Repeated warnings, yet still carry on unabated toward a military ship full of fuel? Yet you say this cannot be justified by any sane citizen? Would love to know your definition of sanity.
If you were in charge of said ship armed with the knowledge of what has been done in the past...what would you do, keeping in mind you have the luxury of time...no Armchair Quarterbacking please.
Last edited by yada.yada.yada; 21st Jul 2012 at 15:22.
India fishermen deny US ship warned them in UAE shooting
Quote:
Indian fishermen injured when their boat was shot at by a US Navy ship off the coast of the United Arab Emirates (UAE) say they received no warnings before they came under fire.
Yada- What was the path of the fishing boat. Direct to, or trying to get in front of the ship?
Quote:
If you were in charge of said ship armed with the knowledge of what has been done in the past..
I guess I would be TRIGGER happy/ Twitchy then wouldn't I.
You're welcome, they also have a history of being in harms way so arrogant pricks like you have the liberty to criticize them, walk a mile in their shoes then think about it
Last edited by ironbutt57; 21st Jul 2012 at 16:15.
Ironbutt- You simply cannot refrain from insulting can you? Very typical of someone who cannot string an argument together to save oneself.
Quote:
they also have a history of being in harms way so arrogant pricks like you have the liberty to criticize them
Yes- A layover in Dubai and being beset upon by a fishing boat- is very much in Harms way.
The history of being in harms way rather stems from being placed in Harms way as a result of their own misguided country's foreign policies. You know like the ridding Iraq of its "weapons of mass destruction" (fail), or being in Afghanistan (fail), or supporting Bin Laden in the Afghan-Russian war (fail) or attempting to change regimes in Somalia (fail), or north Korea (Fail) or Vietnam (Fail).
If I were to "walk a mile in their shoes", I sure as hell would be thinking about what the hell I was doing there, and voting quick smart for some one like Ron Paul to hope that I could be extricated from the mess my country had created.
Last edited by Ex A380-800 driver; 21st Jul 2012 at 16:59.
While it sucks what happened, you can't go charging at a US Naval ship and not expect some action. My understanding is they gave out several warnings before firing, and the offending ship didn't respond or change course.
And yes I wish Ron Paul stood a chance, but unfortunately, it's going to be more of the same crap with Obama or Romney.
As an aside ironbutt, Ex380 has spent more time in a military career than his airline one. So, using your logic it would give him some cred in being " arrogant pricks". Remember this Oiler had mostly civilian crew embarked. The protection team on board were contractors. It is action like this by contractors that put serving members greater at risk.
Flyer, they were not charging a USN ship, they were entering port and overtaking the vessel. Ever been to north Island when a Carrier is on the way in or out? No one sits back and waits, there nor here. There is no published notice to mariners stating that USN or any military vessels are to be avoided by any set distance. There is nothing published about horns and whistles being the precursor to being fired upon. Just because some Contractor thinks blowing a horn is a warning doesn't mean anyone else understands what it means.
"If the Yanks did not have such an appalling foreign policy record, then perhaps they would not be targeted every where they go." EX 380
Was our appalling foreign policy such a bad thing when we saved your ass not once but twice last century? How many trillion of dollars did we as "Yanks" have to spend to protect your tiny little island so you didn't have to. How many "Yanks" died on your continent because you as a country were not up to the task. Was this the same foreign policy you find so appalling. Give credit where credit it do. You would be speaking German right now if it wasn't for the appalling Yanks and yes that is arrogant. I am pissed off that we spent all that money and treasure for you ungrateful sap. What did you do in the military X380? I rememeber years ago a British general came and spoke to a civic group in America. He gave a lecture and it waas interesting and everything but towards the end of it he said he would like for the Americans to leave the continent of Europe and especially England. He had his points but someone in the group asked the general if we pulled out would he guarantee never to ask the Americans to come to England's or Europe's aid and send men and material. He didn't answer and moved quickly to end the lecture. Maybe you would like the Chinese to protect you?
think ex380 is aussie, but will never admit it as he's a little confused about his own nationality when he's too busy playing American wanna-be riding his Harley Davidson around Dubai.
At any rate, it doesn't matter which country you're from. Some of the coolest guys at EK are both from UK, AUS etc... Its a melting pot of 3500 pilots.
We are one pilot group and people like don and ex380 destroy morale by their immature rants and generalizations. And I'm not even sure if don and ex380 are the same person with two different accounts. It would be sad if you defend yourself with multiple logins as if you had friends.
This would be a non issue if it was another NATO country ship. It sounds like ex-380 and don were first hand witnesses to the accident so I guess we should trust their discriminative views.
Why do you hate America so much? Jealously? What happened? did JFK controllers hurt your feelings one night? make you feel small? Compensating for vertically challenged deficiency? aka. short pilot syndrome?
who knows, anyway, life is too short to be so angry. Be happy America is protecting Dubai and UAE.
Was our appalling foreign policy such a bad thing when we saved your ass not once but twice last century?
The us indeed saved the day in ww2, but you have to admit the us of 70 years ago is not the same beast as today. Foreign policy wise, it has gone down hill big time.
I cannot conceive how all you yanks are so blind to it. It's a bit like your inability to see your domestic gun law policy is attrocious.
(yet another massacre in public ths time in Denver )
Quote:
I am pissed off that we spent all that money and treasure for you ungrateful sap
lol, and I am pissed off at all that money spent in the last 5 years from your countries appalling economic management. Global financial crisis - a direct result of us greed and stupidity on an epic scale.
Quote:
Why do you hate America so much? Jealously? What happened? did JFK controllers hurt your feelings one night? make you feel small? Compensating for vertically challenged deficiency? aka. short pilot syndrome?
What a silly small minded comment.
Pilot today - I do not hate Americans. I do indeed like Harley's and Apple products and a host of other products from the us, but I am entitled to express a view about government policy am I not?
I have always found the average Iranian person most friendly and sociable, that does not mean I have to condone the actions or policy of the Iranian government.
Back to the incident. The military vessel is full of gantries and the like on the stern. I can see how it would not be clear to the indian crew that it was a yank ship, and in the haze and with the noise of the 3 donks it would be likely they did not hear the warnings. They themselves state they did not receive any warning.
You can spout opinion all ya want ex 380, but they are your biases, and your anti american political views are getting in the way of an intelligent argument should you actually be capable of one. Blaming the shoot up in Colorado on american gun laws reeks of ignorance. Hey there has been a couple shoot ups in a mall in Toronto lately, must be those canadian gun laws and bad canadian attitudes that brought that upon them eh?
Facts in this case are very clear. An american naval ship is not a rare thing in the Gulf, and approach one at your peril. They tried going with no force protection plan and some deranged idiots drove a leaky little boat loaded with lots of stuff that goes boom into the side of a billion dollar Arleigh Burke destroyer and cost 17 navy lives. Now they have force protection on board and very clear well publicized rules of engagement that aren't a secret to anyone. As a boat captain in the Gulf it's your job to be aware of them and abide by the rules..if you don't then you get dead or sunk or both.
They warned the ship off, including warning shots. If you are too unaware and unprofessional to realize that you are in danger approaching a US navy ship in a speedboat in the Gulf and ignore warnings then you really are a master of your own demise. No trigger happy "yanks" there, just simply professional military men doing their job as force protection.
And Don you are incorrect..500 yards is the Naval Vessel Protection Zone, requires slow speed and radio contact, and never closer than 100 yards and it's public knowledge. Look it up if you will. If i know that and i'm not a captain of a commercial boat then there isn't really an excuse for not knowing it. They were also 10 miles out of port, so it's hardly a case of they were heading into port and couldn't avoid them.
You can argue American foreign policy all you want, but at the end of the day if I had to have a country as my ally that most reflected the values in a world where my kids are growing up it would be the Americans. That's my opinion, but it really doesn't affect the facts of the incident off the Jebel Ali coast.
I'm probably not as well informed as you guys on topical US affairs but I take a simplistic view.
The Indian/UAE boat may have been stupid and made a mistake. I don't know the conditions on the day but visibility and seaspray can obscure vision. That US ship does not have a distinct warship profile. A quick glance at the picture and it looks to me like a regular ship. I doubt the UAE boat would have continued its course in the face of a clear warning. Even with the warnings given, clearly they were inadaquate. It was not a terrorist attack and now one of them is dead.
The US ship firing on the UAE boat may be understandable, however, where I come from, a perceived need to defend yourself has never been a reasonable legal defense for killing innocent people(aka murder). People need to be held accountable for their actions, even if it is understandable. I believe it's called manslaughter.
As a 'superpower' the US should hold itself to a higher standard than this......with power comes responsibility. And, yup, if they going go around killing people at will, then we may just as well be protected by the Chinese.....same thing isn't it?
@tbaylx, I have to admit that I am not a fan of US foreign policy, although I agree with you, its a nice country internally(finances aside). However, surely even you have to admit that this cinema shooting is bizarre and your people are asking themeslves how this guy bought 6000 rounds of ammunition without raising suspicion. Freedom has it's limits and I have yet to understand what ordinary citizens need fully automatic rifles for?
Also, I should point out that in the UAE there is no requirement to have a skippers licence for small boats, so why would these guys have known about the 'special' rules of engagement for a US warship? There is no list of rules available domestically, so these guys would not have been aware of these special requirements unless they had googled them beforehand.
