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Old 26th Sep 2008, 00:49   #2941 (permalink)
 
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Just received that E-mail, thought it was a good laugh....
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 00:57   #2942 (permalink)
 
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Reviewing your bio, do you consider yourself a "replacement worker" after the PATCO strike? If so, how do you reconcile being one? Do you owe the PATCO guys your retirement?
GF,

If you've read my bio then you have time to read the rest of the story should you care to. I've told the story many times, in many forums. This isn't about me and it isn't going to be.

I did like that little bit about you telling me to read the dreaded throne of liberlism -- the New York Times.

Don Brown
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 01:02   #2943 (permalink)

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C-P Clear case of accounting while drinking!!
Hey, it works for me!
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 01:27   #2944 (permalink)
 
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GTF

If you like the NYT read here or here

You might not like Hot Air, but the links to NYT, LA Times are the real story-those august tribunes of liberalism pretty clearly link Bush with regulatory reform on the GSEs. Once someone admits government, specifically Democrats in Congress and Clinton in the White House, caused the the problem, then we can move to a government solution. Call it a Truth and Reconciliation Board.

It isn't about you, but if you want to talk the talk, better walk the walk.
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 01:37   #2945 (permalink)
 
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If you want to blame somebody for this meltdown, blame Phil Gramm. His sleight of hand legislation in 1999 was the beginning of this end.

Senator Gramm stripped a key part of a wisely crafted bill from the 1930s that has been protecting our mainline banking system for nearly 3/4 of a century.

I hope John McCain understands this and gets himself as far away as possible from the cancerous ideas of Gramm.
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 01:54   #2946 (permalink)
 
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VAPilot

Nothing could be further from the truth. The Repeal of Glass-Stegall is saving many banks right now. The merger of Merrill, Lynch and BoA, Goldman, Sachs and Morgan Stanley and the relative survival of Citigroup, all of those actions, could not have occurred under Glass-Stegall.

The bill was passed by large majorities in both houses of Congress, 90-8 in the Senate and signed by Clinton-bipartisanship at its finest.

Review WSJ, NYT, WashPost, LATimes articles and you will see the truth-Congressional liberals (Frank, Dodd, especially) combined with Andrew Cuomo, as Clinton's HUD chief, pushed the GSEs hard to finance ever more risky mortgages. Mortgages, that at the time, were recognized as dangerous. But, they refused any efforts at restricting the GSEs efforts at "affordability" and imposing regulation. The record shows that the Bush administration tried under the Senate Banking Committee chair Shelby to regulate the GSEs. But they were demogoged the issue, saying the Bushies were anti-minority. They gave up, to their discredit.


GF

See my links above, then think about it.

GTF NYT-I flew for them, when Punch ran the show-much more thoughtful and successful paper.
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 02:19   #2947 (permalink)
 
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One last link of 25 Sep on why this bailout is crazy

Click Dr. Housing Bubble Blog

Enjoy
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 02:20   #2948 (permalink)
 
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No sir, not the whole act, just a little 262 page amendment that was slipped in at the last minute by the Enron enabler, Phil Gramm. Had the entire act been as rotten as that little Gramm chestnut, it would have never received that much bipartisan support.
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 03:06   #2949 (permalink)
 
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Enron had loads of enablers-Republican and Democrat. NYT's Krugman among others.

McCain tried to reform the GSEs but Frank and the boys ended it

Click McCain attempt reform bill

You make the repeal of GSA as a "dark of night" thing-it was widely discussed, had been an item in Congress for 10 years or more and no one was surprised by its repeal.

Here's a quote:
Quote:
"When this potentially historic agreement is finalized," Clinton said in a statement, "it will strengthen the economy and help consumers, communities and businesses across America."

Treasury Secretary Lawrence H. Summers said in an interview, "At the end of the 20th century, we will at last be replacing an archaic set of restrictions with a legislative foundation for a 21st-century financial system." The measure, he added, "would provide significant benefits to the national economy."

Senator Gramm said the measure "is the most important banking legislation in 60 years."
Lawyers agree that repeal has been instrumental in saving some of the largest investment banks, so move on....

Back to the campaign... Is it an accident this financial meltdown occurred 6 weeks before the election? GF
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 03:31   #2950 (permalink)
 
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Whenever I am pressured to act quickly, my reflexive response is to put on the brakes and peek around the corner.

Rght now I can only hope that Congress gets this message!
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 03:32   #2951 (permalink)
 
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Does seem suspicious.
But as an American voter who do we trust with this information.
We watch CNN and it seems to be all Obama!
Fox news it seems to be all for McCain.
I do respect McCain, but think he is running this POW issue too much, we all know this already.
McCain has the experience, Sarah Palin even with just being the governor of Alaska has more experience than Obama with just his 143 days in office.
Have to vote the deep gut feeling on this one, McCain/Palin.
Anyone seen Al Gores latest statements about the green issue?
What a reject and international idiot!!!!

FOXNews.com - Al Gore Urges 'Civil Disobedience' Toward Coal Plants - Politics | Republican Party | Democratic Party | Political Spectrum

Last edited by Earl; 26th Sep 2008 at 03:45.
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 03:46   #2952 (permalink)
 
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Barit1

Quite agree, the bailout must be stopped. BUT, watch the MSM spin this into a new narrative--"Republicans in the Congress stop bailout, endangering the economy". SCARE headlines!! That said, the polls show Americans very divided on the bailout-stopping it could be a winner. But, boy is the media in the tank for BHO, they don't even pretend. i am not worried, if the voters vote in King Hussein, he will punish 'em badly. Retirement? Gone when the market tanks under new taxes. Health Care? Gone, better like government provided care. National Security? Gone, Military must be cut. Iraqis? You're on your own. Always watch out for what you wish for.

GF
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 04:32   #2953 (permalink)
 
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From the link above
Quote:
Approximately 30% of Americans own their homes free and clear. Many of these people do not want to bail out banks that made absurd idiotic loans while they were being prudent. In addition, many other Americans are making their mortgage payments on a timely manner. Do you think they are going to appreciate dolling out assistance to lenders that gambled their future away?
this whole bailout reminds me of the Aesop Fable "The Ant and the Grasshopper" ( Aesop's Fables, by Aesop; The Ant and the Grasshopper Page 1 )
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 04:37   #2954 (permalink)

 
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Whatever the Americans do with this bailout thing, it would be crazy to allow British banks to feed from the same troff. The Americans owe the British banks nothing and should not rescue other economies before there own is in the order of the apple pie.
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 06:38   #2955 (permalink)
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Prediction - which do you think the press is going to give more time, this, or "troopergate"? ....Yeah, don't hold your breath...

Obama's Garden Grant

The Chicago Sun-Times reports the Illinois attorney general is investigating a $100K government grant tied to Obama:

A $100,000 state grant for a botanic garden in Englewood that then-state Sen. Barack Obama awarded in 2001 to a group headed by a onetime campaign volunteer is now under investigation by the Illinois attorney general amid new questions, prompted by Chicago Sun-Times reports, about whether the money might have been misspent.

The garden was never built. And now state records obtained by the Sun-Times show $65,000 of the grant money went to the wife of Kenny B. Smith, the Obama 2000 congressional campaign volunteer who heads the Chicago Better Housing Association, which was in charge of the project for the blighted South Side neighborhood........
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 07:49   #2956 (permalink)
 
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Sen Richard Shelby (Republican-Alabama) is to be applauded for opposing the smoke and mirrors bailout.

Washington Mutual...gone!
JPMorgan to buy WaMu - Sep. 25, 2008
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 10:53   #2957 (permalink)
 
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The bill was passed by large majorities in both houses of Congress, 90-8 in the Senate and signed by Clinton-bipartisanship at its finest.
GF,

No need to go jumping all over cyberspace to get the gist of it.

Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act

Congressional history of the Act

The bills were introduced in the Senate by Phil Gramm (R-TX) and in the House of Representatives by James Leach (R-IA) and Thomas Bliley (R-VA). The bills were passed by a 54-44 vote largely along party lines with Republican support in the Senate[1] and by a 343-86 vote in the House of Representatives[2]. Nov 4, 1999: After passing both the Senate and House the bill was moved to a conference committee to work out the differences between the Senate and House versions. Democrats agreed to support the bill only after Republicans agreed to strengthen provisions of the Community Reinvestment Act and address certain privacy concerns.[3]
The final bipartisan bill resolving the differences was passed in the Senate and was signed into law by President Bill Clinton on November 12, 1999. [4]
The banking industry had been seeking the repeal of Glass-Steagall since at least the 1980s. In 1987 the Congressional Research Service prepared a report which explored the case for preserving Glass-Steagall and the case against preserving the act.[5]


You're trying to sell the political compromise...

("Democrats agreed to support the bill only after Republicans agreed to strengthen provisions of the Community Reinvestment Act...")

....as the cause of our demise when the thrust of the bill...

("The banking industry had been seeking the repeal of Glass-Steagall ---- The bills were introduced in the Senate by Phil Gramm (R-TX) and in the House of Representatives by James Leach (R-IA) and Thomas Bliley (R-VA)")...

...is the real problem. No sale.

Don Brown
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 11:24   #2958 (permalink)
 
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I hope no one is surprised...

Politics from the Pulpit

"About 30 ministers across the U.S. plan to protest federal tax laws Sunday by endorsing a presidential candidate from their pulpits, in a move orchestrated by a conservative legal-advocacy group."

Does anybody think they won't be endorsing mccain/PALIN ?

""As a pastor, I have the right to speak biblical truth without being punished for it," said the Rev. Jody Hice, pastor of Bethlehem First Baptist Church in Bethlehem, Ga., who says he will tell his congregation he backs Sen. John McCain for president. "The IRS does not have the role of censoring speech from the pulpit.""

In case the non-U.S. readers don't follow it all...it's the same old guys it has always been -- those that provide the foot soldiers and voters for the Republican Party. Just a different front.

Alliance Defense Fund

"The Alliance Defense Fund (ADF) is a conservative Christian profit organization with the stated goal of "defending the right to hear and speak the Truth through strategy, training, funding, and litigation."

ADF was launched in 1994 by Bill Bright (founder, Campus Crusade for Christ), Larry Burkett (founder, Crown Financial Ministries), James Dobson (founder, Focus on the Family), D. James Kennedy (founder, Coral Ridge Ministries), Marlin Maddoux (president, International Christian Media), and Donald Wildmon (founder, American Family Association), along with the leadership of over thirty other conservative Christian organizations.[3][4] ADF supports allied attorneys and organizations through strategy, training, funding, and direct litigation through its legal team. "


It's a great thing about Wikipedia. Visit the page, click on the links and you can spend all day reading the escapades of this cast of characters.

If you only have time for one, "Brother" Dobson wil do.

"A May 2005 article by Hedges in Harpers described Dobson as "perhaps the most powerful figure in the Dominionist movement" and "a crucial player in getting out the Christian vote for George W. Bush.""

" In his statement, Dobson said: "I cannot, and will not, vote for Senator John McCain, as a matter of conscience," and indicated that he would refrain from voting altogether were McCain to become the Republican candidate, ...."

" After McCain selected a pro-life candidate, Sarah Palin, as his running mate, Dobson said that he is more enthusiastic in his support for the Republican ticket."

"On June 24, 2008, Dobson publicly criticized statements made by U.S. Presidential candidate Barack Obama in Obama's 2006 "Call to Renewal"[61] address. Dobson stated that Obama was "distorting the traditional understanding of the Bible to fit his own worldview." "

So much for McCain's stance on "the agents of intolerance".

Don Brown
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 14:01   #2959 (permalink)
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I suppose the view you take from the leadership summit called by President Bush depends on your political leanings, but I had a sense that a big reason Obama didn't want to return to Washington was that he knew he had no business being in the same room with these people.

After all, his few short years in the senate have mostly been spent away running for president. He never bothered even to convene the Senate Foreign Relations Subcommittee for European Affairs, which he chairs, and which oversees NATO.

While Pelosi and Reid graciously deferred to him as spokesman for the Democrat position, does anyone really believe he was well informed, or indeed had any background at all regarding the financial crisis under discussion? I suspect he could only regurgitate the talking points handed him by someone else rather than discuss the issues at hand from any basis of experience or knowledge. I'll grant that Sarah Palin likely couldn't either, but she would approach the matter at least from her proven anti-corruption and government transparency ideological underpinnings, and she isn't running for president now anyway.

McCain, for his part, was largely silent, but I at least felt he knew the players, knew the issues, and deferred to those more closely involved in the negotiations while he has been out running for president. I had the sense he did belong in the same room, probably more so even than President Bush. And I think it's to his credit that by calling attention to the severity of this crisis by putting the debate on the back burner, he underscored its importance to the people, though I don't doubt political considerations were the driving factor behind his move.

Reports are that Barney Frank erupted in anger during the proceedings, probably sensing the withering heat of blame is more and more focusing on him. And Reid and Pelosi wisely stayed out of the spotlight in recognition of their own high negatives with the electorate. The prospect of Reid, Pelosi, Obama, and their sidekick, Frank, running this country unopposed, gives, or should give pause to the voters contemplating voting for Obama. I can only shudder, and convert more assets to physical gold should that come about.

Apparently McCain's move has neutralized the negative impact of the financial crisis on his poll numbers. If Americans are fearful, more so as we are start en masse to pay attention to the potential danger to our well-being of this problem, I like to think an old hand becomes more appealing than a smooth talker at the helm.



I'm editing to add this link to a YT vid, obviously pro-McCain, but one which brings up some key points to consider in determining how our financial situation came about. I welcome feedback that contests or refutes with facts, as I'm not certain what happened myself.

YouTube - Burning Down The House: What Caused Our Economic Crisis?

Last edited by BenThere; 26th Sep 2008 at 15:17.
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Old 26th Sep 2008, 15:44   #2960 (permalink)
 
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If you look at history on this, strengthening the CRA was a large part of the problem. At Frank's prodding, the GSEs pushed a lot of banks to place "affordable" mortgages which the GSEs promptly bought up, as was there charge from Congress. So the Congressional hacks are now trying to CYA by saying it was the repeal bill, when it was really the CRA and its attendant shoveling of money to bad mortgages.

GTF You have had many suggestionspour moi, how doing some primary research rather than Wikipedia. Hell, I can edit it.

OTOH, Krugman's article in today's NYT was good. "Where are the adults?", asking that question with Congressional old bulls, like Dodd and Frank, in the room is a cry in the wilderness. Everyone, including McCain, is playing politics. The country is closely divided on a bailout, everyone is scared about the financial outcome but don't like the bailout idea. Pols, being pols, don't want to commit and then find themselves on the wrong side. McCain is once again inside of BHO's OODA loop, but it may not work for him because no one can decision cycle fast enough with the limited information available.

Last edited by galaxy flyer; 26th Sep 2008 at 15:57.
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