IR(H) Exams

[fuktifino]

Hello All,

Just wondering can anyone give a word of advise as to where to get the best feedback for the IR exams. unfortunately i let my ATPL exams lapse and have to re-sit the six exams required to do my IR. Is the bristol website the place to go? or can anyone advise better?

Thanks :)

[misbourne]

Yahoooo, just finished mine all passed first time thanks to Ground training Services in Bournemouth. Roger and his team are top.

Bristol groundschool is a great tool in subjects such as Met,HPL,Air Law,IFR comms. However for Nav,Instruments and Flight planning you need to know the subject. Good Luck

[Firefly01]

If you're looking for a school with which to do the exams, no need to look any further that Bristol or give C.A.P.T. a go at Wycombe Air Park - Phil Croucher is very good at what he does.

[misterbonkers]

CAPT payment structure is very reasonable too - being able to 'pay as you go' for the books/support/brush up is very handy and good for ones budget.

[Captain Gartmort]

What are the six subjects you have to resit for the IR?

[Pandalet]

Another vote for CAPT - Phil and Gerry got me through most of the (new) ATPL(H) stuff without a problem. Final exams in Jan :bored:

[helimutt]

7 exams! At least i'm sure I did 7. It hasn't changed again has it?

Nav, Met, Human Performance, IFR Comms, Air Law, Flight Planning, Instruments.

Oh happy days at GTS. :ok:

GTS supplied loads of practice questions which were 'very useful'!!:)

[fuktifino]

thanks for the swift replies, much appreciated. Helimutt the reason only 6 exams the CAA have given a credit for human performance.pity they wouldnt credit them all!!!

[ThomasTheTankEngine]

I used GTS who were very good, I also used the Bristol question bank for met, hpl, air law and IR comms, very usefull.

[Whirlygig]

The feedback from the Bristol question bank is very good and worth the cost for final exam practice.

Cheers

Whirls

[misterbonkers]

Out of interest...

How does one get credit for Human Performance?

[fuktifino]

misterbonkers,

"Out of interest...

How does one get credit for Human Performance?"

I was advised to email the CAA and see would they credit me any of the exams from having done them previously and they replied back that it states in LASORS that they will credit Human Performance.

[Bravo73]

The feedback from the Bristol question bank is very good and worth the cost for final exam practice.


x2

The most straight forward way to a 90%+ average.

[misterbonkers]

Fuktifino - Merci

[choppertop]

Anyone doing IR(H) theory know whether the pertinent questions fall under ATPL(H) or ATPL(H) Interim on the question bank? Bristol offers both but it's not clear which set IR(H) students should 'memorise'. Ta.

[ThomasTheTankEngine]

Hi Chopertop

The IR(H) exams are the same as the IR(A) i;e its not A or H specific and there are no questions on POF.

So for the IR theory I used the ATPL(A) question bank for the relevent exams, I only used the question bank for air law, HPL, Met and IR comms.

There will be questions on the ATPL(A) queston bank that do not apply for the IR exams, some of the local winds in the met exam which are relevent for ATPL are not relevent for IR also there should be no questions on FMS at IR level, however the CAA do keep putting some of these questions in the IR exams, your ground school course provider will be able to tell you whats relevent and whats not, if you do get non relevent questions in the exams answer them but appeal against them, I had 4 questions on FMS in the systems exam which were all credited.

[choppertop]

... does anyone have the definitive latest thinking on whether the holder of a CPL(H)+ IR(H) satisfies the knowledge reqs for an ATPL(H) credit? Or did JAR-FCL2 amendments subsequent to amendment 3 definitely change all that? Previous threads leave the outcome tantalisingly hanging. [The current LASORS still says CPL(H)+IR(H) = ATPL(H) knowledge reqs]. Help me grope through the gloom ...

[paco]

The current CPL(H) is going to become the ATPL(H)(VFR), as the academic standard of both is the same. Add the IR to that = ATPL(H), without the multi-crew and rather large helicopter as a type rating. Thus, there will no doubt be some extra paperwork involved to do the conversion. But there shouldn't be exams.

Phil

[Bravo73]

choppertop,

paco knows most about is going to happen but as it currently stands, no, CPL + IR theory does not add up to ATPL theory.

[paco]

As far as I know, that's the current thinking - given that there's nobody in the policy department at the CAA right now it's going to be difficult to get an answer!

Last I was told it will be different when the licence changes because the new CPL(H) will be at the same academic standard as the current CPL(A).

Phil

[misterbonkers]

so if I sat the ATPL(H) exams in order to gain my CPL(H) within the 7 year validity period then am I going to get reissued with an ATPL(H)(VFR)?

[paco]

In theory, but don't hold your breath - it has to go through Parliament yet.

Phil

[paco]

Directly from my inspector:

"Currently, CPL(H) + IR(H) theory is the equivalent in theoretical knowledge to an ATPL(H)"

Phil

[Bravo73]

Phil,

Are you sure that your inspector is 'up to date' with Amendment 6 to JAR-FCL 2? I was led to believe when Amendment 6 came in, CPL + IR theory no longer equals ATPL theory.


(From personal experience, the 'interim' ATPL syllabus certainly covered many topics that aren't covered if you study the CPL and IR courses separately.)

[helipeek]

I've just emailed PLD for an answer as I'm doing the IR exams at the moment. I'll post their response in full just as soon as I get and answer.

Oh course the answer I would like is "please accept exemptions to all the IR exams - love and kisses from all at PLD"

Fat chance!!!!

[Dragpin]

Old national ATPL 13 exams passed in the past, just emailed them and got no exemptions at all.

If JAR CPL(H) can have an exemption for Human Performance then why not old CPL(H)/ ATPL(H).

When someone in EASA or the Authority put some sense into the system, hell will freeze over.:ugh:

[helimutt]

this is what I received when I asked PLD

Dear Mr xxxx

As per my previous

I can confirm as per JAR-FCL 2.285 (amendment 3) the holder of a CPL(H) and IR(H) satisfies the knowledge requirements for the issue of an ATPL(H).

The above is also noted in JAR–FCL 2.050 Crediting of flight time and theoretical knowledge (amendment 6)

(11) The holder of a CPL(H) and IR(H) gained under previous amendments of JAR FCL 2 up to and including Amendment 3 is credited with the theoretical knowledge
requirements for ATPL(H) and IR(H).

I hope this resolves your query, however if you do have any further queries please do not hesitate to contact me.

Yours sincerely
xxxxx xxxxxxxxx





Hope that is of use guys.

[206Fan]

I can confirm as per JAR-FCL 2.285 (amendment 3) the holder of a CPL(H) and IR(H) satisfies the knowledge requirements for the issue of an ATPL(H).

But only with 1000hrs+?

[Bravo73]

NB


I can confirm as per JAR-FCL 2.285 (amendment 3) the holder of a CPL(H) and IR(H) satisfies the knowledge requirements for the issue of an ATPL(H).


We are now on Amendment 6.

[helimutt]

Is there a problem with the understanding?



I can confirm as per JAR-FCL 2.285 (amendment 3) the holder of a CPL(H) and IR(H) satisfies the knowledge requirements for the issue of an ATPL(H).

Yes, This satisfies the knowledge requirements!!
You'll still need to satisfy the other requirements before atpl issue. (ie night, Instrument, multi crew, requirements etc)


The holder of a CPL(H) and IR(H) gained under previous amendments of JAR FCL 2 up to and including Amendment 3 is credited with the theoretical knowledge requirements for ATPL(H) and IR(H).

If you gain the CPL(H) and IR(H) after Amendment 3 then you will need to do the ATPL exams again but probably get a reduction in requirements due to the fact you've already jumped through the hoops previously.

[Bravo73]

Sweat not, hm. I was just pointing out that detail for the benefit of the poster who first asked for the clarification. (ie choppertop).

IIRC, his exams have all been 'post amendment 3'.

[helimutt]

It's a bloody minefield out there. :E
I wouldn't do them all again.

I believe you get the requirement for ground school time reduced to whatever the training provider thinks necessary, or something like that.

My last word on the matter. We've been here before I think.:ok:

[Whirlygig]

When was Amendment 6 adopted by the CAA as it certainly appears from the website that they are still operating under Amendment 3? I suspect therein lies the confusion.

Cheers

Whirls

[paco]

Therein lies the rub - they're not using 6 yet!

Phil

[ThomasTheTankEngine]

As far as I can see the CAA are still using amendment 3 of JAR FCL 2 (See lasors) So CPL(H) + IR(H) still = ATPL(H) IR theory.

I think AIC 72/2007 has caused a lot of confusion and caused some of us to believe that ammendment 6 of JAR FCL 2 has been fully implicated by the CAA. However only the following parts have been introduced (See below, I've only copied the relevent parts) these are only the theoretial knowledge requirements if your changeing from A to H or visaversa.

AIC 72/2007
Bridging of Theoretical Knowledge before licence issue (JAR-FCL 2.050(b)(5).

JAR–FCL 2.050
Crediting of flight time and theoretical knowledge
(b) Crediting of theoretical knowledge
(2) In order to obtain a PPL(H), the
holder of a PPL(A), CPL(A) or ATPL(A) shall
fulfil the requirements specified in Appendix 1
to JAR-FCL 2.050.
(3) In order to obtain a CPL(H), the
holder of a CPL(A) or (ATPL(A) shall fulfil the
requirements specified in Appendix 2 to JARFCL
2.050.
(4) In order to obtain an ATPL(H), the
holder of an ATPL(A) shall fulfil the
requirements specified in Appendix 3 to JARFCL
2.050.

(5) The credits specified in paragraphs
(b)(2), (b)(3) and (b)(4) above shall also apply
to applicants having passed the theoretical
knowledge examination in all subjects required
for the issue of the relevant aeroplane pilot
licence, provided they meet the acceptance
period in accordance with JAR-FCL 1.495

[Whirlygig]

Thanks TtTE, that's certainly how it looks to me!

Does anyone have any idea when Amendment 6 will be adopted in the UK i.e., is there enough time to sit and pass the IR(H) exams before the new rules are implemented?

Cheers

Whirls

[choppertop]

... just got to pass those little IR theory f*ckers now.

Thanks for the combined input, people.

And please don't put me on the naughty chair during consolidation week for doubting you, Paco. lol.

C-top

[ThomasTheTankEngine]

Hi Whirls

As long as youve registerd with a ground school and started studying for the IR (Distance learing is ok) you can complete the course under ammendment 3 JAR FCL 2. There are time limits of course, you need to complete all the theory exams with in 18 months after passing the first exam and then gain the IR within 36 months after completing all the IR exams.

I would strongly advise getting it in writting from the CAA though. Plus if you done the CPL JAR exams you may get some credits as one of the other posters here did.

[Whirlygig]

Thanks TtTE; I haven't signed up (yet!!) but have passed the CPL exams. I was just interested whether signing up say, tomorrow, would still be valid. No doubt there are others in the same predicament!

Cheers

Whirls

[helipeek]

Just to let you know that I've got a dispensation from the authority from HP&L as I did the JAR ATPL(H) exmas a while ago. They quoted JAR FCL2.

Result!!

[paco]

For the IR you are exempt Human performance anyway if you already have a CPL(H), so that leaves 6 exams.

Phil

[Dragpin]

Paco

Is that just for a JAR (CPL) or does it also count for the old National (CPL)/ (ATPL)?

[paco]

It's in LASORS, but I believe it covers the UK one as well.

phil

[fuktifino]

Hello All,

Just about to start studying for my IR(H) exams (again)!!
Just wondering if anyone can steer me in the best direction of what to study, eg which sections on Bristol database etc.

Thanks.