Virgin v CX Staff Travel
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Virgin v CX Staff Travel
Check out Virgins staff travel package for its Pilots and FA's
After 1 year service you get 7 free tickets a year to give to anyone on your companions list, they do not have to be family.
After 5 years service you and companions entitled to upper class if empty seat and you can get them confirmed if flight open.
Spouse can travel anytime without you but companions must travel with employee. If employee is operating flight and companion does not get on the flight due to it being full, they may travel on next flight.
You can have 7 companions listed at all times however employee and spouse priority is higher.
After 5 years you're also entitled to airport lounges as ID.
Dress code - casual jeans allowed and trainers if clean no ripped clothes or shorts or t-shirts or vests.
Last but not least their ID tickets are much cheaper!
After 1 year service you get 7 free tickets a year to give to anyone on your companions list, they do not have to be family.
After 5 years service you and companions entitled to upper class if empty seat and you can get them confirmed if flight open.
Spouse can travel anytime without you but companions must travel with employee. If employee is operating flight and companion does not get on the flight due to it being full, they may travel on next flight.
You can have 7 companions listed at all times however employee and spouse priority is higher.
After 5 years you're also entitled to airport lounges as ID.
Dress code - casual jeans allowed and trainers if clean no ripped clothes or shorts or t-shirts or vests.
Last but not least their ID tickets are much cheaper!
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On the other hand...
All well and good. Let's enjoy a brief digression, if we may;
Let us compare:
VS vs CX job security.. VS enjoy one of the industries worst track records. CX enjoy one of the best.
VS vs CX pay.. Less than year 1 locally employed cadet SO. It continues to remain substantially below, all the way through the pay scales.
VS vs CX rosters.. Substantially worse than CX in most eyes.
VS vs CX time to command.. About on parity. The difference being the 8+ years airline experience you tend to need before joining VS, and the fact that CX will actually exist, in the coming decades.
Agreed, though; VS enjoy decent staff travel. Cheaper than CX, too. Out of curiosity, with what other carriers do they enjoy such benefits?
Swings and roundabouts. VS was a good act, back when the beard was in control. Now, it is an utter ****show, going nowhere, being demolished from within, with useless management, poor results, uncertain future, having missed out their Damocles thread, BMI slots. A niche service which is neither Loco nor Premium, whereby the 'sexy' image has sadly run its course.
Let us compare:
VS vs CX job security.. VS enjoy one of the industries worst track records. CX enjoy one of the best.
VS vs CX pay.. Less than year 1 locally employed cadet SO. It continues to remain substantially below, all the way through the pay scales.
VS vs CX rosters.. Substantially worse than CX in most eyes.
VS vs CX time to command.. About on parity. The difference being the 8+ years airline experience you tend to need before joining VS, and the fact that CX will actually exist, in the coming decades.
Agreed, though; VS enjoy decent staff travel. Cheaper than CX, too. Out of curiosity, with what other carriers do they enjoy such benefits?
Swings and roundabouts. VS was a good act, back when the beard was in control. Now, it is an utter ****show, going nowhere, being demolished from within, with useless management, poor results, uncertain future, having missed out their Damocles thread, BMI slots. A niche service which is neither Loco nor Premium, whereby the 'sexy' image has sadly run its course.
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Cathay "cannot" as a result of abuse of the staff travel system by some local employees (fraud).
Even I was approached by a local I knew who asked if I could add him (for a consideration) to my travel scheme.
As usual, EVERYONE is penalized by the actions of the few, really unfair.
Even I was approached by a local I knew who asked if I could add him (for a consideration) to my travel scheme.
As usual, EVERYONE is penalized by the actions of the few, really unfair.
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Cpt. Underpants,
Do you think this does not go on within VS? The point is that VS don't give a sh*t. My buddy with them says yes they know that happens but the numbers who do it are small and at the end of the day Virgin don't really care as it's too petty for them to bother about.
In their view its a benefit and the staff can do with it as they wish. No matter what benefit you give people will always find a way of abusing it.
My wife and I have no alive parents and I once asked Cathay could we add our helper as we have 3 kids and it would be a great help if she came with us when we went back home, on holiday etc. The answer from BN was "CANNOT." Yes maybe some (very few) did abuse the system but he and I both knew this was a very genuine case as it is for many people in CX but because it would greatly help me out at zero cost to CX then that made it an even bigger reason to say no. I mean why have a happy employee?
OSO
Do you think this does not go on within VS? The point is that VS don't give a sh*t. My buddy with them says yes they know that happens but the numbers who do it are small and at the end of the day Virgin don't really care as it's too petty for them to bother about.
In their view its a benefit and the staff can do with it as they wish. No matter what benefit you give people will always find a way of abusing it.
My wife and I have no alive parents and I once asked Cathay could we add our helper as we have 3 kids and it would be a great help if she came with us when we went back home, on holiday etc. The answer from BN was "CANNOT." Yes maybe some (very few) did abuse the system but he and I both knew this was a very genuine case as it is for many people in CX but because it would greatly help me out at zero cost to CX then that made it an even bigger reason to say no. I mean why have a happy employee?
OSO
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Yes but, Capt Undies, is it really fair to take it out on all of us. Why not hang out the blighters that caused the problems, make it known, under no uncertain terms that it isn't acceptable, instead of beating us all up over it. The punish all mentality is really to much sometimes.
Having worked for VS, I can confirm although the VS staff travel sounds good, it's like a lot of the Virgin Brand - all gloss and little substance.
Things have probably imporoved, but in my day, getting through to book your tickets could take all day using a premium rate phone line, collecting them was a nightmare and the reservations systems very flakey. Using VS staff travel was a real blood pressure booster!
Things have probably imporoved, but in my day, getting through to book your tickets could take all day using a premium rate phone line, collecting them was a nightmare and the reservations systems very flakey. Using VS staff travel was a real blood pressure booster!
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ETOPS240, what does your reply have to do with staff travel? I don't think anyone would consider quitting CX to go to VS for the travel benefits. The question is, "Why is CX's staff travel system so crappy compared to VS?"
For example, here is what CX charges its employees for a LHR-HKG-LHR ticket, STANDBY! (all fees and taxes included in these prices):
First Class: GBP 621- round trip
Business Class: GBP 398- round trip
Economy Class: GBP 200- round trip
I wonder what VS (or BA or LH or any other airline) charges ITS employees for the same trip!
CX MAKES LOTS OF MONEY FROM STAFF TRAVELING STANDBY IN A SEAT THAT WOULD OTHERWISE GO EMPTY!! THAT'S DISGRACEFUL!
For example, here is what CX charges its employees for a LHR-HKG-LHR ticket, STANDBY! (all fees and taxes included in these prices):
First Class: GBP 621- round trip
Business Class: GBP 398- round trip
Economy Class: GBP 200- round trip
I wonder what VS (or BA or LH or any other airline) charges ITS employees for the same trip!
CX MAKES LOTS OF MONEY FROM STAFF TRAVELING STANDBY IN A SEAT THAT WOULD OTHERWISE GO EMPTY!! THAT'S DISGRACEFUL!
Can't comment on CX V VS but can comment on CX V QF.
QF - Boarding by rank as well as seniority, I know this will polarise but I cannot see why a 6 year CC should get on before a 5 year F/O
QF- 4 tickets a year at high priority ( admittedly no freebies, but who wants to travel Y anyway ? )
QF- the system itself is so superior to CX it's not funny, for starters you can actually check loads (staff and pax) whilst you are working out which flight you want and booking same. No stupid ticket machines, no delving into the depths of CX to try and work out if you will get on. Literally can book a flight anywhere, anytime, if you have a smart phone ( including booking just prior to flight closing )
QF - listing, what the hell is listing ? You booked your ticket on that flight so we figure you must want to travel on that one
QF - if you are QF group, a 1 year CC will never get on before a 15 year captain ( Dragonair ??? )
CX staff travel is one of the worst I've encountered and don't get me started on some of the staff at the counter
QF - Boarding by rank as well as seniority, I know this will polarise but I cannot see why a 6 year CC should get on before a 5 year F/O
QF- 4 tickets a year at high priority ( admittedly no freebies, but who wants to travel Y anyway ? )
QF- the system itself is so superior to CX it's not funny, for starters you can actually check loads (staff and pax) whilst you are working out which flight you want and booking same. No stupid ticket machines, no delving into the depths of CX to try and work out if you will get on. Literally can book a flight anywhere, anytime, if you have a smart phone ( including booking just prior to flight closing )
QF - listing, what the hell is listing ? You booked your ticket on that flight so we figure you must want to travel on that one
QF - if you are QF group, a 1 year CC will never get on before a 15 year captain ( Dragonair ??? )
CX staff travel is one of the worst I've encountered and don't get me started on some of the staff at the counter
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QF- the system itself is so superior to CX it's not funny, for starters you can actually check loads (staff and pax) whilst you are working out which flight you want and booking same. No stupid ticket machines, no delving into the depths of CX to try and work out if you will get on. Literally can book a flight anywhere, anytime, if you have a smart phone ( including booking just prior to flight closing )
I saw the QF site last week, it's done by people who can think outside the box.
I was checking loads on QF for HKG to BNE, once entered the next page shows my flight at the top and then HKG to SYD to MEL etc, basically every possible city/combination that may be useful plus the next day, about 20 odd flight with all the loads displayed.
Again a common sense practical approach which is sorely lacking in CX.
Last edited by SMOC; 5th Feb 2012 at 05:43.
''Dan, have you been to the Cathay staff travel desk at CLK? haha''
Yes. Most recenly 36 hours ago - I'm in the UK right now as a result.
''I wonder what VS (or BA or LH or any other airline) charges ITS employees for the same trip!''
They will probably be the same. These are the standard Interline ZED rates. The ID90 rates will change depending on the airline's pricing policy. The LHR figures are subjuct to UK Air Passenger Duty, which is the highest in the world. A business class ticket from LHR to HKG currently has GBP 150 (HKD 1800) tax payable on departure.
I'm glad to hear the VS staff travel has improved - it was going to be hard for it to get worse. And I've had more of my fair share of grief with it - but at the outports - the LHR and LGW staff were usually great. Problems down route involved being refused access to a flight (even though there were seats available (JFK), being downgraded from J to Y (despite seats being available in J (JFK again) and my wife and her friend being refused access to seats despite the jump seats being allocated (LAS). luckily for them, the Captain and F/O were their husbands and the flight was delayed until they were on!
Yes. Most recenly 36 hours ago - I'm in the UK right now as a result.
''I wonder what VS (or BA or LH or any other airline) charges ITS employees for the same trip!''
They will probably be the same. These are the standard Interline ZED rates. The ID90 rates will change depending on the airline's pricing policy. The LHR figures are subjuct to UK Air Passenger Duty, which is the highest in the world. A business class ticket from LHR to HKG currently has GBP 150 (HKD 1800) tax payable on departure.
I'm glad to hear the VS staff travel has improved - it was going to be hard for it to get worse. And I've had more of my fair share of grief with it - but at the outports - the LHR and LGW staff were usually great. Problems down route involved being refused access to a flight (even though there were seats available (JFK), being downgraded from J to Y (despite seats being available in J (JFK again) and my wife and her friend being refused access to seats despite the jump seats being allocated (LAS). luckily for them, the Captain and F/O were their husbands and the flight was delayed until they were on!
Last edited by Dan Winterland; 5th Feb 2012 at 08:30.
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Boarding by rank as well as seniority, I know this will polarise but I cannot see why a 6 year CC should get on before a 5 year F/O
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Question
A bit OT perhaps, but the other day I missed four flights out of HKG to SYD in a row. All four flights, according to Traveldesk, were showing red in economy (0 avail) but green in business (4-8 seats available in J on each flight). I held J tickets and had refused to accept Y when asked the ritual "would you be willing to fly in economy class?" question.
On two of these four flights, right at the last minute Y was once again offered, while J was declared "full". My point is: if at the end economy is available while business class fills up, either Traveldesk lies, or else they are upgrading Y class pax (Asiamiles etc) ahead of staff holding J tickets. Isn't that not supposed to happen?
I didn't bother asking the staff at the desk, wary of their usual cold wall of impenetrable Chinglish. Eventually I accepted Y
On two of these four flights, right at the last minute Y was once again offered, while J was declared "full". My point is: if at the end economy is available while business class fills up, either Traveldesk lies, or else they are upgrading Y class pax (Asiamiles etc) ahead of staff holding J tickets. Isn't that not supposed to happen?
I didn't bother asking the staff at the desk, wary of their usual cold wall of impenetrable Chinglish. Eventually I accepted Y
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Spanner,
Just because you are a pilot doesn't mean you should be entitled to J class before more senior employees who perform unskilled labour, right?
Just because you are a pilot doesn't mean you should be entitled to more pay before more senior employees who perform unskilled labour, right?
Etc. Etc. Etc.
Figure it out: Not all careers come with the same level of benefits, or a very good reason...hence the "levels" of employees and so on, and so on....
Just because you are a pilot doesn't mean you should be entitled to J class before more senior employees who perform unskilled labour, right?
Just because you are a pilot doesn't mean you should be entitled to more pay before more senior employees who perform unskilled labour, right?
Etc. Etc. Etc.
Figure it out: Not all careers come with the same level of benefits, or a very good reason...hence the "levels" of employees and so on, and so on....
Last edited by Iron Skillet; 6th Feb 2012 at 09:11.
main_dog
Did you check the loads on Cupid? If Y was showing red then it would most likely have been over sold by a substantial amount. Cupid, unlike Travel Desk will tell you by how much. Was Travel desk also showing red overall? Usually well before check in the CX check in supervisors would have decided which Y class passengers would be upgraded, i.e. frequent flyers, Marco Polo etc. Having only recently travelled to Sydney myself, most flights were overbooked overall. I’m not sure though how many “No Shows” there were though in the end.
All that being said, I’m not sure how this will play out after the 12th?
Did you check the loads on Cupid? If Y was showing red then it would most likely have been over sold by a substantial amount. Cupid, unlike Travel Desk will tell you by how much. Was Travel desk also showing red overall? Usually well before check in the CX check in supervisors would have decided which Y class passengers would be upgraded, i.e. frequent flyers, Marco Polo etc. Having only recently travelled to Sydney myself, most flights were overbooked overall. I’m not sure though how many “No Shows” there were though in the end.
All that being said, I’m not sure how this will play out after the 12th?
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they are upgrading Y class pax (Asiamiles etc) ahead of staff holding J tickets. Isn't that not supposed to happen?
I'm sorry Iron Skillet, I'm with Spanner on that one. I agree with your comment about salary for different skill level, but staff travel benefits is a company wide benefit. Personally I have no problem with any colleague, regardless of job title, getting a seat ahead of me based on date of joining.
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In oversold Y situations, Golds and Diamonds
are upgraded in advance.
are upgraded in advance.
As such I assume they are upgrading to J even when not required, presumably through Asiamiles. As I recall, this was not supposed to happen ahead of staff holding J? I seem to remember reading this in CX News (the section that one wag recently desribed as the "Nippere$$ says No" column
), but Lord knows I've been wrong before.PS Titan, the overall was showing yellow or green as I recall. And yes I must learn to use cupid...
main_dog
As AAIGUY and myself said, the decision by CX to upgrade certain Y class pax in oversold Y class situations is made well before you or I get to the airport. If those pax get to the airport early, i.e. 3 hours before departure when check in usually starts for a flight, they will be given a J class boarding pass. As we all know though it’s not uncommon for no show pax especially in Y class when the flight closes for check in. Unfortunately for us, the upgrades have already occurred, leaving only Y class seats for us. It’s not uncommon to find large discrepancies between the loads on Travel Desk and Cupid. I’m not sure why this is the case but I think it is to do with the times each system is updated. Cupid is updated at 2:00, 6:00, 10:00, 14:00, 18:00 & 22:00 daily. I’m not sure what the times are for Travel Desk but it seems to be about 2 hours difference. Both systems though aren’t live which in my opinion is its biggest pain in the butt. Hopefully iJourney will be live and will actually give us real figures, i.e. seats available whether it be under or over sold. I’m not holding my breath though as this info seems to be treated like secret squirrel stuff and the staff can’t be trusted with it.
As AAIGUY and myself said, the decision by CX to upgrade certain Y class pax in oversold Y class situations is made well before you or I get to the airport. If those pax get to the airport early, i.e. 3 hours before departure when check in usually starts for a flight, they will be given a J class boarding pass. As we all know though it’s not uncommon for no show pax especially in Y class when the flight closes for check in. Unfortunately for us, the upgrades have already occurred, leaving only Y class seats for us. It’s not uncommon to find large discrepancies between the loads on Travel Desk and Cupid. I’m not sure why this is the case but I think it is to do with the times each system is updated. Cupid is updated at 2:00, 6:00, 10:00, 14:00, 18:00 & 22:00 daily. I’m not sure what the times are for Travel Desk but it seems to be about 2 hours difference. Both systems though aren’t live which in my opinion is its biggest pain in the butt. Hopefully iJourney will be live and will actually give us real figures, i.e. seats available whether it be under or over sold. I’m not holding my breath though as this info seems to be treated like secret squirrel stuff and the staff can’t be trusted with it.