Military AircrewA forum for the professionals who fly the non-civilian hardware, and the backroom boys and girls without whom nothing would leave the ground. Army, Navy and Airforces of the World, all equally welcome here.
Ivor, Suggest you look closer to home for blame and a rant. C130 crews often queried the mentality of it all. The normal reply was something along the lines that the pax's base would not provide sufficient crash cover for your pink little bodies or was not 'open' at that time in morn. Sadly though, and this may shock you so I hope you're sitting down comfortably, the common reply was that your 'management' saved money by bussing you down:-(
Nice initiative by the Lyneham guys, local training etc, hope they kicked your sorry ar5e (!!!!!!)
If it was down to us, we'd come and pick you up. However, if you've any brains or experience whatsoever you'd know that in this day and age of strict rules and auth'ing, crews can't do as they please. Which works both ways in your situation and that of the rugby match. I'd say it's a definite that they've been dropped off on the back of a preapproved task.
I suggest you have a winge elsewhere and dry your eyes
EESDL - My Old,
Lossie have been happy to open on almost every occasion they have been asked when our own or other locals are coming home, it has nearly always been 2 Gp or DTMA that have scuppered the event due ac, crew duty, inflexibility, i've got more occurences than I care to mention. Lossie has even had fillets added to the runway to enable fat jets to turn round on the runway.
Its nice to see 2 Gp looking after their own and inserting the bat on most occasions when it doesn't suit them.
After all, we are all in the company but some look after their own a little more than others!!!!
I suspect that the only reason that some Lossie pax were on board was to legitimise the sortie to bring the Rugby team up here. As I said, 99% of the time we end up travelling by coach and nothing is available when we enquire.
Excuse my inexperience here (being an Air Defender) but can someone tell my why when the Jags came back from a recent exercise, the C-130s actually routed over CS before landing at Lyneham? The PAX weren’t entirely happy about the coach journey home. Was it the station penny pinching or was it lack of cover/reluctance to open the airfield?
The fact is that the crew (and normally the station) have absolutely NO say in AT routing. We are well aware of your final destination and know that you often have long bus journeys which is the last thing you need after a flight in Albert. The tasking/itineries are written by those jolly busy chaps at group, with input from DTMA.
The fact that you don't go to your home base may be due to opening hours, paying civvies overtime, crash cat, customs, crew duty, movers, or a number of other excuses!
Thanks Lockstock - it's probably an age thing, but since budget holding and contractorising came in it seems to me that all the 'flex' to help out 'our own' seems to have gone out the window-not a great way to show 'the Team works', to borrow the RN's advertising tag-line
Morale might be low, but at least we're all CCS and RAFFT current!
The bottom line here is that someone has to pay for us to go from a to b and if the various budget holders, at ISK and the like decide that sending you on a bus is better value for money than asking us to come fetch, and believe me it is by a lomg way, then that is exactly what will happen.
Maple I have been involved with the type of move you describe and have when my Captains have enquired info from Ascot Op's is that CS will not stump up for out of hours fire cover which screws our crash cat needs.
No consolation I know but we suffer just as badly on a regular basis with the retrictions on opening hours, all cost driven I might add, by our extremely helpful pals in Kokineli............nothing beats a full day awake to then depart Lyn at 0100 in order to get the A/C in and out of Akro with as little disturbance to the "party"
Tasked to take pax and load from a Scottish airbase to somewhere in Europe, over a weekend. Have trainee aircrew on board so need extra legs. Ask Sqn if they want to be picked up rather than taking the bus. Get approval from Gp to add extra leg for trg. Airfield opens, everybody happy.
A few weeks later, need to nightstop UK for training, over a weekend. Same airfield won't accept us.
A few weeks later, tasked with recovering personnel from a different service, from somewhere in Europe, over a weekend. Personnel are based close to a Scottish airbase. Airbase won't open as its not a station move. Personnel are delivered to nearest civilian airfield.
The reason we have always been given for having to go from Waddo by bus to BZN (or worse - South Cerney) is that the system does not have the flexibility to 'process' us anywhere else.
As for dropping-off -- same problem inc Customs......
In addition, I guess the shiny fleet need specialist unloading equipment to remove the freight. This is certainly not available at Waddo. Although we do have the NATO TCA option who although they scare me fartless will at least pick you up at home plate and deliver you at your destination (for NATO Force Command Exercises only).
Both excuses are bollox, if we can happily pick you up from wogga wogga land with the help of a MAMS team and the obligitory scuffer we can certainly pick you up from Waddo As regards Custom's us ALM's carry all the required paperwork and your stations plod can act as liason which seems to satisfy HM Customs.
The lack of loading equipment is a definate problem but for the standard flat floor move it is another red herring.
It's simply a cost thing so level complaints at your budget holder