Actual take-home salary DEC Flydubai
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I don't take anything personal as I have my career plan but for more than 5 years now some pilots have been trying to achieve what you are wishing for BUT it didn't happen...
WHY ?
Most probably for the same reason that for more than 10 years now pilots complain at Ryanair and things have not improved at all , it's even getting worse because of one main reason selfishness and lack of action from enough pilot within the company.
It is the same here at FZ nothing will change and they always will find enough pilots like Ryanair and the like have because the guys joining are not planning to stay but to get something then leave .
Looking for a type jet rating , a command upgrade , some tax free money etc...
If you really wants to see changes it will not be by dividing the workforce but by finding a way to unite them and work together.
For that I wish you all the best because when I see that pilots need to give money to find some fellows to accept to swap some flights to help them I am not very optimistic.
I have never ask for any money to help out any pilot when it was possible and I have even been flying to Kabul , Kandahar etc... just to help.
And I have never call sick to avoid flying to those places , forcing some fellow pilots on standby to fly to it like some other guys.
With this kind of behavior I don't have a lot of hope for the future here...
WHY ?
Most probably for the same reason that for more than 10 years now pilots complain at Ryanair and things have not improved at all , it's even getting worse because of one main reason selfishness and lack of action from enough pilot within the company.
It is the same here at FZ nothing will change and they always will find enough pilots like Ryanair and the like have because the guys joining are not planning to stay but to get something then leave .
Looking for a type jet rating , a command upgrade , some tax free money etc...
If you really wants to see changes it will not be by dividing the workforce but by finding a way to unite them and work together.
For that I wish you all the best because when I see that pilots need to give money to find some fellows to accept to swap some flights to help them I am not very optimistic.
I have never ask for any money to help out any pilot when it was possible and I have even been flying to Kabul , Kandahar etc... just to help.
And I have never call sick to avoid flying to those places , forcing some fellow pilots on standby to fly to it like some other guys.
With this kind of behavior I don't have a lot of hope for the future here...
Join Date: Mar 2010
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Counter point to "Pole Shift."
If you join FZ today as DEC, we have 39 airplanes, just over 600 pilots.
At a rate of roughly 1 New Boeing/month and staffing of roughly 7 crews per jet, by next August, there will be another 12 jets and 84 pilots.
By years end, all 19 local Emirati F/O's will have moved on to Emirates. Our best to them, they've proved themselves worthy aviators!
Bang, you moved up 100 numbers in 1 year, without any normal attrition. So far, I've "heard" there have been 30+ resignations this year. Now you've moved up even more..
There are roughly 30 "A-Scale" captains left, of which about 1/2 have other roles in the company, such as training, recruiting, etc. Don't mention A Scale again. Their T&C's have remained unchanged since before A6-FDA arrived.
In 2 years, you will have at least 200 people junior to you in the company. Ive been here 4 years, and have over 400 people junior to me.
When pole shift says you will "NEVER be able to get a decent roster," it's BS! This company is growing so fast, that by the time you renew your visa, you will be in the middle of the pack.
Upgrades: Since upgrade #1, upgrades have kept their seniority. Since this company started, it has always been that way. 132 pages of pprune to read thru can confirm this..
If someone who came before you (SENIOR to you) as an F/O passes the upgrade, then they are still senior to you, as they have always been. You've just been lucky enough to have joined when we were hiring DEC's. There are many pilots here who came as F/O's during non DEC times, who were qualified as Capts when they joined.
COO email: A number of new pilots, unhappy with the PBS "allegedly" approached the CP with the idea of a petition to change PBS. COO email was to clarify the company's position.
As further destinations are added to the list, as winter approaches in the north, and the "super senior" get bored with Belgrade, Skopje, and the likes, things will improve for the more junior pilots. Mr pole shift has written mostly negative posts about being a FZ pilot, I read every one of his posts today.
I joined before we had any Russian. Ukraine, or other long flights. BEY was the longest, Baku was the furthest north. Soon, CMB night turn was the longest, I had 3 in sept 2010, as well as multiple day/night combos. We could only request 2 days off for the next month, had to be in by the 5th of the previous month.
And who can forget the 0200 DXB DOH DXB MCT DXB double sector, ending at 0940 when you were lucky?
So PBS isn't perfect, but it is able to give you up to 4 days off in a row, more if you really try. You can choose your poison, knowing your time at the bottom of the heap is going to be about 2 years. But now, there is a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
Now, Its time to bid for next month..
More "injustice" I assume..
Cheers mate!
At a rate of roughly 1 New Boeing/month and staffing of roughly 7 crews per jet, by next August, there will be another 12 jets and 84 pilots.
By years end, all 19 local Emirati F/O's will have moved on to Emirates. Our best to them, they've proved themselves worthy aviators!
Bang, you moved up 100 numbers in 1 year, without any normal attrition. So far, I've "heard" there have been 30+ resignations this year. Now you've moved up even more..
There are roughly 30 "A-Scale" captains left, of which about 1/2 have other roles in the company, such as training, recruiting, etc. Don't mention A Scale again. Their T&C's have remained unchanged since before A6-FDA arrived.
In 2 years, you will have at least 200 people junior to you in the company. Ive been here 4 years, and have over 400 people junior to me.
When pole shift says you will "NEVER be able to get a decent roster," it's BS! This company is growing so fast, that by the time you renew your visa, you will be in the middle of the pack.
Upgrades: Since upgrade #1, upgrades have kept their seniority. Since this company started, it has always been that way. 132 pages of pprune to read thru can confirm this..
If someone who came before you (SENIOR to you) as an F/O passes the upgrade, then they are still senior to you, as they have always been. You've just been lucky enough to have joined when we were hiring DEC's. There are many pilots here who came as F/O's during non DEC times, who were qualified as Capts when they joined.
COO email: A number of new pilots, unhappy with the PBS "allegedly" approached the CP with the idea of a petition to change PBS. COO email was to clarify the company's position.
As further destinations are added to the list, as winter approaches in the north, and the "super senior" get bored with Belgrade, Skopje, and the likes, things will improve for the more junior pilots. Mr pole shift has written mostly negative posts about being a FZ pilot, I read every one of his posts today.
I joined before we had any Russian. Ukraine, or other long flights. BEY was the longest, Baku was the furthest north. Soon, CMB night turn was the longest, I had 3 in sept 2010, as well as multiple day/night combos. We could only request 2 days off for the next month, had to be in by the 5th of the previous month.
And who can forget the 0200 DXB DOH DXB MCT DXB double sector, ending at 0940 when you were lucky?
So PBS isn't perfect, but it is able to give you up to 4 days off in a row, more if you really try. You can choose your poison, knowing your time at the bottom of the heap is going to be about 2 years. But now, there is a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.
Now, Its time to bid for next month..
More "injustice" I assume..
Cheers mate!
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MCO951 ,
GREAT POST maybe one of the best since the thread about Flydubai has started...
I back up what you have said 100% and wish to see more people like you posting here to reflect more the reality at FZ and not only the exaggerated frustration of a very small amount.
GREAT POST maybe one of the best since the thread about Flydubai has started...
I back up what you have said 100% and wish to see more people like you posting here to reflect more the reality at FZ and not only the exaggerated frustration of a very small amount.
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Couldn't agree more, MCO951's post is a true and accurate account of Flydubai today. I personally am now in my 6th year with the company, so I've had the bad times and am now reaping the benefits of seniority.....long may it last!
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Agree with the three above.
I am one of these dirty rotten A scalers and like all my aviation brothers, we are VERY happy with this PBS system. Why is it fair that someone who joins the company now has the pick of the trips when I and many others had rosters that brought grown men to their knees? Too many 24 hr rest periods, the 0210 four sector as mentioned, etc
We have this seniority based system now almost as a thanks and well done for putting up with so many bad rosters during the last few years. It ain't gonna change and so if you don't like or don't want it then please do not sign your contract and if you do sign then stop bleating about how you consider it to be so unfair and instead put the time in because as MCO says, you seniority is only ever going to go up.
Oh and by the way it's not only PBS's fault if you get a bad roster. I have seen some shocking bidding and frankly it's a wonder that people complain when they have done such a dross job in bidding in the first place.
It's a bit like an FMC, crap in - crap out.
I am one of these dirty rotten A scalers and like all my aviation brothers, we are VERY happy with this PBS system. Why is it fair that someone who joins the company now has the pick of the trips when I and many others had rosters that brought grown men to their knees? Too many 24 hr rest periods, the 0210 four sector as mentioned, etc
We have this seniority based system now almost as a thanks and well done for putting up with so many bad rosters during the last few years. It ain't gonna change and so if you don't like or don't want it then please do not sign your contract and if you do sign then stop bleating about how you consider it to be so unfair and instead put the time in because as MCO says, you seniority is only ever going to go up.
Oh and by the way it's not only PBS's fault if you get a bad roster. I have seen some shocking bidding and frankly it's a wonder that people complain when they have done such a dross job in bidding in the first place.
It's a bit like an FMC, crap in - crap out.
Join Date: Mar 2010
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Missing Randy BMC
Before I joined FZ, "Randy BMC" was the voice of reason.
He was instrumental in helping me make an informed decision whether or not to uproot my family and take a chance on a new airline.
I do not pretend to be a replacement for Randy, but I think it is important for an objective description to still be provided on this forum.
There are many pros and cons to moving here, flying here, and living here.
We are in the midst of a major growth period. I want people who join us to be well informed, so when they come, there are no surprises.
If any pilot is seriously considering joining FZ, please read all the info you can, read the negative, filter what you need.
Check Property Real Estate for Sale and Rent. Jobs in the Middle East and North Africa , Free Classifieds in with Dubizzle.com for prices of villas or flats, autos, furniture, etc. Look on google maps where you think you want to live.
I did all of this before I came here, so when I arrived, there weren't many surprises.
FZ is a good job. It may not be the best job in aviation, in the expat world, or even in Dubai. It is what you make of it. Right now, it is the best job for me, and for my family.
With the exception of the multi-level car park, every one of the changes (future improvements) described by mgmt before I joined, have come true. Change comes slowly, but eventually
I really only want to work with people who want to be here.
I didn't include the dubizzle link, it popped in after I posted..
Disclaimer: this is not an endorsement for said website..
He was instrumental in helping me make an informed decision whether or not to uproot my family and take a chance on a new airline.
I do not pretend to be a replacement for Randy, but I think it is important for an objective description to still be provided on this forum.
There are many pros and cons to moving here, flying here, and living here.
We are in the midst of a major growth period. I want people who join us to be well informed, so when they come, there are no surprises.
If any pilot is seriously considering joining FZ, please read all the info you can, read the negative, filter what you need.
Check Property Real Estate for Sale and Rent. Jobs in the Middle East and North Africa , Free Classifieds in with Dubizzle.com for prices of villas or flats, autos, furniture, etc. Look on google maps where you think you want to live.
I did all of this before I came here, so when I arrived, there weren't many surprises.
FZ is a good job. It may not be the best job in aviation, in the expat world, or even in Dubai. It is what you make of it. Right now, it is the best job for me, and for my family.
With the exception of the multi-level car park, every one of the changes (future improvements) described by mgmt before I joined, have come true. Change comes slowly, but eventually
I really only want to work with people who want to be here.
I didn't include the dubizzle link, it popped in after I posted..
Disclaimer: this is not an endorsement for said website..
Last edited by MCO951; 19th Aug 2014 at 08:36. Reason: Description of dubizzle link
Join Date: May 2008
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To the DECs, Ok your roster is going to be 'poor' for the next 2 years, but you are going to earn Approx 12,000AED more a month than if you joined at your correct seniority rank (an FO).
That's an extra salary of 288,000AED+ over the 2 years. - There's your compensation for your poor rosters.
If your rosters are that bad, ask for a demotion and give up the extra cash. Simple
That's an extra salary of 288,000AED+ over the 2 years. - There's your compensation for your poor rosters.
If your rosters are that bad, ask for a demotion and give up the extra cash. Simple
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I kind of think that the truth is somewhere in the middle. Of course seniority is to be respected, but asking for demotion to get a good roster I believe is an exaggeration.
At the end of the day is what one makes of it. FZ is a good company to be part of, but it has the potential to become much better.
VL
At the end of the day is what one makes of it. FZ is a good company to be part of, but it has the potential to become much better.
VL
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Guys, pretty old posts... But can anyone explain the overal situation at the moment... I've heard the moral is pretty low.. Apparently an exodus which have the top boys flying also out of their established bidding system!?
Tks
Tks
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I would be looking for inside info as well please.
I applied recently to EK but wondering if maybe FlyDubai would be not the better option(I actually, after 25 years in aviation still enjoy flying , especially shorter sectors) with similar(more or less) pay.
I would be willing to start again as FO(being a capt since 1999), I guess upgrade should be realistic and doable within 1-2 years as long as the company grows.
Any advice on that?
Other question - what is the actual pay(basic+flight pay+housing+education for kids) a FZ FO takes home.
Thanks in advance guys!
I applied recently to EK but wondering if maybe FlyDubai would be not the better option(I actually, after 25 years in aviation still enjoy flying , especially shorter sectors) with similar(more or less) pay.
I would be willing to start again as FO(being a capt since 1999), I guess upgrade should be realistic and doable within 1-2 years as long as the company grows.
Any advice on that?
Other question - what is the actual pay(basic+flight pay+housing+education for kids) a FZ FO takes home.
Thanks in advance guys!
Last edited by Commuter0815; 18th Nov 2015 at 16:08.
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For comparison:
My brother is a 737 LHS in UK
He makes £5knet his wife makes £1.5k net
£6.5k
Mortgage + bills + food+ car etc is £1.5-2k
That leaves him with £4.5-5k to save, invest, drink or whatever. Add to this the fact of 750hrs per year with the only sand being the bi annual holiday to europe.
My brother is a 737 LHS in UK
He makes £5knet his wife makes £1.5k net
£6.5k
Mortgage + bills + food+ car etc is £1.5-2k
That leaves him with £4.5-5k to save, invest, drink or whatever. Add to this the fact of 750hrs per year with the only sand being the bi annual holiday to europe.
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"Mortgage + bills + food+ car etc is £1.5-2k".......
Yea if you own a small terrace house in the north of the UK & drive a second hand Vauxhall Corsa that you and the wife share....
Yea if you own a small terrace house in the north of the UK & drive a second hand Vauxhall Corsa that you and the wife share....
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What is the cost of living in Dubai with EK?
Harrythecod mentioned that he's on 70k a month excluding schooling and provident fund... how does that equate to real terms with living in Dubai?
Just trying to figure out the crossover mark when EK starts taking over CX in take home pay...
Harrythecod mentioned that he's on 70k a month excluding schooling and provident fund... how does that equate to real terms with living in Dubai?
Just trying to figure out the crossover mark when EK starts taking over CX in take home pay...
I believe Harry is a senior Captain, making 70k a month - HK$147,000.
A DEC friend of mine at EK makes about 56k a month - HK$118,000.
In CX (on a local package, including an amortised 13th month and being taxed overall at 13.5%, which is realistic):
- fresh CN makes about HK$159,000 - AED75k, net AED65k
After 2 years, said CX CN makes HK$177,000 - AED83k, net AED71.8k
Additional info -
A CX FO1 makes about HK$109,000 - AED51k, net AED44.1k
A CX SFO1 makes about HK$119,000 - AED56k, net AED48.4k
Based on that, EK take home pay increasing over CX is predicated on getting command far quicker at EK. Whether that materialises is anyone's guess.
I'm an FO1, 4.5 years in, and can only surmise that my command is anywhere from 6-9 years away. If I joined EK now, would it be quicker? Hard to say, but no sure thing.
I'd far rather live in HK, but I would appreciate the better accommodations that my $$ would get me in Dubai.
Food for thought.
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How can you expect an improvement in T&C when they have just reduced the allowance for the annual leave ticket...
Stop dreaming and look at all the Middle East airlines forums and you will see that they continue to squeeze their workforce despite the high attrition rate.
Stop dreaming and look at all the Middle East airlines forums and you will see that they continue to squeeze their workforce despite the high attrition rate.
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How can you expect an improvement in T&C when they have just reduced the allowance for the annual leave ticket...
Stop dreaming and look at all the Middle East airlines forums and you will see that they continue to squeeze their workforce despite the high attrition rate.
Stop dreaming and look at all the Middle East airlines forums and you will see that they continue to squeeze their workforce despite the high attrition rate.
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There will be no improvement in pay or schedules. Transaero just went under, and they won't be the last. FZ survives by hiring pilots from bankrupt airlines. They come here and work happily for a time and then eventually are replaced with new pilots from same circumstances. First it was Excel, Kimber, and a few from North America. Then a few crap carriers from Saudi and Africa supplied the next group. People wanting out of China and the aeroCypo guys came next. Then when it seemed like there would never ever be anymore FOs to hire some office knob said lets hire every last flybe pilot, jet or turbo prop. All I'm saying is this place will find some desperate job seeker to fill the seat. By the time the needy have figured out the dark truth (WHICH IS CLEARLY SPELLED OUT HERE FOR ANYONE WHO BOTHERS TO READ ALL THE PREVIOUS POSTS!) that they will never see the sun or their family during the day again it's too late and they are locked in with loans, school fees, 12 months rental contract, Salik, and a pricey move if you bring the household. Other than that most crew I fly with are fairly pleasant chaps/gals as long as the subjects of salary, health insurance, reimbursements, staff parking, training, crew meals, bid awards, deadheading in row 32, and chief pilots meetings are avoided.
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Is there any fast track to command?
Hello guys
I might be joining FZ at the end of January. I would like to know if there is a chance to upgrade to captain in a short period of time. I am making a big sacrifice at this time since I am getting more money as a Private captain flying a Learjet 60 in my home country than I will make as FZ FO. However I would like to pursue my dream of becoming an airline captain.
I have more than 9000 hours with B737 time and also A320.
Appreciate your inputs.
I will not relocate my family to Dubai until I achieve that since I know the cost of living for my family would be crazy expensive (4 kids)...
I might be joining FZ at the end of January. I would like to know if there is a chance to upgrade to captain in a short period of time. I am making a big sacrifice at this time since I am getting more money as a Private captain flying a Learjet 60 in my home country than I will make as FZ FO. However I would like to pursue my dream of becoming an airline captain.
I have more than 9000 hours with B737 time and also A320.
Appreciate your inputs.
I will not relocate my family to Dubai until I achieve that since I know the cost of living for my family would be crazy expensive (4 kids)...