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Old 27th Oct 2016, 01:01   #1 (permalink)
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Marijuana is not a problem

Marijuana is not a problem. Why do most of the world's nation states insist it is?
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 01:12   #2 (permalink)
 
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It has always been considered a gateway drug. Alongside that belief, there are US DOJ criminal statistics that state 40% of males arrested in the US have cannaboids in their bloodstream, supporting the idea that that bong hit led to a life of crime (smoking a joint can land you in the joint).

After alcohol, marijuana is the second most common substance found in drivers of cars involved in fatal accidents in the US. Then there is the argument that marijuana use supports gangs, cartels, and even terrorism. The final claim could be made moot were it to be legalized. I wonder if providing terrorists with marijuana (and some loose women) might calm their irrational asses down a notch or so.

Full disclosure: I don't have an opinion either way on this, and have seen both sides of the argument for and against legalization. My better half has been known to partake in her younger days. I prefer to kill my brain cells the old fashioned way, with a nice glass (or three) of whisky.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 01:44   #3 (permalink)
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Indeed. At the end of the U.S. Prohibition of Alcohol signing ceremony, a Supreme Court Justice was heard to say, "...Okay, you I'll give you booze, but we retain the illegality of marijuana!"..

It was a mere bargaining chip...and the beginning of hundreds of thousands of criminal arrests and subsequent personal criminal records.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 01:46   #4 (permalink)
 
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Marihuana possession charges were a favored way to criminalise dark skinned youfs until the '60s when it became fashionable among lighter skinned youfs when morphing into a way to criminalise the counterculture.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 01:53   #5 (permalink)
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From my observations,some people can handle it (even doing complex tasks) while others cannot and just stare at a wall for a few hours.

I've never heard of anyone committing a violent crime under the sole influence of marijuana,although my experience is from long ago.

Some of the newer, concentrated forms can be bad for you.A brother of a friend ended up in a psych ward briefly after using a very concentrated form of it.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 04:27   #6 (permalink)
 
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Young mate starts smoking dope at school.
His dope smoking friends go on to become med techs at a hospital.
Get into the nitrous and other stuff.
My mate shifts into their inner city flat.
Whaddya know - there's a baker living next door?!
Try this...
Two years later he robs his Dad's work, trying to steal something to sell to support his habit.
Court - diversion - rehabilitation.
When I last saw him - he looked shit - was clean but he and his partner had hep... and a kid.
Life = ******.
Don't tell me nothing's wrong with dope.
Try it once or twice when you're old enough and smart enough to know better.
Then walk away... my two cents worth.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 06:34   #7 (permalink)
 
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Hmmm... when i were a yoof i thought that mary jane stuff were good... when others were taking it that is.

As an ardent motor cyclist in me teens and 20's i liked to ride at 99+% all the time. Unfortunately i weighed out at a fat free 103Kg (now i'm a more fat then muscle 103Kg) and were unable to compete with the 70Kg 'jockeys'. So seeing other riders get going on the dope and how they lost their edge thus allowing me to dominate the scratching runs certainly were a lesson about the stupidity of smoking dope..

I took my clear headed 'edge' to some interesting fixed wing and Helicopter flying and left the Dopesters to their misery...




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Old 27th Oct 2016, 07:57   #8 (permalink)
 
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Many who drink alcohol do not handle it well and get into the problems associated with excessive drinking. There is no upgrade to liquor except perhaps drugs.
I have known of many (vast majority) who smoke marijuana who never progressed to "hard" drugs. Some do but not as many, IMHO, as is propagandized by politicians and media.
That said, neither is appropriate when operating any type of machinery or doing complex or critical tasks.
Recreationally, it is no worse than a few belts, probably better given the health problems and violence associated with alcohol. Mellow is a good descriptor. It's a plant and before anyone jumps in, a "non-lethal" plant variety. Also makes some very good rope.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 08:06   #9 (permalink)
 
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What about the mental health problems caused by regular use of the more potent strains of marijuana? Not only do they actually cause harm to the user, but the rest of us have to pick up the tab for their care.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 08:42   #10 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Marijuana is not a problem. Why do most of the world's nation states insist it is?
Mate, you are talking bollocks and need to be told this.

My step daughter has severe mental health issues which doctors have attributed to the use of the weed over a period of many years.

I hope it never affects your family as it has ours.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 08:45   #11 (permalink)
 
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Indeed Andy S!
My son and I were debating the pros and cons, right and wrongs of the "weed".
He like many at Uni dabbled in some smoking and found it enjoyable and mellow. His argument went something like "Have you EVER seen 2 weed users having a full on punch up outside a bar on a Saturday night?" etc etc.
My, fatherly, logic to one who wants a military flying career was simple, "Its illegal, dont do it. The booze v weed debate is irrelevant! You get a criminal record and POOF! there goes your plan!
The new more designed strains are, without doubt, beyond any foreseen horizon of high from my day and do mess around with the brains chemistry. NOT GOOD!
However, there are, without doubt, medical benefits to be had from the weed and its derivatives.
Cannabis oil put into hand cream for those suffering arthritis works, as does impregnated tampons for ladies who suffer chronic Period Pain. Those with MS also benefit from cannabis's properties.
Personally I would rather use a natural substance than a manufactured chemical drug. But again if its illegal the choice is mute.
That said British Sugar have been given licence to grow cannabis in industrial quantities for medical use at last!
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 08:52   #12 (permalink)
 
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Arguably, if we'd never made marijuana illegal in the first place, but had licensed it, like alcohol, we would not have anywhere near the level of drug-related issues we currently have.

I don't think I know anyone who hasn't smoked a bit of weed at some point in their lives, I certainly did for several years when I was a lot younger, in fact I only stopped when I gave up smoking in my 30's. Back then the really potent stuff hadn't been selectively bred, though, and I can say that, for me, marijuana was almost certainly less harmful than alcohol and most probably less addictive.

I don't drink often, but I do look forward to a drink. I have no craving for marijuana and never have had; my addiction back then was to nicotine in cigarettes (and joints........).

The oft-stated link between marijuana use and moving to more harmful and addicitve drugs is almost entirely down to marijuana being illegal. The suppliers of marijuana are also the suppliers of cocaine, heroin, amphetamine etc, etc. Those suppliers have a very strong interest in persuading marijuana users to try an addictive drug, I've experienced this myself many years ago, and I doubt it has changed.

Now that some US states have made marijuana legal, we should see whether it is really worse than alcohol or tobacco in terms of its impact on human health. My feeling for many years was that it was a hell of a lot less harmful than either tobacco or alcohol, but that's just based on my personal experience, and has no scientific support.

The Dutch seem to be able to allow limited marijuana use without it causing them any significant problems, and have been doing so for decades now. Perhaps it's time we made it legal and freed up police resources that are currently arresting marijuana users for more serious duties.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 08:58   #13 (permalink)
 
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Any addiction can be treated successfully. Look at Portugal, look at Switzeland. While some addicts never become clean they can still have a fruitful and productive life.

Or they can live in the gutter, abandoned by society, stealing to pay for their next fix, supporting organised crime and terrorism, dependent on social services, raising costs for policing, the courts and jails and prisons.

There is little evidence that marijuana is a gateway to hard drugs. See: Is Marijuana Really a ?Gateway Drug??

Treating drug addiction as an illness, rather than a crime would produce significant benefits to society and to taxpayers. But the desire is to punish drug users rather than help them.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 09:09   #14 (permalink)
 
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Quite agree VP, however, hindsight is always 20/20.............

The decriminalizing of cannabis in various US states is far from clear and simple.
Firstly cannabis is still Federally illegal so those who grow, legally in a permitting state, are unable to use a commercial bank account (as the Banks are Federally Regulated!)
Moving a commercial crop across interstate borders, regardless of whether the 2 states are allowing cannabis, is a Federal Crime.
All in all the current situation in the US is a complete mess!
The Federal Agencies all want a slice of the revenue generated by the legal weed industry but are tying themselves up in knots as they do not want to Federally legalise the stuff!
Without doubt, as usual, many of the law makers have deep seated uniformed views or are at the voting beck and call of voters who do, for the frankly silly current situation to be rationalised any time soon.
So the Mexican gangs will keep smuggling, the DEA will keep NOT stopping said smuggling, innocents will keep dying and those who REALLY NEED the benefits of cannabis's magical properties will be made criminal or not depending which state they are in at the time.
Truly FUBAR!
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 09:09   #15 (permalink)
 
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Sure - there's nothing wrong with prolonged usage.
I think not.
And the point made by a previous poster is a very good one.
The man with the short haircut behind the desk at LAX aint gonna give a rats arse about your theories on dope when you try to get into the country with a drug conviction.
And - aviation content apologies - I wonder how many fast jet pilots are dope smokers?
Yes, I didn't think so...
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 09:19   #16 (permalink)
 
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"I wonder how many fast jet pilots are dope smokers?"
TBH I think that depends on how badly they had the living Be'Jesus scared out of them.................................................!!
However, your point is spot on, one should NEVER confuse logical with LEGAL!!
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 09:37   #17 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alwayzinit View Post
Quite agree VP, however, hindsight is always 20/20.............

The decriminalizing of cannabis in various US states is far from clear and simple.
Firstly cannabis is still Federally illegal so those who grow, legally in a permitting state, are unable to use a commercial bank account (as the Banks are Federally Regulated!)
Moving a commercial crop across interstate borders, regardless of whether the 2 states are allowing cannabis, is a Federal Crime.
All in all the current situation in the US is a complete mess!
The Federal Agencies all want a slice of the revenue generated by the legal weed industry but are tying themselves up in knots as they do not want to Federally legalise the stuff!
Without doubt, as usual, many of the law makers have deep seated uniformed views or are at the voting beck and call of voters who do, for the frankly silly current situation to be rationalised any time soon.
So the Mexican gangs will keep smuggling, the DEA will keep NOT stopping said smuggling, innocents will keep dying and those who REALLY NEED the benefits of cannabis's magical properties will be made criminal or not depending which state they are in at the time.
Truly FUBAR!
What a barking mad situation!

So growers, suppliers and users in a legal state have to conduct wholly cash transactions, cannot put their funds into any bank, etc?

Truly, truly, mad............
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 09:53   #18 (permalink)
 
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I used to think marijuana was not a problem, until me and my travel buddy were offered a joint in a country where the penalty for being caught was 10 years jail.

My travel buddy smoked it quickly to remove the evidence but before the joint took effect he made a casual remark that he gets a bit sensitive under the influence.

What an understatement!

I found the person whom I had hooked up with to backpack a sector over Europe with had suddenly changed and was trying to kill himself under some delusional schizophrenic episode. It was one of the most scariest moments of my life as I was responsible for allowing the dealer to peddle his wares in the first place. I stuck with this dude all night never letting him out my sight and restraining when needed until the effects finally wore off.

Some people just cannot handle marijuana period.

Had another similar experience with a marijuana smoker at a farm near Rockhampton, sad as it was it actually turned into one of the funniest stories of my life - I may just tell it here one day.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 10:16   #19 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by cattletruck View Post
I used to think marijuana was not a problem, until me and my travel buddy were offered a joint in a country where the penalty for being caught was 10 years jail.

My travel buddy smoked it quickly to remove the evidence but before the joint took effect he made a casual remark that he gets a bit sensitive under the influence.

What an understatement!

I found the person whom I had hooked up with to backpack a sector over Europe with had suddenly changed and was trying to kill himself under some delusional schizophrenic episode. It was one of the most scariest moments of my life as I was responsible for allowing the dealer to peddle his wares in the first place. I stuck with this dude all night never letting him out my sight and restraining when needed until the effects finally wore off.

Some people just cannot handle marijuana period.

Had another similar experience with a marijuana smoker at a farm near Rockhampton, sad as it was it actually turned into one of the funniest stories of my life - I may just tell it here one day.
I think the main problem here is that, because marijuana is illegal and unregulated, and very closely tied in with the manufacture and distribution of many other drugs, the producers have been breeding very potent strains.

Certainly the stuff from Afghanistan and Morocco that was all that was available years ago, before the hydroponic revolution, was extremely mild in terms of its effects. Over the 15 years or so that I smoked it, I can never recall anyone getting anything other than a bit mellow, perhaps with a fit of the giggles from time to time.

Would these very potent strains have been bred if marijuana had been legal and licensed, like alcohol? I doubt it, as there wouldn't have been a real incentive to do so, and anyway, if it were licensed then there would be a means of exerting some control over what was available.

Based on my experience, I'd say that 99% of users would much prefer to buy the stuff legally. I have a friend who buys marijuana for his wife (she has MS) and he lives in fear of the dealers that supply him. The drug world is a pretty vicious place, and I think a large part of that is down to making relatively harmless drugs, like the original forms of marijuana, illegal.

On the subject of making things illegal, I recently came across another example where a new law may well have unintended consequences. For a couple of years I've been using a herbal remedy to combat the symptoms of IBS. It's been very effective, despite my general scepticism of herbal remedies in general. Earlier this year this herb became illegal, under the blanket ban the government imposed on all "psychoactive substances". I should stress that the herb I was using was not in any way psychoactive as far as I could tell, all it did for me was prevent stomach cramps very effectively.

Anyway, I couldn't buy it any more, and the cramps returned (not fun, as anyone who suffers from IBS can testify). It's not illegal to possess the banned substances under the new act, just an offence to import and sell them. So, I decided to see if I could still get the stuff.

It turned out to be dead easy to buy it on line, and cheaper, as there was no VAT! However, the really disturbing bit is that the same website offering this herb was also offering a very wide range of drugs, from amphetamines through to benzodiazapines and hallucenogens. I could as easily have bought 500 very addictive tablets as I could a few hundred grammes of the herb, which is really pretty scary.

These websites have sprung up as a consequence of the new law, but are many times worse than the "head shops" that the government intended to shut down for selling "legal highs". Sadly, I can foresee that instead of a few deaths from "legal highs", we'll now see many hundreds of people addicted to much more harmful drugs bought from these web sites, plus, I suspect, more deaths. If ever there was a good example of the "law of unintended consequences", then this is it.
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Old 27th Oct 2016, 10:56   #20 (permalink)
 
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There is little evidence that marijuana is a gateway to hard drugs.
Several years ago I witnessed a good friend of mine progressing from "occasional joint smoker" to "everyday user" to "many joints a day user" to "cocaine user and dealer".
Enough evidence for me to never, ever use that shiite and never condone it.
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