LIBYA (Merged) Use this thread ONLY
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Op Allowance
Op Allowance should only apply to those crews in harms way not the pizza eating support staffs who stand more chance of being run over than killed by enemy action, hotels are hardly a hardship are they. Lets face it 4 months in Italy or Herrick I know where I would rather go. You cant have your cake and eat it but then I guess some just want everything. Next they will be wanting a medal for service in FI and the Op allowance. This time in my view the bean counters got it right. I'll get my hat.
Join Date: May 2005
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Just viewing Sky news and it seems that a let's get out of the conflict is gaining ground. Re my past posts regarding the less than committed response from NATO and the political controls, the main supporters may find them selves stuffed and limited on what they can do. How history repeats it's self is amassing. 
hanoijane:
We will disagree on the degree and or kind of similarity, and I'll let it go at that.
I'm sure you'll be having your laundry done by Dau Tranh Enterprises in the meantime. 
By the way, I don't need your Google-fu to arrive at an informed opinion. Thanks for the offer.
Your charges of "inarticulate" are not supported by any evidence.
The unanswered questions remain:
1) If the Mad Colonel is not killed by "a strike on a Command and Control node" before the general intercession by the outsiders ends, which it eventually will, then what? (Or as Lenin might have asked, chto delat?)
2) If the Mad Colonel is struck by a weapon "intended to protect civilians," and rendered out of the game, then what?
Will the Arab League and the UN" (and anyone else for that matter) do something useful for the future of Libya, or will the Yugoslavia model of national "reorganization" along tribal and factional lines once again play out? I think it will, with yet another call to "do something" echoing in the halls on the East River, albeit this time as a call ignored.
3) If The Mad Colonel leaves town ... that's the one course of action that I see having no chance of unfolding.
If I were a Libyan rebel or dissident, I'd want to have some idea at how the first two questions are to be answered by those with power. This lovely (Brave New) globalized world doesn't seem to let much of anyone alone.
You can wish it were otherwise, but events seem to keep marching forward. There is no golden yesteryear to march back to.
We will disagree on the degree and or kind of similarity, and I'll let it go at that.
I'm sure you'll be having your laundry done by Dau Tranh Enterprises in the meantime. By the way, I don't need your Google-fu to arrive at an informed opinion. Thanks for the offer. Your charges of "inarticulate" are not supported by any evidence.
The unanswered questions remain:
1) If the Mad Colonel is not killed by "a strike on a Command and Control node" before the general intercession by the outsiders ends, which it eventually will, then what? (Or as Lenin might have asked, chto delat?)
2) If the Mad Colonel is struck by a weapon "intended to protect civilians," and rendered out of the game, then what?
Will the Arab League and the UN" (and anyone else for that matter) do something useful for the future of Libya, or will the Yugoslavia model of national "reorganization" along tribal and factional lines once again play out? I think it will, with yet another call to "do something" echoing in the halls on the East River, albeit this time as a call ignored.
3) If The Mad Colonel leaves town ... that's the one course of action that I see having no chance of unfolding.
If I were a Libyan rebel or dissident, I'd want to have some idea at how the first two questions are to be answered by those with power. This lovely (Brave New) globalized world doesn't seem to let much of anyone alone.
You can wish it were otherwise, but events seem to keep marching forward. There is no golden yesteryear to march back to.
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I read, a good 2 months before the unpleasantness started, that the good colonel did not occupy an official position in the Government of Libya. Any one know?
After an excellent landing you can use the airplane again!
After an excellent landing you can use the airplane again!
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It was blatantly obvious that this would become a stalemate, as per early posts on here.
So if it's blatantly obvious to knobbers on t'inters, why couldn't the experts in the 'govern'ment and military see it ?
So if it's blatantly obvious to knobbers on t'inters, why couldn't the experts in the 'govern'ment and military see it ?
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I have my laundry done at the Hyatt, thank you. They're very good.
Hypothetical questions are just that; hypothetical. And, as such, they're unworthy of a response. I might just as well ask;
What happens if the Colonel is bathing in the sea and is swallowed by a giant whale and the whale regurgitates him in San Francisco near the Castro where he forms a revolutionary wing of gay and lesbian Hispanics who then proceed to march on Washington eating babies on the way?"
See? It's pointless even to think about offering a response. Though feel free...
Live with what's happening, which is that the West is looking increasingly impotent and silly in Libya. Go home. Try to control your meddling tendencies and occupy yourselves with your own problems. God knows you have enough to keep you busy for a while.
C'mon, Lonewolf, admit it. You need a hug.
Hypothetical questions are just that; hypothetical. And, as such, they're unworthy of a response. I might just as well ask;
What happens if the Colonel is bathing in the sea and is swallowed by a giant whale and the whale regurgitates him in San Francisco near the Castro where he forms a revolutionary wing of gay and lesbian Hispanics who then proceed to march on Washington eating babies on the way?"
See? It's pointless even to think about offering a response. Though feel free...
Live with what's happening, which is that the West is looking increasingly impotent and silly in Libya. Go home. Try to control your meddling tendencies and occupy yourselves with your own problems. God knows you have enough to keep you busy for a while.
C'mon, Lonewolf, admit it. You need a hug.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
jane, your counter hypothetical suggestion is preposterous. Realistic hypothetical questions are not. While politicians refuse to be drawn on hypotheticals during interviews it is solely because the questions can be used as a trap.
Hypotheticals are the would basis of foreign policy. For instance UK pays out aid month to country X in the expectation that country X will be favourable to them in the future. The hypothetical case is if I pay danegeld they will be good to me.
You would be right however to say hypotheticals are frequently wrong. Bin Laden was in a friendly country. Country X frequently misappropriates the 'gifts' and used them against its benefactor - Vientianne,
Hypotheticals are the would basis of foreign policy. For instance UK pays out aid month to country X in the expectation that country X will be favourable to them in the future. The hypothetical case is if I pay danegeld they will be good to me.
You would be right however to say hypotheticals are frequently wrong. Bin Laden was in a friendly country. Country X frequently misappropriates the 'gifts' and used them against its benefactor - Vientianne,
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Realistic hypotheticals???
I think you should assign a probability to the aforementioned hypotheticals so that I can ascertain whether they're worth responding or not. May I suggest a probability of less than .3 renders the hypothetical unworthy of my response?
Assign your probabilities. And show your workings, please.
And what were you going to write about Vientianne (sic)? Be careful, I've lived there recently and if you say bad things about my Lao brothers and sisters I shall bite your ankles. Both of them.
I think you should assign a probability to the aforementioned hypotheticals so that I can ascertain whether they're worth responding or not. May I suggest a probability of less than .3 renders the hypothetical unworthy of my response?
Assign your probabilities. And show your workings, please.
And what were you going to write about Vientianne (sic)? Be careful, I've lived there recently and if you say bad things about my Lao brothers and sisters I shall bite your ankles. Both of them.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Jane, good point about assigning probabilties. That of course is done, we hope, when our Government carries out its defence reviews.
And Vientiane?
The US flew weapons into French Indo China to overthrow the Vichy French and Japanese. While some were possibly used for their intended purpose Giap also held quantities back for the struggle he knew was to come when the French tried to reimpose European colonial rule.
And Vientiane?
The US flew weapons into French Indo China to overthrow the Vichy French and Japanese. While some were possibly used for their intended purpose Giap also held quantities back for the struggle he knew was to come when the French tried to reimpose European colonial rule.
I have my laundry done at the Hyatt, thank you.
And, as such, they're unworthy of a response.
OK. You might go back and read the "what if's" as you will see that my questions were directly related to what is happening. Givenhow things have played out to date, each course of action lies within the realm of the probable, as well as the possible. If the "let 'em play" policy had been adopted, quite possibly a sound policy, see German response, then there'd be a complaint that "something isn't being done about that Mad Colonel!"
There's no pleasing everyone.
Live with what's happening, which is that the West is looking increasingly impotent and silly in Libya.
Problem is, too many of "the West" involved in the op aren't willing to admit that what they really intend to do is take the Mad Colonel out ... but have for reasons as silly as your response hypothetical, chosen to use bizarre rhetorical fig leaves, up there on the East River, to justify doing that without doing that. I suspect that the Ministry of Silly Walks lies adjacent to the Ministry of Silly Political Rhetoric, and wonder if that sketch wasn't meant as a metaphor ...
Go home. Try to control your meddling tendencies and occupy yourselves with your own problems. God knows you have enough to keep you busy for a while.
Funny, I don't recall having been the decision maker calling in the great French cum NATO cum Western Libyan Liberation Mission ... you seem to have mistaken me for somebody else.
C'mon, Lonewolf, admit it. You need a hug.
Who knows, Jane, if I'll ever get over to that part of the world again. If I do, might just take you up on that great idea.
HMS Liverpool in action.
British destroyer forced to defend itself after being targeted by Libyan rockets | British Forces News
Libyan forces fire on HMS Liverpool - East Hampshire - The News
HMCS Charlottetown
Canadian warship opens fire on Libyan forces
FNS Courbet
French frigate FNS Courbet has been targeting Gaddafi forces near Misrata during the night of 7th and 8th May.
Mer et Marine : Toute l'actualité maritime
TJ
British destroyer forced to defend itself after being targeted by Libyan rockets | British Forces News
Libyan forces fire on HMS Liverpool - East Hampshire - The News
HMCS Charlottetown
Canadian warship opens fire on Libyan forces
FNS Courbet
French frigate FNS Courbet has been targeting Gaddafi forces near Misrata during the night of 7th and 8th May.
Mer et Marine : Toute l'actualité maritime
TJ
Last edited by TEEEJ; 12th May 2011 at 22:03.
RAF Litening targetting pod footage showing an RAF strike on a Gaddafi forces munitions stockpile, identified by an earlier recconnaissance sortie, and including FROG-7 rocket launchers and several Scud missile canisters.
07:41
Royal Air Force Ellamy 906-110509-0132 Two Clips
Planned strike by Royal Air Force aircraft on a Qadhafi regime brigade headquarters building.
Strike by Tornado GR4 aircraft on a building being used by the Qadhafi regime near Misratah
TJ
07:41
Royal Air Force Ellamy 906-110509-0132 Two Clips
Planned strike by Royal Air Force aircraft on a Qadhafi regime brigade headquarters building.
Strike by Tornado GR4 aircraft on a building being used by the Qadhafi regime near Misratah
TJ
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Cyber attack on Norwegian Armed forces the day after the F-16 started flying missions: Goggle translate - vg.no
RAF Typhoon and Tornado in action.
Royal Air Force Strikes Libyan Warships and Naval Facility
RAF Strikes
Attack On Bunker
Video at following link.
http://www.raf.mod.uk/rafcms/mediafi...E1DD5C65DA.wmv
TJ
Royal Air Force Strikes Libyan Warships and Naval Facility
RAF Strikes
Attack On Bunker
Video at following link.
http://www.raf.mod.uk/rafcms/mediafi...E1DD5C65DA.wmv
TJ
