Dust off those ASR and Fatigue Forms Boys
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Join Date: Jan 2008
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Dust off those ASR and Fatigue Forms Boys
Well, Just when you thought they couldn't be that stupid, here they go again. Starting on the 13th of March, the IAH layover is going to 25 hours. I guess the last time they tried that and got destroyed by ASR's has long since been forgotten. As if the Chicago ASR's for too short a layover weren't good enough. I for one will have my pen ready if they give me one of these trips.
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Perhaps it's time to get in touch directly with the Houston FAA FSDO office and see what they have to say about the issue?
FAA Houston Flight Standards District Office
FAA Houston Flight Standards District Office
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It maybe legal but is it safe?
As we saw with the recent white out conditions in JFK, a layover was legally reduced to 12 hours in the hotel. Exceptional weather conditions I will admit but this highlighted that the ULR regulations are not even worth the paper they are written on.
With IAH, the company is turning its back on a paper trail that colleagues have generated highlighting that 24 hours is insufficient and it is clear that the paper trail that was created, did not carry enough weight to prevent this change. More ASRs and FRMS forms will in my view, be futile. Will DFW be next?
As we saw with the recent white out conditions in JFK, a layover was legally reduced to 12 hours in the hotel. Exceptional weather conditions I will admit but this highlighted that the ULR regulations are not even worth the paper they are written on.
With IAH, the company is turning its back on a paper trail that colleagues have generated highlighting that 24 hours is insufficient and it is clear that the paper trail that was created, did not carry enough weight to prevent this change. More ASRs and FRMS forms will in my view, be futile. Will DFW be next?
short flights long nights
And I get asked...please tell us why you have resigned
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Calls being made with "deals".
Some March IAH layovers are 24 hours and others are 48 hours, it appears to be random. Some creative accounting in an attempt to keep the wheels on? Well over 100 hours on my schedule anyway.
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I didn't look into it, so I have no idea why they are going to try the 24hr thing again, but for sure it isn't because we lack pilots. On the A380 we are not limited by minimum days off, but by flying hours. Reducing the layover by a day will give them an extra day in DXB, but the hours won't be affected, so it is useless.
I think it's just reducing layover cost (hotel and allowances). Beancounter stuff...
I think it's just reducing layover cost (hotel and allowances). Beancounter stuff...
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Just call in sick fatigued IN HOUSTON! That would be a start.
Complaining does not help, fatigue reports after the flights just makes them chuckle. So go fatigued where you actually are fatigued -> in Houston!!.
The OMA tells you to consider "anticipated" safety hampering fatigue, so just do it.
Start acting like playing with Pro V1X and don't continue working with your lame range balls .........
(the T7 guys managed to get back 48 hours, so you super-giga-duper-guys should manage the same easily, don't you?)
Complaining does not help, fatigue reports after the flights just makes them chuckle. So go fatigued where you actually are fatigued -> in Houston!!.
The OMA tells you to consider "anticipated" safety hampering fatigue, so just do it.
Start acting like playing with Pro V1X and don't continue working with your lame range balls .........
(the T7 guys managed to get back 48 hours, so you super-giga-duper-guys should manage the same easily, don't you?)
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Just remember to stay anonymous if you report to the FAA. Wouldn't want to get fired the way the cabin crew did for reporting the JFK illegally short layover during the snowstorm.
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Does EK recommend sleeping patterns for the flight particularly for the Flight Deck? e.g. on-board and at HOU.
On paper it looks horrendous, even with bunks.
How many days off after the trip?
On paper it looks horrendous, even with bunks.
How many days off after the trip?
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It will do no good to call the FAA or the local FSDO. Is EK in compliance with the set forth FTDTLs of the GCAA? Yes. The FAA audits the GCAA from time to time and they have found them in compliance to whatever standard has been set by the FAA. Secondly the U.S. carriers flying into DXB only have 24 hour layovers after 15 hours of flight time. Yes, they are not flying 92 hours but that has nothing to do with a rotation and it's rest before and after a ULR.
The carriers outside of the U.S. do not have to adhere to U.S rules and regs with regard to things like this. Remember "foreign" carriers were flying into the U.S. with over 60 year old pilots at the helm before the FAA changed the mandatory retirement age limit.
And lastly, it may not change the max monthly rate, BUT, it allows more work days like PPCs, CRM, SEP and squeezing in a ULR during a leave month. It allows more flexibility in rostering you. Looking at it in another way 60 captains and 60 copilots required for a 30 day month. That's 120 work days now available per month in the overall manning. And we all know, there are plenty of work days with zero credit.
The carriers outside of the U.S. do not have to adhere to U.S rules and regs with regard to things like this. Remember "foreign" carriers were flying into the U.S. with over 60 year old pilots at the helm before the FAA changed the mandatory retirement age limit.
And lastly, it may not change the max monthly rate, BUT, it allows more work days like PPCs, CRM, SEP and squeezing in a ULR during a leave month. It allows more flexibility in rostering you. Looking at it in another way 60 captains and 60 copilots required for a 30 day month. That's 120 work days now available per month in the overall manning. And we all know, there are plenty of work days with zero credit.
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Come on guys, lets give the bean counters and management credit where its due.
They have been striving to reduce costs and this one would be another winner.
Not only will it encourage more people to consider there options here, but will also further discourage anyone ( unless absolutely desperate from joining) its a win win for them costs come write down.
Only downside them big things with wings will be a bit more difficult to fly, however while sitting on the ground due lack of staff all round they won't be burning fuel therefore saving even more money.
They have been striving to reduce costs and this one would be another winner.
Not only will it encourage more people to consider there options here, but will also further discourage anyone ( unless absolutely desperate from joining) its a win win for them costs come write down.
Only downside them big things with wings will be a bit more difficult to fly, however while sitting on the ground due lack of staff all round they won't be burning fuel therefore saving even more money.
Get together and produce a well written and researched letter with factual analysis regarding the trip construction and fatigue issues and send it to the editors of Houston news media as well as other large Texas news and TV media.
While you're at it, send a copy to the legal departments of the major Texas oil producer and services companies. Once that's done, they now share liability for their employees with EK. US lawsuit territory. Once they know about dodgy practices, they have to consider the transportation they use to ship their employees.
Want to start a sheet storm? Do it right.
Just an outside observer opinion.
While you're at it, send a copy to the legal departments of the major Texas oil producer and services companies. Once that's done, they now share liability for their employees with EK. US lawsuit territory. Once they know about dodgy practices, they have to consider the transportation they use to ship their employees.
Want to start a sheet storm? Do it right.
Just an outside observer opinion.
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The worst part; my pet peeve.
No attempt at collaboration from fleet to engage the pilot group. Just sneak it in there after six years of 48 hrs.
Any chance of an email a la "Look guys we're in danger of parking planes, it's a crisis, we need your help for a while and here is what we are prepared to give back"
And because of no engagement it becomes a self perpetuating Greek tragedy...no engagement, no loyalty ...more attrition.
It's like a watching a train wreck that can be prevented while the guy up the front will continue to go past the red signal while we scratch our heads ... Why oh why?
f.
No attempt at collaboration from fleet to engage the pilot group. Just sneak it in there after six years of 48 hrs.
Any chance of an email a la "Look guys we're in danger of parking planes, it's a crisis, we need your help for a while and here is what we are prepared to give back"
And because of no engagement it becomes a self perpetuating Greek tragedy...no engagement, no loyalty ...more attrition.
It's like a watching a train wreck that can be prevented while the guy up the front will continue to go past the red signal while we scratch our heads ... Why oh why?
f.
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Mr Angry, EK does recommend sleep/rest patterns for all ULR pairings, although they are apparently produced by people who have only ever done one from the comfort of a first class suite and therefore didn't find it the least bit tiring.
These 15 hour plus ULR pairing are horrible but what makes them worse is the other stuff they fill a roster up with as well.
The required rest after one of these epics is 2 days, and often that is all we get.
These 15 hour plus ULR pairing are horrible but what makes them worse is the other stuff they fill a roster up with as well.
The required rest after one of these epics is 2 days, and often that is all we get.