Korean Air road show dates ME
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It proofs again that having a valid license outside the UAE is vital; especially "before" one resigns! Know of two guys over the last few months that had serious validation issues with the GCAA.
GET YOUR LICENSES IN ORDER IN YOUR HOME COUNTRY NOW! It might cost a bit of money to keep a valid type rating in order, but believe me it is cheap insurance the day you need it.
GET YOUR LICENSES IN ORDER IN YOUR HOME COUNTRY NOW! It might cost a bit of money to keep a valid type rating in order, but believe me it is cheap insurance the day you need it.
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Would you mind giving us some details about Korean ? How many actual days you spend back home ? 3-4 trips a month? Can you request 11 days at the end of a month followed by 11 at the beginning of the next one ? Any Info from ex EK drivers would be highly appreciated comparing lifestyles.
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New info from the Korean Roadshow in Dubai....
Well don't know if you'd call it new, but one ex-EK Captain now working for Korean gave a little presentation on the day, and is more than happy with his new life in Seoul, and his 11 consecutive days a month at home. He confirmed that ex EK guys are well thought of by Korean (they've probably all still got the big EK-Escape smile on!) and the company is very happy to take more from DXB. Particularly from those airlines that don't seem to comprehend the concept of quality of life.
It was stated that no ex-EK guy has ever failed to get on line with Korean, after joining. Typical medical failure rate about 5% of new joiners, and pay during training reduced by about 20% from normal approx. 3-5 months to get on line after arriving in Seoul. Screening process (in Seoul) can be split up should one be lacking in sufficient consecutive days off to do it all in one go.....
Money not the best, but lifestyle would seem to suit many. Reverse basing was also discussed, though it would appear KE are aiming to have most folks commute (9 days off per month, + 2 leave days, + 3 travel days = 14 days off the job, which achieves 11 consecutive days at home). Some KE expats have over 20 years service.
Good luck to all who may wish to go for it.
It was stated that no ex-EK guy has ever failed to get on line with Korean, after joining. Typical medical failure rate about 5% of new joiners, and pay during training reduced by about 20% from normal approx. 3-5 months to get on line after arriving in Seoul. Screening process (in Seoul) can be split up should one be lacking in sufficient consecutive days off to do it all in one go.....
Money not the best, but lifestyle would seem to suit many. Reverse basing was also discussed, though it would appear KE are aiming to have most folks commute (9 days off per month, + 2 leave days, + 3 travel days = 14 days off the job, which achieves 11 consecutive days at home). Some KE expats have over 20 years service.
Good luck to all who may wish to go for it.
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Thanks for the info.
Just playing devil' s advocate here, but how exactly is 11 days at home (using annual leave) and 18 days at work every month good lifestyle? All of this with major jetlags.
I am sure it works for people and there's many worse deals around, and I'm sure they have great airplanes to fly. But is the 11 days at home really the selling point?
Just trying to get the general views here, but I'd be more attracted to moving my family to a nice expat enviroment with decent enough rosters and get on with it.
Just playing devil' s advocate here, but how exactly is 11 days at home (using annual leave) and 18 days at work every month good lifestyle? All of this with major jetlags.
I am sure it works for people and there's many worse deals around, and I'm sure they have great airplanes to fly. But is the 11 days at home really the selling point?
Just trying to get the general views here, but I'd be more attracted to moving my family to a nice expat enviroment with decent enough rosters and get on with it.
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bringbackthe80s......
You are of course correct that 11 days at home may or may not be everybody's idea of a good lifestyle. The words 'good lifestyle' here are totally subjective, depending on one's expectations, and current or previous working patterns.
My previous post above is by nature somewhat brief, and more feel-good factors were mentioned at the roadshow. The timing of the block days off is routinely adjustable by negotiation between rostering and the crew member, and allegedly it seems possible to arrange one's time off to coincide with family holidays, birthdays etc. There was a claim that home time for Christmas and birthdays is rarely ever missed. On the B777, nil night turns, and layovers for almost any duration of sector, even after a 90 minute hop to Japan.
The 11 days off may suit those guys perhaps who don't have to travel too far, or cross too many time zones to get home. Perhaps Seoul is better positioned for those commuting to the east coast of Australia, to New Zealand or living in South East Asia.
It's not Nirvana, but it is an alternative. As you say, you are looking for "a nice expat environment with decent enough rosters". (That certainly rules out the Middle East in general, as any concept of good lifestyle is long gone.) Please feel free to post on here when you find one that works!
My previous post above is by nature somewhat brief, and more feel-good factors were mentioned at the roadshow. The timing of the block days off is routinely adjustable by negotiation between rostering and the crew member, and allegedly it seems possible to arrange one's time off to coincide with family holidays, birthdays etc. There was a claim that home time for Christmas and birthdays is rarely ever missed. On the B777, nil night turns, and layovers for almost any duration of sector, even after a 90 minute hop to Japan.
The 11 days off may suit those guys perhaps who don't have to travel too far, or cross too many time zones to get home. Perhaps Seoul is better positioned for those commuting to the east coast of Australia, to New Zealand or living in South East Asia.
It's not Nirvana, but it is an alternative. As you say, you are looking for "a nice expat environment with decent enough rosters". (That certainly rules out the Middle East in general, as any concept of good lifestyle is long gone.) Please feel free to post on here when you find one that works!
The Bumblebee
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Thanks for the info.
Just playing devil' s advocate here, but how exactly is 11 days at home (using annual leave) and 18 days at work every month good lifestyle? All of this with major jetlags.
I am sure it works for people and there's many worse deals around, and I'm sure they have great airplanes to fly. But is the 11 days at home really the selling point?
Just trying to get the general views here, but I'd be more attracted to moving my family to a nice expat enviroment with decent enough rosters and get on with it.
Just playing devil' s advocate here, but how exactly is 11 days at home (using annual leave) and 18 days at work every month good lifestyle? All of this with major jetlags.
I am sure it works for people and there's many worse deals around, and I'm sure they have great airplanes to fly. But is the 11 days at home really the selling point?
Just trying to get the general views here, but I'd be more attracted to moving my family to a nice expat enviroment with decent enough rosters and get on with it.
It may not be much, but ask all the pilots in ME whose families has had enough of ME and wanted to move back home; it is a blessing for them. I guess 11 days at home are a lot better then living away all the time. Having said that, it is not everyone's cup of tea. Living out of suitcase for 16 days gets old very fast, and jet lag is something you have to cope with every month if you live in EU or US.
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I'm not convinced that moving to Korea will be in the best interest of my famil either, 11 days off or not .
Not when there is a nut job North of the DMZ with his nukes pointing South & with Trump rattling his cage.
Not when there is a nut job North of the DMZ with his nukes pointing South & with Trump rattling his cage.
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commuting sucks no matter which airline you fly for
been there done it (same time zone) for over 12 years, never again
people seem to overlook poor pay at Korean to just commute home. this may be OK for the first 6 months but after that, you will not be happy with poor pay and living out of a suitcase.
good luck
been there done it (same time zone) for over 12 years, never again
people seem to overlook poor pay at Korean to just commute home. this may be OK for the first 6 months but after that, you will not be happy with poor pay and living out of a suitcase.
good luck
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If you are someone who places money above everything else then, no, Korean is not for you. There are better paying gigs out there. However as you should be painfully aware, that money comes at an extreme cost. If you are still residing in the M E then clearly you will put up with a lot of $@it to claim a 'tax free' salary that has not kept pace. If you're never home and flying the back side of the clock living in an expensive polluted city with a toxic mindset how does 'living out of a suitcase' for 17 days a month become a death sentence when compared to the sewer you wade through daily?
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commuting sucks no matter which airline you fly for
been there done it (same time zone) for over 12 years, never again
people seem to overlook poor pay at Korean to just commute home. this may be OK for the first 6 months but after that, you will not be happy with poor pay and living out of a suitcase.
good luck
been there done it (same time zone) for over 12 years, never again
people seem to overlook poor pay at Korean to just commute home. this may be OK for the first 6 months but after that, you will not be happy with poor pay and living out of a suitcase.
good luck
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If you are someone who places money above everything else then, no, Korean is not for you. There are better paying gigs out there. However as you should be painfully aware, that money comes at an extreme cost. If you are still residing in the M E then clearly you will put up with a lot of $@it to claim a 'tax free' salary that has not kept pace. If you're never home and flying the back side of the clock living in an expensive polluted city with a toxic mindset how does 'living out of a suitcase' for 17 days a month become a death sentence when compared to the sewer you wade through daily?
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I wouldn't live there either. Difference is those cities post pollution levels.....UAE doesn't. Particulate in the ME is often just as bad and worse as Asian cities given time of year and weather conditions. Given the choice, I'll raise my kids in a place with clean air and food that is grown locally. It's hard to put a price tag on the things these expat posts cannot offer.
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Guys a few things to consider about this mob.. korean air..
1) You will have the run around to get all the docs they need ... They will not give you any docs if you want to leave them ... nothing ..
2)Training is a nightmare .. Makes our guy that went to Qatar and back look like an angel , at least he can fly also.. these guys if you get the wrong one will speak to you like you are a worthless piece of snake sh1t
A guy .. ex EK was failed because he planned for an intersection and took full length ... the point is common sense is not that common here .. ... its a joke seriously , will do your head in..
3)On your contract you are allowed to have travel tickets after sim completion , well try to take them and they get denied , you can be stuck in the hotel between 4-6 months and not allowed to go home even if you have 10-14 days between training flights...
4)there was a German guy here a while back who got super depressed or just more depressed then others about being stuck here .. long story short .. his classmates helped him , the agency looked the other way and just dumped his arse at the end ... his brother had cancer and these idiots did not care ...
5)staff travel is another joke , you only get a few tickets up gradable and the rest are in economy with no upgrade option .... to book the tickets .. is another run around between the office and airport .. where you can spend the whole afternoon or morning to issue them .. after applying days ago.
6)Dont ever think you will get an increase either , they have not given pay rises in 7 years .. and they are not going to either.. the locals are always on strike and nothing changes ..
The locals hates Korean air and they are getting more annoyed with EK guys joining as it does not help them getting an increase... they tell me as i fly with Union guys ... so a pass here will not be guaranteed as they want to prove a point..
7)New email came out today ,.... Korean air advertise you can use your GD travel every month to a different port in the network .... Like you live in LAS and commute there and back ... but because of family over xmas you decide to nominate NY the next month ... Now not allowed anymore you have to go to LAS or you have to buy your own ticket to NY in Y class ...this contract is going to sh1t....
8) The contact company will just tell you all the things they think is good ... when you have an issue with KAL ,the agency will look the other way ... small things like leave , off days which does not add up ...the koreans in the office will tell you to call the agency , so it becomes a huge problem because they know the contract company will not back you .... These girls play the dumb innocent asian girl but will rape your arse with no remorse ....and play dumb with broken english ...
9)They advertise 9 days plus 2 and all these great things but when you get the contract , only like days before you suppose to start here , well it sings a different tune ,,, 6hard days off and 3 soft days , which means when these jokers strike you may only be given 6 days off and not 9 or when you are home they will call you back and if you dont show they take money off your pay again and tells you that you need to monitor the crewlink ... then it becomes you and agent and kal in a ping pong game again ... very unpleasant ..
10)Its a lonely 3 weeks and none of the koreans will mix with you , they dont even mix with each other .. if you love living out of a suitcase will then maybe, but its a horrible life ...its depressing and your family suffers too.
11)dont think for one minute you will fly less .. you will be going up and down over the pacific like no tomorrow , up to 4 times a month .. so they factor too.. you will do up 85-90 with factoring and if you add the travel days will lets say 12 each way thats another 24hrs in a tube... 1st 2 days at home you are so jet lagged and useless and then the 1st 2 days in ICN you are stuffed too...
Its just some of the many things to think about coming here ... In EK you can always call someone or go and see someone or do something about a problem or issue about safety , here there is no support and they do what they want and say its in the contract and its no where to be found and then who do you call ?, and then that guy speaks no english and its just so impossible .. its crazy ..
Lets just say most guys really hate it here and some wants to go back to EK even ... this is not what its advertised and most people feel conned .. another scam ?
think well and very hard ... they money sucks big time and is NOT worth the hassle at all...
With the winds... much of china pollution hits korea too .. some days it thick smog or yellow dust ..
1) You will have the run around to get all the docs they need ... They will not give you any docs if you want to leave them ... nothing ..
2)Training is a nightmare .. Makes our guy that went to Qatar and back look like an angel , at least he can fly also.. these guys if you get the wrong one will speak to you like you are a worthless piece of snake sh1t
A guy .. ex EK was failed because he planned for an intersection and took full length ... the point is common sense is not that common here .. ... its a joke seriously , will do your head in..
3)On your contract you are allowed to have travel tickets after sim completion , well try to take them and they get denied , you can be stuck in the hotel between 4-6 months and not allowed to go home even if you have 10-14 days between training flights...
4)there was a German guy here a while back who got super depressed or just more depressed then others about being stuck here .. long story short .. his classmates helped him , the agency looked the other way and just dumped his arse at the end ... his brother had cancer and these idiots did not care ...
5)staff travel is another joke , you only get a few tickets up gradable and the rest are in economy with no upgrade option .... to book the tickets .. is another run around between the office and airport .. where you can spend the whole afternoon or morning to issue them .. after applying days ago.
6)Dont ever think you will get an increase either , they have not given pay rises in 7 years .. and they are not going to either.. the locals are always on strike and nothing changes ..
The locals hates Korean air and they are getting more annoyed with EK guys joining as it does not help them getting an increase... they tell me as i fly with Union guys ... so a pass here will not be guaranteed as they want to prove a point..
7)New email came out today ,.... Korean air advertise you can use your GD travel every month to a different port in the network .... Like you live in LAS and commute there and back ... but because of family over xmas you decide to nominate NY the next month ... Now not allowed anymore you have to go to LAS or you have to buy your own ticket to NY in Y class ...this contract is going to sh1t....
8) The contact company will just tell you all the things they think is good ... when you have an issue with KAL ,the agency will look the other way ... small things like leave , off days which does not add up ...the koreans in the office will tell you to call the agency , so it becomes a huge problem because they know the contract company will not back you .... These girls play the dumb innocent asian girl but will rape your arse with no remorse ....and play dumb with broken english ...
9)They advertise 9 days plus 2 and all these great things but when you get the contract , only like days before you suppose to start here , well it sings a different tune ,,, 6hard days off and 3 soft days , which means when these jokers strike you may only be given 6 days off and not 9 or when you are home they will call you back and if you dont show they take money off your pay again and tells you that you need to monitor the crewlink ... then it becomes you and agent and kal in a ping pong game again ... very unpleasant ..
10)Its a lonely 3 weeks and none of the koreans will mix with you , they dont even mix with each other .. if you love living out of a suitcase will then maybe, but its a horrible life ...its depressing and your family suffers too.
11)dont think for one minute you will fly less .. you will be going up and down over the pacific like no tomorrow , up to 4 times a month .. so they factor too.. you will do up 85-90 with factoring and if you add the travel days will lets say 12 each way thats another 24hrs in a tube... 1st 2 days at home you are so jet lagged and useless and then the 1st 2 days in ICN you are stuffed too...
Its just some of the many things to think about coming here ... In EK you can always call someone or go and see someone or do something about a problem or issue about safety , here there is no support and they do what they want and say its in the contract and its no where to be found and then who do you call ?, and then that guy speaks no english and its just so impossible .. its crazy ..
Lets just say most guys really hate it here and some wants to go back to EK even ... this is not what its advertised and most people feel conned .. another scam ?
think well and very hard ... they money sucks big time and is NOT worth the hassle at all...
With the winds... much of china pollution hits korea too .. some days it thick smog or yellow dust ..
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yep. cancelled them also from my list because of the above mentioned reasons.. 4 months away from family during training....never ever in my life. yes Korean, I do have a life.
And all the selections and training from scratch after nearly 12 years worldwide ops here on the 777... These guys need to get real....
Good luck to those who make the jump. Not for everyone, especially not when u want to live in Europe....
And all the selections and training from scratch after nearly 12 years worldwide ops here on the 777... These guys need to get real....
Good luck to those who make the jump. Not for everyone, especially not when u want to live in Europe....
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It's OK. But I'd suggest try China first. Although most of us plod along for years it's not a healthy life. Maybe better to make some fast cash and semi-retire to a part time job at your local hardware store..
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You would have to be pretty desperate to leave EK for KR. Most go there after getting fired from current employer!
If you do choose it , the points above are all correct. The best place to get info is at the bar in the icheon Hyatt , where there are any number of crew passing the time of day.
If you do choose it , the points above are all correct. The best place to get info is at the bar in the icheon Hyatt , where there are any number of crew passing the time of day.
