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Old 11th Aug 2017, 18:42   #101 (permalink)
 
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le Pingouin
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Mungo, I'd hazard a guess that most gays are no more or less promiscuous than heterosexuals.
yes.. you are hazarding a guess and it's a pretty lousy one.
My generation grew up enjoying unprotected sex and I personally know of no one who suffered as a result and that was the 60s..when ladies had discovered the pill and life was good.

But we didn't have hundreds of partners and indulge in non biblical practices..at least most of us didn't.. and no I'm not in any way religious. AIDS has been with us in the west since homosexuality was legalized.. not a coincidence.
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Old 11th Aug 2017, 19:32   #102 (permalink)
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AIDS has been with us in the west since homosexuality was legalized.. not a coincidence.
Nuff said......
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Old 11th Aug 2017, 19:33   #103 (permalink)
 
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AIDS has been with us in the west since homosexuality was legalized.. not a coincidence.
Never thought of it that way but I tend to agree.
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Old 11th Aug 2017, 19:43   #104 (permalink)
 
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le Pingouin

AIDS has been with us in the west since homosexuality was legalized.. not a coincidence.
So the gays shagged AIDS into existence then? Took 'em 15 years.

CG
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Old 11th Aug 2017, 20:33   #105 (permalink)
 
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So the gays shagged AIDS into existence then? Took 'em 15 years.
Nobody is suggesting that.. As someone earlier pointed out the virus is thought to have originated in Africa through ingestion of Bush Meat. It no doubt was disseminated throughout the communities due to lax sexual conduct and eventually found its way into the west. I've read one account of it being responsible for one death back in the 40s..how that person became infected wasn't recorded.

What has caused the explosion of cases since the 70s and 80s has to be the legalization of homosexuality and the resulting open promiscuity that this change in the law engendered combined with infections from sharing of needles within the drug taking community. During normal heterosexual conduct it appears to be unusual to become infected, generally there has to be a blood content.
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Old 11th Aug 2017, 20:36   #106 (permalink)
 
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Extrapolation

Homosexuals and hetrosexuals can marry their respective partners. Bisexuals however, if living in most Western countries, can only marry one of their partners, so could reasonably argue they are facing discrimination. Once they get the right to be married to both partners at once, then the door is surely wide open for everyone else.

The argument for LGBTQ relationships is that they are between consenting adults and what goes on between them is their business. How polygamy can be wrong by that measure, escapes me.

Last edited by Mechta; 11th Aug 2017 at 21:24. Reason: missing word
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Old 11th Aug 2017, 20:52   #107 (permalink)
 
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Homosexuals and hetrosexuals can marry their respective partners. Bisexuals however, if living in most Western countries, can only marry one of their partners, so could reasonably argue they are facing discrimination. Once they get the right to be married to both partners at once, then the door is surely wide open for everyone else.

The argument for LGBTQ relationships is that they are between consenting adults and what goes on between them is their business. How polygamy can be wrong by measure, escapes me.



Bigamy is one wife too many....

I've got quite a few friends who would argue that you could say the same definition for mongomy as well....
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Old 11th Aug 2017, 20:55   #108 (permalink)
 
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The argument for LGBTQ relationships is that they are between consenting adults and what goes on between them is their business.
If that were the case there would be no need of this thread, sadly it would seem 'their business' needs to be embraced by one and all.
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Old 11th Aug 2017, 20:59   #109 (permalink)

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I make no comment about what sexual orientation wins the prize for most HIV infections but on the subject of promiscuity I think it can be said that, given the opportunity, men tend to be far more promiscuous than women. If that is accepted then it stands to reason that homosexual men would tend to have similar attitudes towards being promiscuous and be far more promiscuous than heterosexuals held back from being promiscuous by the female party not as willing to have casual sex.

In the airline I worked for where the majority of stewards were gay I certainly gained the impression from both observation and conversation that homosexual men are very promiscuous.

Purely my theory and opinion.
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Old 11th Aug 2017, 21:01   #110 (permalink)
 
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What has caused the explosion of cases since the 70s and 80s has to be the legalization of homosexuality and the resulting open promiscuity
Do you for one minute think that promiscuity did not happen before legalisation? The only difference was it was behind closed doors, in public lavatories, open spaces, hotel rooms... anywhere. It was just kept as secret as possible. The AIDS virus would still have multiplied as now but while denying the ability of sufferers to obtain treatment without incriminating themselves. If that was the position in the 70s and 80s the situation would be exponentially worse than now.

Back to the thread starting point. Does anyone think the BBC are in a way trying to atone for their part in making homosexuality a thing to laugh at and deride no, childe, in the past? Julian and Sandy. The employment of closet gays who camped our way across our screens but they knew if they were publicly outed or came out their career would essentially be over.

Thankfully society has changed and I can enjoy the contribution the GBLTQ community now make to entertainment, arts, sport and other areas of our lives. Saying that, the emphasis the BBC is placing on the 50th anniversary is getting on my tits a bit.
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 02:44   #111 (permalink)
 
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I can enjoy the contribution the GBLTQ community now make to entertainment, arts, sport and other areas of our lives.
Surely you can enjoy the contribution anyone makes to entertainment, arts, sports and other areas of our lives regardless of their sexual orientation?

This is one of the points that annoys me, where the fact that an entertainer, athlete, scientist, engineer, or any other form of professional who is not heterosexual will have their orientation held up for applause, as if being GBLTQ is what made them great.
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 04:55   #112 (permalink)
 
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Having to be or wanting to be defined or recognized primarily by sexual orientation indicates a deep seated sense of insecurity and a lack of comfort with one's psyche as a whole.
Part of the reason why we not only have a gay pride day with a parade, but a gay pride week that, here, lasts for 8 days.


Best if everyone just kept it to themselves without all the pretensions and affectations, I don't think the rest of humanity really gives a damn no matter how many mayors and prime ministers march with you.


Dons flack helmet.
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 05:24   #113 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by MungoP View Post
le Pingouin

yes.. you are hazarding a guess and it's a pretty lousy one.
My generation grew up enjoying unprotected sex and I personally know of no one who suffered as a result and that was the 60s..when ladies had discovered the pill and life was good.

But we didn't have hundreds of partners and indulge in non biblical practices..at least most of us didn't.. and no I'm not in any way religious. AIDS has been with us in the west since homosexuality was legalized.. not a coincidence.
You appear to be "somewhat fixated" if not obsessed with sexual practices.

First, whilst extolling the virtues of having unprotected heterosexual sex, you seem to have forgotten that STD's have always been prevalent hence, along with the risk to a woman of an unwanted pregnancy, the use of condoms

Secondly, the bit about "non biblical practices".....anal sex is practiced between heterosexual men and women, the really bad news ( for you ) is that men receive from women consensually.

Thirdly, your view about AIDS becoming prevalent in the West since homosexuality was decriminalised is basically complete and utter vilifying rubbish, written to support your own antagonism towards the LGBT population.

On here, you will, of course, find a willing and receptive audience only too enthused to accept this fallacy given the extent of the bigotry that prevails[I] per se

Had you done some minimal research, enter "when did AIDS arrive in the West " you would have noted the articles on the timeline of the virus and the epidemic that arrived in the UK in the 1980's. You may note the time between decriminalisation... and the outbreak.

You also seem to have ignored that a percentage of heterosexual people, mainly haemophiliacs, were infected through the flawed scandal of receiving unscreened blood transfusions.

Have a read...not that the article will in anyway actually influence your dogmatic stance.

https://www.avert.org/professionals/...rth-america/uk

You asked which world I live in. I replied.

However, whilst we both inhabit the same planet, I delighted to say we are diametrically opposed to each other because I would never wish to be part of your arrogant, ill informed and vituperative social world when it relates to humanity and sexual orientation.

Last edited by Krystal n chips; 12th Aug 2017 at 05:51.
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 05:58   #114 (permalink)
 
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Krystal n chips

Your pathetic attempts to muddy the waters are becoming tiresome.

Yes STDs have been around since pre-history times.. But since the discovery of penicillin they haven't been killer diseases and in any case were again promoted by promiscuous sexual conduct .. As is the HIV virus.

Yes, some heterosexual couples do practice anal sex. but relatively few and yes they also stand a very good chance of becoming afffected if they're promiscuous..

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Thirdly, your view about AIDS becoming prevalent in the West since homosexuality was decriminalised is basically complete and utter rubbish, written to support your own antagonism towards the LGBT population.
So, you choose to ignore the fact that the HIV virus exploded on to the scene in the 80s among the 'Fast Lane Gays' of San Francisco shortly after the legalization of homosexuality and spread from there and is still primarily a virus mostly confined to the gay scene.. which is why the poor overstretched NHS is fighting its corner not to be forced to supply free medication to irresponsible promiscuous gays who wish to indulge in unprotected sex on a grand scale... at four hundred pounds per person per week. Do you ignore that out of ignorance or self interest ?

Yes a small, very small proportion of the heterosexual population have become infected through no fault of their own having been given a transfusion of infected blood.. I'm sure they'd like to thank the infected donor that has had a major impact on their lives.

In spite of politically correct reporting sensitive to the current 'modern thinking' will as you do play down the whole issue of promiscuous, irresponsible homosexuality and its affects. Those of us with eyes and a brain behind them can quite easily recognize the effects on society that the legalization of homosexuality is having.. which is sad because it should never have been illegal.. It's not the fault of the law that we're suffering, just the irresponsible behaviour of a large part of the gay community.
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 06:17   #115 (permalink)
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I've twice posted the official UK government statistics which show that HIV is more prevalent amongst heterosexuals than the gay community, but to no avail. When people have their own fixations they are blind to seeing and recognising facts no matter how often they are repeated.

UK HIV Statistics | National AIDS Trust - NAT

"Over 95% of people living with HIV in the UK have acquired HIV through sex without a condom. People living with HIV who were exposed through heterosexual sex are the largest group, though those exposed through sex between men is a close second.

Of those receiving HIV care in 2015, 41,945 (48%) were exposed through sex between a man and a woman, 41,016 (47%) were exposed through sex between men. 1,909 (2%) were exposed from injecting drug use, 1,383 (less than 2%) were exposed before or shortly after birth and 753 were exposed from blood/receiving blood products......
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 06:26   #116 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by MungoP View Post
Krystal n chips

Your pathetic attempts to muddy the waters are becoming tiresome.

Yes STDs have been around since pre-history times.. But since the discovery of penicillin they haven't been killer diseases and in any case were again promoted by promiscuous sexual conduct .. As is the HIV virus.

Yes, some heterosexual couples do practice anal sex. but relatively few and yes they also stand a very good chance of becoming afffected if they're promiscuous..



So, you choose to ignore the fact that the HIV virus exploded on to the scene in the 80s among the 'Fast Lane Gays' of San Francisco shortly after the legalization of homosexuality and spread from there and is still primarily a virus mostly confined to the gay scene.. which is why the poor overstretched NHS is fighting its corner not to be forced to supply free medication to irresponsible promiscuous gays who wish to indulge in unprotected sex on a grand scale... at four hundred pounds per person per week. Do you ignore that out of ignorance or self interest ?

Yes a small, very small proportion of the heterosexual population have become infected through no fault of their own having been given a transfusion of infected blood.. I'm sure they'd like to thank the infected donor that has had a major impact on their lives.

In spite of politically correct reporting sensitive to the current 'modern thinking' will as you do play down the whole issue of promiscuous, irresponsible homosexuality and its affects. Those of us with eyes and a brain behind them can quite easily recognize the effects on society that the legalization of homosexuality is having.. which is sad because it should never have been illegal.. It's not the fault of the law that we're suffering, just the irresponsible behaviour of a large part of the gay community.

If, by what you refer to as "muddying the waters", you mean offering you factual information which contradicts your blatantly homophobic stance, then I'm more than happy to oblige.

I would be interested to learn however, where a male has contracted AIDS through the insertion of a sex aid during anal sex ( he being the recipient ) with a woman. Quite how many people indulge is an unknown of course, so we'll take your comment as being superfluous and unquantifiable.

Attempting to engage in any form of counter argument with you is clearly futile.

You adopted the same stance when you declared you were a safe driver, yet openly boasted as to the number of prosecutions you had for speeding.

Your equally dismissive stance towards the prevalence and dangers of STD's makes an interesting correlation therefore.
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 06:56   #117 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
I've twice posted the official UK government statistics which show that HIV is more prevalent amongst heterosexuals than the gay community, but to no avail. When people have their own fixations they are blind to seeing and recognising facts no matter how often they are repeated.

UK HIV Statistics | National AIDS Trust - NAT
You are very selective with your interpretation of those statistics.

In that article it says that sex between heterosexual couples represented 48% of cases and 47% came about through sex between men.

Now, take the fact that gay men only represent one or two percent of the population and you get a totally different picture.
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 07:05   #118 (permalink)
 
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And of those 'straight' men or women how many were of the 'those with a foot in both camps so to speak' persuasion and regularly indulged in unprotected bi sexual fun with others?

If 2% of the 65 million U.K. male population are gay yet represent 47% of HIV carriers it does shine a very different light on Oracs linked figures.
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 08:05   #119 (permalink)
 
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charliegolf


Nobody is suggesting that.. As someone earlier pointed out the virus is thought to have originated in Africa through ingestion of Bush Meat. It no doubt was disseminated throughout the communities due to lax sexual conduct and eventually found its way into the west. I've read one account of it being responsible for one death back in the 40s..how that person became infected wasn't recorded.
Siphilis is believed to have originated in Africa through the native habit of shagging animals; couldn't AIDS have evolved that way too?
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Old 12th Aug 2017, 08:09   #120 (permalink)
 
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It occurs to me that a whole generation has grown up ignorant (in the nicest sense) of the history of this very recent problem.. For those of us that have been around a bit longer it's still all very new and we remember distinctly how it's evolved.
To many here the 80s may as well be the 1880s !

Shortly before his death in 1985 the UKs pre-eminent pathologist Prof. Keith Simpson, arguably the most respected of his generation refused to carry out an autopsy on a man who'd died of AIDS as so little was understood of the virus, the risk was too great. Nothing was known of how it was being transmitted. That's a VERY short time ago. All that was known was that it seemed to be confined to homosexual men. From the early 80s the virus exploded onto the gay scene in America.

The gay scene was rapidly becoming decimated (have a look at the list of famous people who died of the disease).. The issue was then given prominence through a campaign mounted by Elizabeth Taylor following the death of her friend the gay actor Rock Hudson. It was never disputed that the virus was predominantly affecting gay men although it's spread was also aided by druggies sharing needles which along with Bi-sexual men was introducing the virus into the largely unaffected heterosexual community, a few were also infected by blood transfusions from contaminated donors.

Obviously once introduced into the wider community it will continue to spread but the initial problem was very clearly identified among gay men for the obvious reason that their chosen form of sexual habit involves damage involving bleeding.

A new generation has grown up barely conscious of the early identification of the virus partly because the media considers the subject too sensitive and partly because many in the arts and media have personal reasons for playing it down. People like Krystal and Chips try hard to offload in part the responsibility onto the heterosexual community.. That way there's less likely to be outrage at the thought of providing this horrendously expensive medication that will allow gay men to continue with their promiscuous behaviour involving unprotected sex without fear of contracting the virus.. they refuse to wear a simple cheap condom and demand medication at the cost of four hundred pounds a week each to the NHS... That is what I object to, not homosexuals.
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