" Nothing to hide, nothing to fear"....what a well established mantra....alas..
Just curious if you have a premium account at specsavers given the rose tinted glasses you wear ?......
Now Now KnC no need to be so personal, it shows the weakness of your argument if all you can do is resort to insult
In my post I said
"With nothing to hide I am not worried in the least if something in my car or my phone tells someone where the car or phone are, seems much ado about nothing to me"
Nothing more was implied than the above
As I have carried a mobile for over 10 years without anything sinister happening to me I have absolutely no doubt that a tracking device in my car is going to have exactly the same impact on my day to day life
With nothing to hide I am not worried in the least
The rules for that haven't changed appreciably since millennia before the battle of Jerricho:
If someone wishes to steal from you..
.. do you harm
.. interfere with your business or person
.. or bother others related to you in some manner
.. or simply cause you embarrassment
THEN, the more any and all such persons know about your comings and goings - down to the places and moments and habits and peculiarities specific to your person... the easier and more likely it will be for them to accomplish a result adverse to your person, reputation, business, family, peaceful life, health, survival, etc.
This is the stuff of which history is written... and plays and novels... and from which whole cultures are erected, sustained, and lost.
The rules for that haven't changed appreciably since millennia before the battle of Jerricho:
If someone wishes to steal from you..
.. do you harm
.. interfere with your business or person
.. or bother others related to you in some manner
.. or simply cause you embarrassment
THEN, the more any and all such persons know about your comings and goings - down to the places and moments and habits and peculiarities specific to your person... the easier and more likely it will be for them to accomplish a result adverse to your person, reputation, business, family, peaceful life, health, survival, etc.
This is the stuff of which history is written... and plays and novels... and from which whole cultures are erected, sustained, and lost.
Is that what you fear most in all this, the notion that just maybe as in maybe someone will use this info to do you some harm?
Like I said I have carried a phone for 10 years without coming a cropper so someone knowing where my car is at all times causes me no anxiety at all
The flaw I perceive in your premise is the abundant evidence, writ on paper, in legend, and cast hard into layers of stone, that predators, parasites and pests respond resourcefully to Darwinian imperatives and obvious invitations to adapt.
oh i can see exactly how this will end up.. EU will mandate that all new cars fitted with such devices and insurance companies will then dictate that a policy requires such a device.
all personal data will be stored, and hey presto a new form of data mining is established. your phone, email text messages will going off like buggery as you go near a shop, you'll be getting dicount vouchers emailed to you.. texts with from a tex-mex chain offering group discounts of 10% reply to text or call premium rate number to book a table..
get in the most minor fener bender and have 6,000 no win no fee lawyers fighting for your whiplash claim and damages..
what with facebook, your ISP your local council selling off personal data this well just end up as another revenue stream of data selling
Location: A civilised little County..with a bit of eccentricity to boot
Posts: 674
I do appreciate SFFP that polishing your halo may well induce reflective blindness, however.....do have a read of this article. It may even sow the seeds as to why some of us get, well, rather concerned about data...
Ever helpful, as you have informed all and sundry as to your intention to travel widely once you retire.....nice house and car I take it? ( hint: read arcnix posts in detail )
Hells....interesting post.....any further details please?
Being "watched" either directly or electronically ( and not just by the bad guys) is a fact of life...being held to ransom by insurance companies should not be....remind me again who now owns the AA
THEN, the more any and all such persons know about your comings and goings - down to the places and moments and habits and peculiarities specific to your person... the easier and more likely it will be for them to accomplish a result adverse to your person, reputation, business, family, peaceful life, health, survival, etc.
This is the stuff of which history is written... and plays and novels... and from which whole cultures are erected, sustained, and lost.
indeed. when the whole id card issue was going on in the UK C4 did a documentary called 'Suspect Nation' it's still available on G00gle videos, i suggest anyone watch it.
A key issue to all this, is the more data that is held about people, the more vulnerable people become. That data can be accessed and misused.
Right now private bank and credit card details are being traded on line for less than 20 quid.
The point is, is that with this data available as commodity, which it invariably is, as a 'marketing tool', anyone who wants to commit a nefarious act wont be doing it with *their* data, they will be doing it with *yours*.
Hold tight, everyone, massive generalisation coming! (Don't say I didn't warn you.)
I believe that we all fall into two distinct camps. Optimist or pessimist; glass half full or glass half empty; happy pragmatist or serial conspiracy theory believer.
Pretty clear which category many of you here fall into. Me, I'm daft but happy. Can't be much fun seeing conspiracies everywhere, trusting no one, suspecting everyone, so I'm glad that my natural attitude to life in general, and other people in particular, is to look on the bright side in preference to the downside, unless actual events dictate otherwise. Paranoia must be a heavy burden to bear, after all, "they" might really be out to get you!! (Ooo-er ... )
I prefer to think that if I were to fall down in a deserted street where CCTV cameras happen to be installed, that maybe some unseen observer could summon help for me, rather than that some sinister motive should be attached to their use. Silly me perhaps, but then I can sleep easily at night, too.
look on the bright side in preference to the downside, unless actual events dictate otherwise
I don't disagree, in the main, with the philosophy you espouse.
Thing is, because of history and ongoing things, I feel some actual responsibility for the outcomes associated with the information technology phenomenon ---- because I helped, here and there, to create it at various junctures over the last half-century. And still am doing.
So it's a different perspective.
If you climb onto an airline flight from A to B, part of the context that lets you take a pleasant nap enroute is the expectation that there's someone - with plenty experience and access to good information - who's seriously minding the doings up front.
The disruptive power of information technology is nuclear in proportion and scale, relative to many of the quaint and archaic political, economic, and social institutions that hold humanity's envelope of stability in place.
The challenge is to steer our new fire toward constructive results, and not to wait idly until things have gone very wrong to grab at extinguishers and fire-axes.
Quite a few smart, well-meaning folks are trying to help keep that process on a constructive course, acting mostly out of view and not at the level of political pan-banging. I'm just another ant in that pile - and not directly compensated for the doing- trying to make things come out more right than wrong as some interesting and challenging storms rage enroute.
Pretty clear which category many of you here fall into. Me, I'm daft but happy. Can't be much fun seeing conspiracies everywhere, trusting no one, suspecting everyone, so I'm glad that my natural attitude to life in general, and other people in particular, is to look on the bright side in preference to the downside, unless actual events dictate otherwise. Paranoia must be a heavy burden to bear, after all, "they" might really be out to get you!! (Ooo-er ... )
I prefer to think that if I were to fall down in a deserted street where CCTV cameras happen to be installed, that maybe some unseen observer could summon help for me, rather than that some sinister motive should be attached to their use. Silly me perhaps, but then I can sleep easily at night, too.
I'm more of the realist.
Taking your example of CCTV, do i see legions of leather trench-coated secret police watching everyone's activities for something that may be deemed against the state, nope.
But if you fall down in the street your more likely to get a fine for blocking a public highway than someone providing help.
Technology is good thing, but how it is used and implemented is what makes it poor.
Spending millions on CCTV to cut crime, but using cameras that don't have the image quality to actually provide an image of any use is frankly a waste of time effort, energy and money. When you have CCTV to cut down on crime and one actually occurs, then don't use this B/S of not enough staff to pull the tapes and provide evidence (this happened to me) what's the effing point of it then.. just to blow some money up the wall ?
Like I said, it's how technology is implemented; you know that with tracking devices on cars they wont store the data and release it on a police summons, it'll be too expensive to do that, instead a revenue stream to sell the data to people to market crap to you, you don't want 24/7, is much more of a realistic outcome.
My wife recently changed her insurer, just before the new policy came into effect we were bombarded with calls up to and including 10pm from the new insurer, "oh, problem with the policy here!" we think; spend 45 minutes on the phone trying to speak to someone with a clue to find out what the problem is only to find that she had declined breakdown cover (at additional cost) did she want it?
did i tick the box? she says
no! says they.
then i don't bloody want it do i. says she.
and the point of that ? to try and sell something to her she didnt want.
NB. for those who may be interested; if she decides she does, she can elect, at any time during the poicy, to take it out.
Ever helpful, as you have informed all and sundry as to your intention to travel widely once you retire.....nice house and car I take it? ( hint: read arcnix posts in detail )
Genuinely not wishing to sound boastful but just a thought for you to consider.
Last year we had holidays in Ghent, Thailand, South of France, Devon, Northern France, South Africa and a whole selection of weekends away.
In each and every instance family, friends, workmates knew where and when were going. Factor in my HR folk at work, the credit card company I rang to inform each, my bank who I rang, the taxi driver who took us to the station, the travel company I dealt with, the Thomas Cook staff who sold us our foreign currency, the Airline staff, mobile phone company and on and on.
Literally hundreds and hundreds of folk knew more than enough about what we were up to yet every time we returned home the Merc was still on the drive and the house was intact.
You continue with your paranoia whilst I continue in the manner 603 describes
Thing is, because of history and ongoing things, I feel some actual responsibility for the outcomes associated with the information technology phenomenon ---- because I helped, here and there, to create it at various junctures over the last half-century. And still am doing.
arcniz has said this. And I say good for you, because I worked for my entire career in a responsible capacity as a professional design engineer, constantly aware of the possible consequences of "getting it wrong". I feel certain that there are many others in your field who also adopt a sober, accountable and thoughtful attitude to what they are jointly creating in the discipline of IT.
It is always comforting to find like-minded individuals in specialities where new ground is being developed, who maintain a healthy questioning manner concerning possible mis-uses and inadvisable avenues of exploration. I certainly found it so, in projects where new materials, new analytical techniques, or an absence of established Codes of Practice made it sensible to proceed with caution, and pool our experience, and even, occasionally, our "gut feelings".
So carry on the good work, and others with you. I consider there are probably many more goodhearted folk around than villains, so I feel we are safe in your collective hands. Checks and balances, checks and balances ...
So sometime in the future you may get a mail or printed letter stating "On [date, time] you drove in the vicinity of [crime site]. We'd like you to come in and tell us any observations you may have".
Phoning them and saying you didn't see anything untoward won't cut it. You will have to go there and account for yourself.
So sometime in the future you may get a mail or printed letter stating "On [date, time] you drove in the vicinity of [crime site]. We'd like you to come in and tell us any observations you may have".
Phoning them and saying you didn't see anything untoward won't cut it. You will have to go there and account for yourself.
Location: A civilised little County..with a bit of eccentricity to boot
Posts: 674
"Literally hundreds and hundreds of folk knew more than enough about what we were up to yet every time we returned home the Merc was still on the drive and the house was intact."
You continue with your paranoia whilst I continue in the manner 603 describes "
I get the impression maths is not your strong point " hundreds and hundreds" is, well, just " rather economical with the maths" given those you mention..unless you posted on facepprune and SRO's of course.
No matter, you are pretty much an open invitation which will doubless be accepted at some pont during your travels as I doubt you will be unable to resist telling the world about your travels and super pension....as you have on here.
The fact that you seem unable to grasp how significant data is ( possibly you missed a certain enquiry...begins with an L) and why rational people ( or paranoid to those who are holier than thou ) get more than concerned about the abuse of data held on us suggests your return to civilian life may prove problematic in the future....do let us know when this happens due to issues discussed and outlined here.
Dear oh dear you really cannot help yourself can you, by all means disagree with me because thats what JB is all about but why the constant need to post in such a "dripping with sarcasm" manner, not a very grown up approach
If you don't mind the inconvenience, don't drive very far, have no job or can take indefinite time off your job whenever you please, of course it's not a problem.
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