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Old 19th Dec 2016, 12:57   #61 (permalink)
 
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It will only be a matter of time until there are a spate of fatalities and or injuries as people try to board trains on a busy platforms.

The media will milk it for all its worth

We will then have the usual industry standard "talking heads" trot out the old time served and very boring "lessons need to be learned"

There will be the usual tax payer funded enquiries which will take ages to complete with a CBE pending for the worthy tasked to head them up

The unions will come out crowing "we told you so"

There will be a corporate manslaughter charge the company fined and those culpable put out to grass on a big fat pension

The supervisors who used to be conductors on the same rates of pay will then be asked to step off the train to monitor safe closure of doors

The unions will protest at changes to their working T's and Cs and then eventually go on strike unless they elicit a pay rise for the new responsibilities

All very predictable
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 12:57   #62 (permalink)
 
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A seasonal recipe: Stewed PPrune
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 14:57   #63 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
monitor safe closure of doors
A bit like Maidenhead station a couple of years ago:
Mrs Bas steps into carriage, I'm about to swing suitcase aboard and doors close in my face. Mrs Bas operates emg switch but no response. Train takes off with grinning guard looking at me from his cab at rear.

'monitor safe closure of doors' Yeah, right!
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 15:37   #64 (permalink)
 
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2nd man on trains...

There is irony in this.
When the government is the one collecting the revenue, they are incentivised to protect their revenues.
So I am used to seeing on a daily basis a guard walk through Southern trains checking tickets, because it pays the government to have it thus. More important to protect revenue that push the button for doors.....
Until of course the train becomes a cattle truck. At this point the guard stops checking. In a rather perfunctory way the focus is on doors, and making sporadic announcements.
Whilst the government is in revenue protection mode, the chances of the 2nd member of staff being made redundant are close to zero.
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 16:12   #65 (permalink)
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" So now you cite fictitious references to remarks I didn't make and try to suggest they are relevant. The ultimate straw man! What a pointless set of remarks "

PDR....

Nothing fictitious about the quotes I presented, both have appeared here and directed at me. Does the term, " in comparison "mean anything to you at all ?

I get the distinct impression you like the sound of your own keyboard as much as you probably like the sound of your own voice.......a sound that echoes in the surrounding silence due to the absence of others.
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 16:27   #66 (permalink)
 
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Wow this thread is like the jet blast of old with real anger and venom spewed forth, hasn't been one like it for years.
Among the interesting points

- making out the people fo Surrey , especially the rich ones are selfish miserable people, after 25 years in the County thats about right.

-people with a similar underlying interest (otherwise why are they here) holding views ranging from , Unions have done a lot for UK to All trade unionists should be shot or at least imprisoned.

Quoting the Daily Mail as though it were a credible source

Quoting the Guardian as though it were a credible source

Personal abuse

Criticism of others use of the English language while making spelling and grammatical mistakes themselves.

Evaluation that peoples jobs other than their own are ridiculously simplistic but at the same time overpaid.



The only things missing are:-

Allegations that 'the French' are somehow at fault

Reference to Side sticks vs traditional yokes

Managing to blame BA


And finally i have the utmost sympathy for the commuters involved, I played that game for a good few years and was very happy to escape it so I am not making fun of you at all or making light of the problems you face
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 16:32   #67 (permalink)
 
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Anger venom and Spew

2 sugars with mine please

Happy Christmas to you Pax
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 16:47   #68 (permalink)
 
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And happy Xmas to you Mr A , perhaps next year you will have a tolerable service in your part of the world. Where I live it was quicker to get to Waterloo not just on a steam hauled train but a Victorian one at that compared to what SWT do for us today.
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 17:13   #69 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krystal n chips View Post
Nothing fictitious about the quotes I presented, both have appeared here and directed at me. Does the term, " in comparison "mean anything to you at all ?
So even if they ever existed they are just strawman posts. But set that aside, because you still haven't given any substance to these claims so I remain to be convinced that they are anything but fictitious.

Quote:
I get the distinct impression you like the sound of your own keyboard as much as you probably like the sound of your own voice.......a sound that echoes in the surrounding silence due to the absence of others.
And I get the distinct impression that you are unable to support your various claims with any evidence or argument so you try to distract attention from the fatuous nature of your points by launching attacks on those who refute them. How about breaking the habit of a lifetime and discussing the subject, answering the points made and supporting your assertions with evidence?

PDR
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 17:17   #70 (permalink)
 
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Got to admit Pax B, I poked my head briefly round the door, but now I'm watching with fascinated horror from a safe distance.
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 22:00   #71 (permalink)
 
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Wot u watching?
Is it on Netflix or Amazon prime?
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Old 19th Dec 2016, 22:22   #72 (permalink)
 
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Come back Maggie all is forgiven.
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Old 20th Dec 2016, 05:01   #73 (permalink)
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PDR...

I apologise for not presenting the facts in a format that allows you to comprehend their validity. Unfortunately, I am not a child psychologist hence my error.

Perhaps this link will help.

Role of the dispatcher

I don't suppose for one minute you watched Chris Tarrant last night, on C5, and his Polar express journey across Scandinavia ?...starting in Norway, thence to Sweden and Finland.

If so, you missed the Norwegian guard waving a green flag and...blowing a whistle.

True, the line in question is now a major tourist route, and I haven't seen a green flag being used on the UK mainlines for a long time, but, both items are still in use on heritage lines, and not simply to add to the enjoyment of the pax on their day out.

You may also be fascinated to learn, and this no doubt.... to your way of "thinking", will be yet another "union throwback " that the Bardic lamp is still very much in use, again for something so inconsequential as......safety.

The nice man I was speaking to, very recently in fact, was an RAiB inspector and he was quite happy I was capable of performing as trained with the above items.

Anyway, here's Steve Bell's view of matters......perfectly summated, as always.

https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...trikes-cartoon

Last edited by Krystal n chips; 20th Dec 2016 at 05:38.
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Old 20th Dec 2016, 06:05   #74 (permalink)
 
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That link appears to be both extremely old and annecdotal rather than authoritative, but its second paragraph starts with

Quote:
Originally Posted by some obscure forum post
The reason I ask is that not all stations have them
So what's the claim here? Only some stations need to be safe? It can hardly be a core part of an essential safety system if it's not universal. Certainly not enough to continue ripping off the taxpayer and the passenger just to create another un-needed job for trade union members.

Scandiwegian railways may be very pretty, but they are [again] irrelevant to the topic. Different railways, different safety cases, different safety systems.

I also have to assume that the reference to signalling lamps was some sort of typing botty-burp as [yet again] it has no relevance to the subject. Try to focus.

PDR
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Old 20th Dec 2016, 08:23   #75 (permalink)
 
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It would be interesting to hear a Minister say exactly how many injuries per year from people being dragged after being trapped are acceptable.
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Old 20th Dec 2016, 08:47   #76 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
It would be interesting to hear a Minister say exactly how many injuries per year from people being dragged after being trapped are acceptable.
It would also be interesting to see when these are more likely to happen. My guess is during rush hour when people are trying to squeeze into carriages and a guard is completely useless due to the sheer number of people.


Quote:
You may also be fascinated to learn, and this no doubt.... to your way of "thinking", will be yet another "union throwback " that the Bardic lamp is still very much in use, again for something so inconsequential as......safety.

The nice man I was speaking to, very recently in fact, was an RAiB inspector and he was quite happy I was capable of performing as trained with the above items.
I am sure this is all lovely on your heritage line full of spotters but it goes to show you have absolutely no idea about the chaos that is the rush hour commute into London. A guard becomes irrelevant and it is every man for himself.

This whole saga is about unions trying to make up for a totally inept Labour leadership by creating problems for the government themselves. I expect more industrial action to come, the season of goodwill means nothing to these cretins.

Power mad and happy to sit back on their high salaries whilst sending the workers out on strike. How many of the Unite leadership are eyeing Corbyns job whilst Comrade Corbyn himself is happy to sit back a watch the pickets reliving his 70's youth.

What percent of ordinary union members have turned their back on Labour I wonder? How much of their union fees is being diverted to that lost cause?

No wonder they are worried about losing the guards union fees.
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Old 20th Dec 2016, 09:21   #77 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
What percent of ordinary union members have turned their back on Labour I wonder?
. . . and will now vote UKIP.
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Old 20th Dec 2016, 09:24   #78 (permalink)
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" I am sure this is all lovely on your heritage line full of spotters but it goes to show you have absolutely no idea about the chaos that is the rush hour commute into London. A guard becomes irrelevant and it is every man for himself.


True, overcrowding isn't exactly an issue....sheep on the line however, well that's an entirely different matter!....that, and the majority of the pax are not "spotters", just people who want an enjoyable, and.....here's that anathema to many on here......safe....day out.

A bit of a revelation for you. A packed commuter train going into London is no different to one going into say Manchester or Birmingham.

"This whole saga is about unions trying to make up for a totally inept Labour leadership by creating problems for the government themselves. I expect more industrial action to come, the season of goodwill means nothing to these cretins".

And full credit to the unions for doing so. As for the "season of goodwill" and cretins, I take it you intended this reference to be in respect of management and shareholders dividends.


Power mad and happy to sit back on their high salaries whilst sending the workers out on strike. How many of the Unite leadership are eyeing Corbyns job whilst Comrade Corbyn himself is happy to sit back a watch the pickets reliving his 70's youth.

What percent of ordinary union members have turned their back on Labour I wonder? How much of their union fees is being diverted to that lost cause?

No wonder they are worried about losing the guards union fees


Just a couple of flaws with an otherwise near perfect Mail readers perception of life.

First, said union leaders have to be, erm, elected.... as an MP.

Secondly, one of the union's remits is to protect the working conditions and indeed actual occupation of it's members.

You would, I take it, be quite happy, along with the many other "damned unions" contributors to see your own job, if so employed in an organisation, simply disappear without any form of recourse to action that may prevent this.
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Old 20th Dec 2016, 09:27   #79 (permalink)
 
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I gather the easy way to establish which stations have these "dispatchers" is to check the staff car park. If there are any dispatchers at the station their unicorns will be parked there.

PDR
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Old 20th Dec 2016, 09:37   #80 (permalink)
 
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Having had some experience with railway industry, I cannot say much in favour of their management or culture. Neither the managers nor workers had their customers much in mind. However in this case the union has made it clear the strike is political so no need to spend much time wondering about their safety argument: its bogus.

As for the long haired union leader from Doncaster who regards Arthur Scargill as one of his 'giants'.......Well we can be sure he puts the public interest and safety first can't we.

Quite simply I wish the rail unions all the I'll will in the world. Happy Christmas, but not to them !
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