to our customers and the boss (whom we sprang from jail for not having his "laissez passer special" on him) said we could take a day off while he stopped his mountain boys going for a swim in the lake which emitted poisonous gas bubbles from the volcanic magma it sat on.
Off we went then on a 5hr each way LOX run to Asi. The GEs had loaded up with fake Rolex watches to flog to the ground crew there. The charging was very slick and we re-rationed for the rest of the det. The GE's came back rich and we were back in Africa only 17 hours after we left. Hell of a day off.
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: M4 Corridor
Posts: 561
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Some of the newly acquired rations being made into honkers stew with a splash of the local wine. We stirred it with the earthing spike and it came out bright pink. The stew was for the troops by the way. We wouldn't eat that sh*t.
Last edited by Dougie M; 29th Jul 2015 at 15:58.
Mobile Runway Destroyer
A device invented by the Devil incarnate! First encountered at Thorney when in the winter of 67 I was authorised as a MRD operator. This being the first engine I was allowed near after leaving Halton, certainly the first ground running I experienced, it was my first experience of the downward cascade principle. Very simple in operation, it started with the Chief was handed the responsibility for the implementation of the MRD, he delegated to the sergeant who told the corporal who selected a J/T (yours truly) to actually be the operator, it couldn't go any further down as you had to be a fitter to run it.
The Derwent , as possibly some of our readers who possibly experienced the Meteor in their early existence may remember, had a very manual starting procedure if the grey cell remembers. First open the LP cock, press start button, at 15% rpm open HP cock and observe JPT rise to ensure no overtemp, at about 33% slowly advance throttle again observing JPT rise whilst attempting to pass the resonance RPM band as quickly as possible whilst not overtemping to achieve 72% idle Rpm. After that it was easy, all you had to do was communicate with the Bowser driver over what was usually a very bad I/c and co-ordinate your operations.
As has been mentioned the MRD was very good at melting snow, which then refroze as ice, which the MRD was yet again very good at removing, generally in big sheets as the jet blast got under it putting anyone or any thing in the vicinity in danger of being dealt some severe damage! If in an attempt to avoid these happenings by changing the attitude of the jet pipes,( which was done if you were lucky by nitrogen pressure acting on a jack or if unlucky by a hand hydraulic pump in the cabin of the MRD ), you could also lift some fairly big chunks of tarmac as well which needless to say did not go down well with the powers that be and in fact it was after a couple of bouts of tarmac relaying that the MRD was banned at Thorney, as was shown later it was in fact safer to land on the snow than try to clear it.
The other party trick with the MRD was to catch the bowser driver by surprise with a swift burst of power, especially if on an icy surface, and send the whole contraption off in reverse with the MRD pushing the bowser, legend has it that some of the virtuosos could steer it in reverse by use of differential throttle, not something I tried being merely a beginner in the dark art of MRD operation.
The Derwent , as possibly some of our readers who possibly experienced the Meteor in their early existence may remember, had a very manual starting procedure if the grey cell remembers. First open the LP cock, press start button, at 15% rpm open HP cock and observe JPT rise to ensure no overtemp, at about 33% slowly advance throttle again observing JPT rise whilst attempting to pass the resonance RPM band as quickly as possible whilst not overtemping to achieve 72% idle Rpm. After that it was easy, all you had to do was communicate with the Bowser driver over what was usually a very bad I/c and co-ordinate your operations.
As has been mentioned the MRD was very good at melting snow, which then refroze as ice, which the MRD was yet again very good at removing, generally in big sheets as the jet blast got under it putting anyone or any thing in the vicinity in danger of being dealt some severe damage! If in an attempt to avoid these happenings by changing the attitude of the jet pipes,( which was done if you were lucky by nitrogen pressure acting on a jack or if unlucky by a hand hydraulic pump in the cabin of the MRD ), you could also lift some fairly big chunks of tarmac as well which needless to say did not go down well with the powers that be and in fact it was after a couple of bouts of tarmac relaying that the MRD was banned at Thorney, as was shown later it was in fact safer to land on the snow than try to clear it.
The other party trick with the MRD was to catch the bowser driver by surprise with a swift burst of power, especially if on an icy surface, and send the whole contraption off in reverse with the MRD pushing the bowser, legend has it that some of the virtuosos could steer it in reverse by use of differential throttle, not something I tried being merely a beginner in the dark art of MRD operation.