MOD sued for £9 million over Harrier noise
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
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MOD sued for £9 million over Harrier noise
The Times - Neighbour in £9m attack on RAF noise
THE owners of a country estate want £9 million damages for the “shattering” din made by military aircraft, the High Court heard yesterday.
Darby Dennis, 51, and his wife Catherine, 46, are suing the Ministry of Defence, saying that the unbearable noise of Harrier aircraft has rendered their lives impossible. They first complained about the Harriers, based two miles from their 17th-century home at RAF Wittering, in 1985. The couple reluctantly began legal proceedings in 1996 after what their solicitor said was 11 years “battling against the MoD, who have done precisely nothing about it”.
The MoD receives more than 4,000 complaints a year about military aircraft and the case could set a precedent if the claim is successful.
Walcot Hall, a Grade I listed manor house in Lincolnshire, was built in 1678 by Sir Hugh Cholmondely and is part of a 1,387-acre agricultural and sporting estate. Mr Dennis moved there as a boy in 1963. He says that the property’s worth has fallen by £7.1 million, roughly half its market value, because of the noise. Like many stately homes, it is hired out for events such as fashion shoots, television filming and shooting parties to fund its upkeep.
The Dennis family wants £2.3 million for lost revenue. The MoD disputes its liability and the Dennis family’s valuations. The family refused the offer of a lower figure to settle out of court.
There has been an airfield at Wittering since 1916, and during the Second World War Walcot Hall became a US operations centre for planning bombing raids on Germany.
Harriers were first flown from RAF Wittering in 1967. The base is used mainly for training, with flights generally restricted to daytime hours on weekdays. In 1991 the MoD installed double glazing in several smaller houses on the estate but this was not a practical solution for the 17th-century mansion. Mr Dennis said: “It pains us to have had to bring this case. We want to make it clear that we support the Royal Air Force in all it does.
“We have had to live with the shattering noise caused by Harriers...and despite all efforts, the MoD has not listened. Harriers are exceptionally noisy. We are close to and in a direct line with Wittering’s runway. On flying days, normal life is impossible.
“This case is about whether the law allows the MoD to do what it likes and if so whether individuals should have to suffer the consequences.”
THE owners of a country estate want £9 million damages for the “shattering” din made by military aircraft, the High Court heard yesterday.
Darby Dennis, 51, and his wife Catherine, 46, are suing the Ministry of Defence, saying that the unbearable noise of Harrier aircraft has rendered their lives impossible. They first complained about the Harriers, based two miles from their 17th-century home at RAF Wittering, in 1985. The couple reluctantly began legal proceedings in 1996 after what their solicitor said was 11 years “battling against the MoD, who have done precisely nothing about it”.
The MoD receives more than 4,000 complaints a year about military aircraft and the case could set a precedent if the claim is successful.
Walcot Hall, a Grade I listed manor house in Lincolnshire, was built in 1678 by Sir Hugh Cholmondely and is part of a 1,387-acre agricultural and sporting estate. Mr Dennis moved there as a boy in 1963. He says that the property’s worth has fallen by £7.1 million, roughly half its market value, because of the noise. Like many stately homes, it is hired out for events such as fashion shoots, television filming and shooting parties to fund its upkeep.
The Dennis family wants £2.3 million for lost revenue. The MoD disputes its liability and the Dennis family’s valuations. The family refused the offer of a lower figure to settle out of court.
There has been an airfield at Wittering since 1916, and during the Second World War Walcot Hall became a US operations centre for planning bombing raids on Germany.
Harriers were first flown from RAF Wittering in 1967. The base is used mainly for training, with flights generally restricted to daytime hours on weekdays. In 1991 the MoD installed double glazing in several smaller houses on the estate but this was not a practical solution for the 17th-century mansion. Mr Dennis said: “It pains us to have had to bring this case. We want to make it clear that we support the Royal Air Force in all it does.
“We have had to live with the shattering noise caused by Harriers...and despite all efforts, the MoD has not listened. Harriers are exceptionally noisy. We are close to and in a direct line with Wittering’s runway. On flying days, normal life is impossible.
“This case is about whether the law allows the MoD to do what it likes and if so whether individuals should have to suffer the consequences.”
In 1963 (when this c-c-c-c-clot moved to his current home), wasn't Wittering a V-bomber base? Wouldn't that have been fairly noisy?
While the Harrier is undeniably a noisy jet, doesn't the force spend a great deal of time operating elsewhere? Even when operating from Wittering, don't Harriers export most of their noise to the Lakes and Wales, etc? Hasn't Cottesmore further reduced noise at Wittering?
Has this bloke got a leg to stand on?
While the Harrier is undeniably a noisy jet, doesn't the force spend a great deal of time operating elsewhere? Even when operating from Wittering, don't Harriers export most of their noise to the Lakes and Wales, etc? Hasn't Cottesmore further reduced noise at Wittering?
Has this bloke got a leg to stand on?
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Great picture in the Daily Mail (yes I know!). The tree-lined drive through the landscaped gardens, almost exactly lines up with the runway!
Much the same points as the Times, but does mention that constant training circuits add to the claimed intrusion. Can't put in double-glazing since the house is Grade 1. Looks like classic case of over-claim, accept reduced amount.
Whoops, isn't this sub-judice?
Much the same points as the Times, but does mention that constant training circuits add to the claimed intrusion. Can't put in double-glazing since the house is Grade 1. Looks like classic case of over-claim, accept reduced amount.
Whoops, isn't this sub-judice?
The large number of cross circuits because of strip use spreads the noise footprint over a much larger area than a conventional airfield. This also has the effect of diluting the noise in the undershoot of the main runway. The noise has also decreased recently with the 1(F) move to cottesmore (although the Navy are making up for that somewhat). This house is so far out that most circuits turn comfortably inside it anyway and anyone who does fly over it is flying bomber circuits and deserves to be chopped anyway. Solution - put 75' and 150' rings round it and use it as a crv7 target.
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Why do people complain when they move to an area under the flight path, of an existing airfield? Their logic escapes me!!
A previous thread said that fast jet noise was the sound of freedom! Ok it was down south where they dont usually hear or see anything interesting but they should be gratefull that there are still some of our A/C still here to protect them from the boogie man!
Can't see that they would be in residence that much though, what with all the society do's to attend, the Cruiser in the Med, villa in Tuscany........
A previous thread said that fast jet noise was the sound of freedom! Ok it was down south where they dont usually hear or see anything interesting but they should be gratefull that there are still some of our A/C still here to protect them from the boogie man!
Can't see that they would be in residence that much though, what with all the society do's to attend, the Cruiser in the Med, villa in Tuscany........
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Divergent Phugoid, I would have thought that was obvious. Buy a house for a couple of million in the flight path, spend a hundred grand on lawyers and bingo, airfield closed house goes up in value by a couple of million. Good investment what?
In the days when asylum seekers can sue for distress and burglars get compensation for having their bollocks shot off, it wouldn't surprise me if this bloke didn't win!
In the days when asylum seekers can sue for distress and burglars get compensation for having their bollocks shot off, it wouldn't surprise me if this bloke didn't win!
Hardly get rich quick!
Fair enough, newswatcher.
House has been owned by the same family for 40 years, plaintiff grew up there. Harriers have been there since 1967, the airfield extant since 1917, and he asked first asked questions in 1985. Legal action commenced in 1996. So he wasn't exactly unaware of the house's position when he first moved there.
I may feel differently if there was a sum of £2 - £3 million involved, but he's already been made an offer and turned it down.
My hope ? That he either loses or wins a lower amount than offered, in which case he'll have a large costs bill.
House has been owned by the same family for 40 years, plaintiff grew up there. Harriers have been there since 1967, the airfield extant since 1917, and he asked first asked questions in 1985. Legal action commenced in 1996. So he wasn't exactly unaware of the house's position when he first moved there.
I may feel differently if there was a sum of £2 - £3 million involved, but he's already been made an offer and turned it down.
My hope ? That he either loses or wins a lower amount than offered, in which case he'll have a large costs bill.
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“battling against the MoD, who have done precisely nothing about it”
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And just what will 9million do towards a practical solution?
We live in North Cambs, and Harriers and Tornados overfly us regularly. I have no probs with it, except when they fly 'Directly' overhead, as opposed to off one side. (The problem then is that it frightens the ducks, who panic easily, and in fact one of the old ladies now has a twisted foot due to being trampled by other ducks)
Conversely, when the hercibirds go over, sometimes singly, sometimes in threes, unless you see them you hardly know they are there, even when they have to pull up to over fly the railway line.
We live in North Cambs, and Harriers and Tornados overfly us regularly. I have no probs with it, except when they fly 'Directly' overhead, as opposed to off one side. (The problem then is that it frightens the ducks, who panic easily, and in fact one of the old ladies now has a twisted foot due to being trampled by other ducks)
Conversely, when the hercibirds go over, sometimes singly, sometimes in threes, unless you see them you hardly know they are there, even when they have to pull up to over fly the railway line.
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Ludwig,
Point taken, One question though, any one know where I can find a Mansion near an airfield that hasnt already closed? Oh and just one more thing, Any one got a spare 3 or 4 Million they could lend me??
Point taken, One question though, any one know where I can find a Mansion near an airfield that hasnt already closed? Oh and just one more thing, Any one got a spare 3 or 4 Million they could lend me??
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Note to OC Ops:
Re: Mr Dennis' complaint. Please write & inc following:
Mr Dennis - we offered some of the damn fine double glazing that you didn't like - something about 17th C not looking good with white UPVC - well - you ARE fussy.
Low flying in the vicinity of the airfield assists us in the taking off and landing of our aircraft. The pilots find it useful.
Now poke off or we'll send the boys round. There's a good chap.
Re: Mr Dennis' complaint. Please write & inc following:
Mr Dennis - we offered some of the damn fine double glazing that you didn't like - something about 17th C not looking good with white UPVC - well - you ARE fussy.
Low flying in the vicinity of the airfield assists us in the taking off and landing of our aircraft. The pilots find it useful.
Now poke off or we'll send the boys round. There's a good chap.
(Not even when the Coltishall Jags or the noisy colibris form Wittering are here on deployment.)Join Date: May 2000
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In most other areas of complaints, liability expires after a certain period if no action is taken. Since our Harriers have been there so long, and since V Force were there before it surely is a pretty simple case of 'it's a bit late now matey'.
Could he suggest where exactly we can place jets so no one hears them - near an estate he probably didn't pay for is better than a town filled with many more people. Or perhaps he'd rather we had no air power at all. Probably supports Helen Clark. Pratt.
Could he suggest where exactly we can place jets so no one hears them - near an estate he probably didn't pay for is better than a town filled with many more people. Or perhaps he'd rather we had no air power at all. Probably supports Helen Clark. Pratt.
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There would appear to be a clear task here for the 'Green Marrows' - how about some lose formation hovering over the said manse - oh yeah, since 'F' Troop are now CTM-based, better do it in the dark. As Bob Hoskins once said in 'The Long Good Friday', "Bit of respect required here!" methinks! Own the night and rule the skies in omniam principe...
From the BBC web site:
(Alongside a nice photo of a high level formation of F3s!!)
Couple win £950,000 over jet noise.
A couple have been awarded £950,000 over noise created by RAF Harrier jets above their 17th Century listed house.
Farmer Darby Dennis, 51, and his 46-year-old wife, Catherine, said the effect of the planes flying over Walcot Hall, near Stamford, Lincolnshire, was unbearable and had affected their domestic and commercial activities.
They had claimed £9m in compensation.
Their claim was founded in common law nuisance and under the Human Rights Act.
It was aimed at securing a declaration of unlawfulness against the Crown, which would stop the flying and result in compensation.
The Ministry of Defence disputed the figures claimed and its liability.
It would appear that the BBC web site developers are also avid Pruners. Ten minutes after I noticed the story and posted it here, with comment about the photo of F3s, they changed it to a low level GR4!!!
(Alongside a nice photo of a high level formation of F3s!!)
Couple win £950,000 over jet noise.
A couple have been awarded £950,000 over noise created by RAF Harrier jets above their 17th Century listed house.
Farmer Darby Dennis, 51, and his 46-year-old wife, Catherine, said the effect of the planes flying over Walcot Hall, near Stamford, Lincolnshire, was unbearable and had affected their domestic and commercial activities.
They had claimed £9m in compensation.
Their claim was founded in common law nuisance and under the Human Rights Act.
It was aimed at securing a declaration of unlawfulness against the Crown, which would stop the flying and result in compensation.
The Ministry of Defence disputed the figures claimed and its liability.
It would appear that the BBC web site developers are also avid Pruners. Ten minutes after I noticed the story and posted it here, with comment about the photo of F3s, they changed it to a low level GR4!!!
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Its disgusting in my book, compo for a/c noise...when you live near a bl**dy airfield! Its been an airfield since when, 1917!
Perhaps they'd prefer it if there were no airfields, we're no Air Force and we were all speaking German worshiping statues of the little Nazi with the 'tache. Flamin heck, I'm lost for words.
Perhaps they'd prefer it if there were no airfields, we're no Air Force and we were all speaking German worshiping statues of the little Nazi with the 'tache. Flamin heck, I'm lost for words.
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Think I'll sue my local farmer, having knowingly moved into a house that backs onto his field of very noisy sheep.
They must've had a leg to stand on though, or else MoD wouldn't have settled.
They must've had a leg to stand on though, or else MoD wouldn't have settled.
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BBC Radio 4 News reported (not on the web site) that one of their objections was that they couldn't have shooting parties because of the aircraft noise. Let's hope that some friendly local will now sue them over the noise from their shooting parties!