78 Sqn Chinook Crash (20 years ago)
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Well, Lincolnshire
Age: 69
Posts: 1,101
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
78 Sqn Chinook Crash (20 years ago)
I am attempting to lay to rest a personal demon.
20 odd years ago a Chinook helicopter, of 78 Sqn RAF Mount Pleasant, crashed on an airtest/rotortune. Three crew and the rotortune team were all killed.
I was the (new) Opsy on the Squadron and responded in the best way I could to the events that happened that day.
Throughout the rest of my service, I never really discovered what the BoI uncovered (I was a witness).
Can any of my fellow Ppruners point me/supply me with an answer?
Taxydual
20 odd years ago a Chinook helicopter, of 78 Sqn RAF Mount Pleasant, crashed on an airtest/rotortune. Three crew and the rotortune team were all killed.
I was the (new) Opsy on the Squadron and responded in the best way I could to the events that happened that day.
Throughout the rest of my service, I never really discovered what the BoI uncovered (I was a witness).
Can any of my fellow Ppruners point me/supply me with an answer?
Taxydual
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Wiltshire
Age: 59
Posts: 903
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I was in MPN at the time as well. Remember seeing the Chinook fly over as the TriStar was taxying out. Went back into the hangar to sort out the inbound and heard the T* taxi back in. Was told it was because the fire cover had gone and the T* might be needed to take any casualties backt to the UK.
Loaded the coffins instead.
BOI was inconclusive IIRC
Loaded the coffins instead.
BOI was inconclusive IIRC
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Well, Lincolnshire
Age: 69
Posts: 1,101
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The crash vehicles couldn't get near the crash site, the ground was too boggy. We scrambled a Seaking to pick up the crash crew and some fire bottles.
I well remember the Timmy taxying back and behind, it in the distance, the rising pall of smoke.
OC Eng instantly grounded everything, thinking 'contaminated' fuel.
I well remember the Timmy taxying back and behind, it in the distance, the rising pall of smoke.
OC Eng instantly grounded everything, thinking 'contaminated' fuel.
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Nova
Posts: 1,242
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
No positive cause was ever identified. The a/c simply departed from controlled flight. From an altitude (I think) of around 800', the aircraft gently entered a vertical dive. The only transmission made was thought to be the middle portion of £@cking he!!
Could have been a manufacturing fault. Could have been hydraulic contamination, could have been undocumented major engineering.
Exceptional guys, every single one.
Just fortunate there were witnesses, otherwise we could be looking at another case of 'Gross Negligence', as in the tragedy on the Mull of Kintyre.
Never forgotten.
Could have been a manufacturing fault. Could have been hydraulic contamination, could have been undocumented major engineering.
Exceptional guys, every single one.
Just fortunate there were witnesses, otherwise we could be looking at another case of 'Gross Negligence', as in the tragedy on the Mull of Kintyre.
Never forgotten.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Well, Lincolnshire
Age: 69
Posts: 1,101
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There was some talk of the forward rotor actuator extending out of it's cylinder causing the tilt, then the dive.
I heard 'garble' on the Ops VHF radio at the supposed crash time.
I don't know what's triggered this post request, I've seen crashes before and survived one, but............it doesn't 'haunt' me, but I'd like to know if there was a conclusion.
I had a tinny thrown to me by the crewman (who's name I cannot remember, aaaargh) the evening before the crash as we 'handbagged' a landrover for a lift back to the accommodation.
That 'tinny' meant I was accepted on the squadron.
I heard 'garble' on the Ops VHF radio at the supposed crash time.
I don't know what's triggered this post request, I've seen crashes before and survived one, but............it doesn't 'haunt' me, but I'd like to know if there was a conclusion.
I had a tinny thrown to me by the crewman (who's name I cannot remember, aaaargh) the evening before the crash as we 'handbagged' a landrover for a lift back to the accommodation.
That 'tinny' meant I was accepted on the squadron.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Wichita, USA
Age: 61
Posts: 127
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tandemrotor is right - the cause was never positively determined. I was on the Sqn at the time (in fact I was supposed to be in the aircraft but we had a shift change and I went back to the accomodation complex). If I recall correctly the BoI initially went after DASH actuator runaway as a possible cause, but this was later discounted.
As a very young JNCO at the time, standing in front of the BoI president and giving testimony was one of the most haunting things I have ever done.
Great guys, fondly remembered, sadly missed.
FlightTester aka Roger Ramjet
As a very young JNCO at the time, standing in front of the BoI president and giving testimony was one of the most haunting things I have ever done.
Great guys, fondly remembered, sadly missed.
FlightTester aka Roger Ramjet
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Nova
Posts: 1,242
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
He was a top man indeed!
As were the two pilots. All members of the 18 Sqn flight crew football team. I believe I am correct in saying, we lost over half that team in 3 fatal accidents in the space of 2 years. Sad times indeed. (The fast jet Sqns also suffered over a similar period)
I hope things are are different now. Not least that military flight safety is better developed. But sadly I am not unfamiliar with recent cases!
As were the two pilots. All members of the 18 Sqn flight crew football team. I believe I am correct in saying, we lost over half that team in 3 fatal accidents in the space of 2 years. Sad times indeed. (The fast jet Sqns also suffered over a similar period)
I hope things are are different now. Not least that military flight safety is better developed. But sadly I am not unfamiliar with recent cases!
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Norfolk England
Posts: 247
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
MOD Accident Summary
Taxydual,
If you have not seen it the official Military Air Accident Summary is at:
http://www.mod.uk/NR/rdonlyres/BED68...21_27feb87.pdf
Sadly the recommendation on fitting a CVR and ADR had not been actioned by June 1994 or we might not be having such a fight for justice for the crew of ZD 576.
JB
If you have not seen it the official Military Air Accident Summary is at:
http://www.mod.uk/NR/rdonlyres/BED68...21_27feb87.pdf
Sadly the recommendation on fitting a CVR and ADR had not been actioned by June 1994 or we might not be having such a fight for justice for the crew of ZD 576.
JB
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Well, Lincolnshire
Age: 69
Posts: 1,101
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
JB
Thanks for the link. I never did get to see the final report. It was a long time ago, but that 'itch' about the crash never went away.
I knew two of the pax in the Mull Crash and still have an 'itch' about that too.
Occasionally, it's good to scratch an 'itch'. It brings back good memories that far outweigh the bad.
Stay safe and thanks again.
Taxydual
Thanks for the link. I never did get to see the final report. It was a long time ago, but that 'itch' about the crash never went away.
I knew two of the pax in the Mull Crash and still have an 'itch' about that too.
Occasionally, it's good to scratch an 'itch'. It brings back good memories that far outweigh the bad.
Stay safe and thanks again.
Taxydual
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Shrewsbury
Age: 42
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi all my name is Steve Travis but I was born Steve Johns, its somewhat surreal to read about an event that happened 26 years ago and changed mine and my family's life forever. I wish to say thank you for the link to the crash investigation and to the people that talked about my dad and hold his memory with you. I am trying to get to Mount Pleasant to lay a wreath at the monument that is at the crash site.
A colleague former Squadron leader Dyson is helping me and I hope in time I will able to post that I have succeeded in my aim.
Steve
A colleague former Squadron leader Dyson is helping me and I hope in time I will able to post that I have succeeded in my aim.
Steve
Crumbs. 26 years.
I visited the memorial and cleaned it each time I went to MPA. I fine weather day is required. I stopped going in 1996. I'm sure it's not forgotten.
At Odiham, I worked with two of the RotorTuners Dave and Karl. Both of them really good guys who knew their stuff and were easy people to work with.
I visited the memorial and cleaned it each time I went to MPA. I fine weather day is required. I stopped going in 1996. I'm sure it's not forgotten.
At Odiham, I worked with two of the RotorTuners Dave and Karl. Both of them really good guys who knew their stuff and were easy people to work with.
Co-pilot was husband of a flt cdr I worked with at Cranwell. I was a guest at their wedding. - Audrey? Anyone know what happened to her? Crash was only a few weeks after I left MPA (I left 9 May 86) and I think I flew in that aircraft.
Without going into all the detail, I understand the cause was identified by AAIB and the Odiham test pilot (the unpublished photographs are both compelling and conclusive) but it was decreed that nothing would be said officially about Boeing's Quality Control (or MoD's Quality Assurance). This general point was later made by a witness during the Mull of Kintyre inquiries.
CGB - that is she. I am reminded of them driving off from the wedding in their 3-abreast French sports car every time I drive past my village square, where there is a similar car parked.
I stopped going in 1996. I'm sure it's not forgotten.