Fragrant Harbour WannabesA forum for those applying to Cathay Pacific, Dragonair or any other Hong Kong based airline or operator. Use this area for both Direct Entry Pilot and Cadet-scheme queries
And I will stress on the fact that the move wasnt massively advertised like the Etihad CPP. I think that shows that they do not need massive amounts of useless applications and will continue hiring HK locals as well as a few very good expats who are actually interested (Cause they were actually looking for an opportunity and found it. Cause the cahnge was really really subtle. Just a couple of words changed in the requirements, nothing more.) Etihad for example advertised the crap out of their bran new Global program and what they got was thousands and thousands of applicants, making their job of selecting the right guys even harder cause they only made assessments, with no CV review, meaning that the best candidates with the best profile and best potential may have been left out for the smart ones. Anyone can be smart, but not everyone can fly a plane. thats why i think CX's discretion about the matter is very good as it leaves the chance for HK locals to breakthrough as well as a couple of very motivated and passionate expats.
With overseas cp,maybe the intake of DESO and DEFO will be less. This has no impact on local cadets as currently, most slot are filled by them. the company is just cutting down on them and adding overseas cp.locals slots stays .This way CX is saving loads of money as mention above in my post.
this is not kind of the case that all applicant pass, CX will take all of the applicant. such as there are 100 applicant, pass is 50%, 90% of applicant over 50, slot only 10, would they still take all 90% people to be cadet?
Is there no competition?
Quote:
As I said, cake is such big, what is the chance to have 1 of it?
Quote:
Who knows, CX didn't mention amount of slot for local and expat
slots?
mate, there are no slots. the selection process is all about being able to jump over a bar, that's it. if miraculously one year there are 100 people who apply for a cx cadetship and subsequently all make the grade, cathay will want to retain all of these people, local or expatriate, even if they cannot afford to give training to everyone at the same amount of time. this has happened before and will continue to happen again.
let me give you an example to illustrate this, perhaps this will help you see the light.
in late 2007 the Dragonair cadet course for that year (DA9) graduated from training in Adelaide. however due to the lack of training resources in KA they were seconded to CX to serve as S/Os for a year. the lack of training resources was due to a myriad of reasons, which are beyond the scope of importance in this thread. the important thing is, these conditions did not vastly change throughout 2008, and it was easy to see that given the new direction of Dragonair, the airline would probably not need anymore pilots or have the facilities to train new-comers. early this year, another batch of Dragonair cadets graduated (DA10), yet they have remained unemployed for over half a year now, due to the very same reasons that banished the preceding class from working in KA. however in mid-2008, KA still continued its recruitment of cadet pilots. this batch are the latest batch of Dragonair cadets training in adelaide (DA11).
why do you think KA still recruited cadet pilots, despite the fact that they obviously didn't need anymore new pilots? the reason is because despite their probable incapacity to train these cadets once they leave flight training in adelaide, the company did not want to let these men/women with potential slip from their grip and end up working for some other airline. Dragonair would rather recruit these cadets and train them, and hope that training resources will become available at the end of their training. and what happens if KA aren't able to train these newly-graduated cadets once they graduate? just take a look DA10. they have been unemployed for half a year now, and the situation for them does not look very rosy. however once things pick up, they are sure to be given phone calls and start dates.
what i am trying to say here is that airlines would rather tie you to them with a cadetship and ab-initio training, rather than let you slip away to their competitors, especially when your employment could save a bucket-load of cash for them. obviously, this is based on the condition that you satisfy the airline's requirements for a cadet pilot. with a mindset like that, do you think airlines will limit the number of people with potential they take?
tied in with what misu11 said in #42 - i hav always thought CX limited the CPP for 2 reasons:
1- a local will stick with the company even if the contract terms r under par, simply because their roots are in hk. a BBC,CBC,ABC with id, and now, the rest of the world, i am not sure if they would stick it out here for that long once they got the hours n become very employable. hence, locals (cheap, more exploitable), expat (less 'loyal' to the airline.)
2- good publicity/ the image of giving something back.
and for the above reasons i believe CX would ALWAYS prefer a local if they meet their standard - they would not want to open it up to the rest of the world unless its absolutely necessary, programs like the CPP (all paid for) are almost unique in the world, one can imagine the extra manpower to process all the applications. in my opinion it complicates everything for CX, but just as hard, if not more difficult, to seive out the right people.
however, eventually the economy will pick up and they will need good pilots to fill those seats who will uphold CX's standards. Yes there r lots of people interested in aviation in hk - but probably just a tiny portion of them meet CX's standards - as a local myself - i think its down to the following:
1. english
2. personality
3. passion/ interest
from wt i observed, which may well prove to be wrong - there maybe lots of local candidates out there who has 2+3, or even just lots and lots of 3, but none of the others. some may have 1+2, but if they had those abilities in HK, they probably have laid their eyes on something else already. if you take away the groups mentioned above, CX really isn't left with many to choose from. therefore i think CX opened up the CPP primary to make up the numbers + short-mid term cheap workforce. local + able candidates is their holy grail. so ... for abt the zillionth time - heads up guys - particularly locals - if u r gd enough - U WILL MAKE IT!
what Cathay Pacific need now is chaos. fly the flag guys.
Actually it is not really a matter or not you royal to the airline, once you get paid, you work, you may settle by some other reasons. I think this is a positive direction to absorb new blood. There are lot of people around the world interested in aviation ultimately flying big jet yet worry about funding. Global cadetship somewhat may raise up the brand emphasizing its name - potentially global airline + city + airport..etc.. Not big deal to local really.
As company itself they might wish to holding great extend amount of selection candidate. enlarge the pools in stead of finding people to fill the job, different positions, different outcomes. Putting measurement in terms of time, time = money. In stead of waiting those second or third attempt, thats the way to earning resource.
OscarGolfIndia wrote:
The fact that it is open to everyone now won't hurt your chances.
There is no competition in the selection process between candidates. Cathay has a real hard time finding suitable candidates for the CPP, and has no quotas. It's wrong to see it as competition.
Plus, CX is expanding the CPP with more batches per year, so that's good.
Basically, if you're good enough, you will get in. CX will make a space for you.
There IS COMPETITION among Candidates! Please READ carefully e-mail below from CX:
Quote:
.......................As you will appreciate, there is considerable competition for our Cadet Pilot Program and as a result we have to disappoint many applicants. Regrettably, we have concluded that we cannot offer you a place in our stage three selection process.
I am sure this has come as a disappointment to you, but unfortunately it is a final decision. We wish you well for the future and would like to thank you for your continued interest in Cathay Pacific Airways.
Sorry to hear that. But I am deeply appreciated with your post telling the truth to those people who is saying no competition in CX selection. You really tell their them what is the real world.
For those people, I hope you would understand what the real world is. There will be more and more intense competition in cadet program. Then you would understand what I mentioned
.......................As you will appreciate, there is considerable competition for our Cadet Pilot Program and as a result we have to disappoint many applicants. Regrettably, we have concluded that we cannot offer you a place in our stage three selection process.
I am sure this has come as a disappointment to you, but unfortunately it is a final decision. We wish you well for the future and would like to thank you for your continued interest in Cathay Pacific Airways.
Yours Sincerely,
------------
------------
Thanks for clarifying, gotta realise what the reality of this world is...(no competition in the process? What a load of non-sense). What people can believe is that there are always someone better than u in this world....but what we shouldnt believe is an interview process or a selection process that could completely filter and not miss any real potential candidates out there....and if u say Cathay can do that...then thats B.S.
Is a polite, politically correct way to say you didn't meet the grade!
The cadet programme has been opened up internationally because not enough HKers meet....
Quote:
1. english
2. personality
3. passion/ interest
And I mean ALL of them!
1. ICAO Level 4
(Yes...invited to next stage......No.....Goodbye ".there is considerable competition.." ).
2. CRM (Can you sit in the cockpit for 8 hours with someone and will they want to sit with you!)
(Yes...invited to next stage......No.....Goodbye ".there is considerable competition.." ).
3. Is it worth spending the money on you! (Will you stay with flying and CX)
(Yes...invited to next stage......No.....Goodbye ".there is considerable competition.." ).
CX is lucky to field a class of 10 cadets on each course and a majority of them are from UK, CAN, AUS. So therefore meet ICAO Level 6: Expert!
Quote:
ICAO has established six levels of language proficiency:
The minimum language level for licensing purposes is ICAO Level 4. To be assessed at ICAO Level 4 or above, a pilot or air traffic controller must achieve Level 4 in all six of the ICAO skill areas: Pronunciation, Structure, Vocabulary, Fluency, Comprehension and Interactions.
If you want to start quoting SQ, all of them would pass the language proficiency level 4, HK does not promote English in schools as well as Singapore.
If you want the HK government to get involved with CX cadet hiring, you better start with improving English in HK schools!
And finally a pilots license does not mean you meet CX standards, CX knocks hundreds of pilots with thousands of hours back every month and those are subject to rules 2 & 3 above, just like cadet pilot applicants!
And finally a pilots license does not mean you meet CX standards, CX knocks hundreds of pilots with thousands of hours back every month and those are subject to rules 2 & 3 above, just like cadet pilot applicants!
Well, it is really great that u sound like u have a great insight into the interview standards. If are you're flying with Cathay right now...awesome...good on ya u have met the 3 all the way to stage 4. If you ain't flying with Cathay...then why are u still here? Did u not meet 1 of the 3 Criteria...or u think u did? But u just got unlucky that u got rejected? Because somehow in those 3 Criteria Cathay gave u a 'NO' therefore u couldnt move on the next stage? Hence u receive a letter quoting "there is considerable competition...sorry...cant give ya an offer." And after such event, did u ask urself 3 questions? Did i not meet the english standard? Do i have a personality problem? Did I not have a passion for flying?
And to ur exact point as well holdmetight. Did u ask urself that and came up with a 'YES' in any of the 3 questions above?
Did u ask urself that and came up with a 'YES' in any of the 3 questions above?
i admit i did a bit of soul-searching after my last unsuccessful attempt at the CXCPP. i fell short of the bar due to a combination of factors, none of which are amongst the three that you speak of. i don't believe that i was unlucky or disadvantaged in any way.
"I have one wish. I want to see there are more and more cadets who were born in HK, educated in HK, and they grow up in HK. They can not only speak native Cantonese, write Chinese and read Chinese but also speak fluent English like British. They are not ABC, BBC or CBC. Their dreams first come from seeing jetliners flying over Kai Tak in Kowloon City. They are passionate about aviation."
Well , don't forget that the mother tongue for malaysian chinese are cantonese as well.They can equally read and write chinese/cantonese and have excellent command of english. Culture,religion and language is 100% the same as hong kong and there are tons of malaysian who would be happy to be base and spend the rest of thier life in HK.
Solution for you...Don't buy their stock, don't fly with them, don't apply for CPP, Learn mandarine and fly for air china
expat/locals who wants to work for Cathay
Have fun in Hong Kong and I'll meet you all in LKF(go google it if you don't know where this place is) when I get into CATHAY
+1
ANd People...no one said there was NO competition. Of course there's competition!! Even before the CX CPP opened up to foreigners. They know what they are doing and I am pretty sure they wouldnt jeopardise locals' chances of getting in for foreigners. There must be some kind of strategy behind that. More slots? maybe!! Please read carefully before commenting. If you are good enough you WILL get through: FACT!! I got a NO from the Etihad CPP earlier this year and was quite enraged at first but then I realised where I went wrong. I probably messed up the Visual abstract test thing and I didnt manage my time properly so i ended up with several unanswered questions even though the tests were NOT negatively marked! Do I think I can make a fine pilot? Maybe...but the fact is i messed up those tests and thats why i didnt get through. They dont kick you out because theres's too much competition..thats just a way for them to put it...basically what theyre saying is you dont satisfy our requirements. We know perfectly what real life is about and one thing about life is that you should never interpret everything people say literally. Few are the things people say that are straightforward and completely true. There's always an underlying meaning in everything people say. You should understand that before trying to teach us about real life. Im mayB 21 but trust me im not a beginner when it comes to real life issues.
I have browsed through this discussion w.r.t the requirements needed to apply for the Cathay Cadet program.
As I understand it, the program is open to all nationalities now, but what I have not yet been able to confirm is whether non-residents of Hong Kong who also do not have a HK ID number, can apply.
That is, can a Canadian citizen (myself), who has never lived in or visited Hong Kong, apply to this program?
I've searched for a definite answer but couldn't find one.
Appreciate your response.
i don't see why you can't apply, if CX have already removed the HK residency requirement and effectively put the cadet program on the international stage.
Linear Mode
