RAE Thurleigh

[Busa1400]

I used to work at RAE Thurleigh about 20 years ago. At the time they had a BAE111, amongst others. I seem to remember a Seaking with a radar bulb built on the nose. I know it is a long shot, but anyone got any photos of the Thurleigh fleet ?

[safetypee]

I suggest you look for a copy of “A short illustrated history of RAE Bedford” by Arthur Pearcy. Airlife pubs ISBN 1 85310 660 8. Although the book is published in black and white, there is a good range of photos.

['India-Mike]

I've only got images of Puma XW241 and Lynx ZD559. Will scan them next week and post. Both official shots by site photographer (Peter ?). I never ever took a camera onto the site. Now I wish I had. Do an !!!!!!!!!!!!!! search for ZB506 and you'll see it with the nose radar. 241 is now a sad looking specimen; 559 is at Boscombe. Many happy hours on both as an FO (no, not a first officer:))

[green granite]

Canberra line up here

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/att...hmentid=109932 (http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/attachment.php?attachmentid=109932)

edited: to add that there was a unofficial and very limited edition video tape, made by some of the ground crew, of the last days at Bedford. It showed most of the aircraft doing very low farewell passes in front of the hangars. I had a copy but I can't find it (think the wife probably through it out when we dumped the vhs m/c.

[lightningmate]

'Testing Colours' by Adrian Balch ISBN 1-85310-349-7 has many colour photos of the RAE & A&AEE air fleets. Many of the Bedford types are included.

lm

[Genghis the Engineer]

I may have a few lurking in an album somewhere, what are you after?

G

[NutLoose]

Oddly enough I saw the Sea King when it visited Odious....... it had strain gauges all over its nose as part of the trial.... a Chief we had who had just done all the courses to move onto it, but did diddly squat else rushed out to refuel it and could not find the caps........ it was a US model I believe and they were on the other side to ours...

[Busa1400]

Thanks very much, i was an electronics apprentice at RAE Thurleigh, and remember doing compass swings on a god awful day in December. My apprentice master was in the cockpit putting his thumbs out of the window every now and again.

Many happy memories of RAE Thurleigh, from heading into the site on my little 80cc moped from bedford in the driving snow, to being caught using the phone to ring the Met Office, to get weekend weather report so could work out if I could met the girlfriend, urmmm to continue my education !!!

I also never dared to take a camera onto the site, and camera phones didn't exist.

I remember as a treat we were taken up in a BAE111 for a fly around. I also remember another apprentice had built a digital clock, that worked, but drew 3 AMPS !!!!

Just really looking for photo's to help jog the memories, i also recall a Jaguar coming in that had had some of it's wing ripped off, young pilot did not eject, brought it in safely

[LFT]

Got a copy of 'Testing Colours' and it's a very interesting book with some excellent photographs.

Here's a recent shot of Thurleigh from the air -

- - Aircraft Photos - Bedford-Thurleigh @ Airplane-Pictures.net (http://www.airplane-pictures.net/image20670.html)

[yakker]

Two books about RAE Bedford, one as safetypee has mentioned

“A short illustrated history of RAE Bedford” by Arthur Pearcy. Airlife pubs ISBN 1 85310 660 8.

and another book with more information and photographs

"Wings over Thurleigh" by Micheal D. Dobson ISBN 0-9541594-0-3

The second book covers 1954 to 1994, an amazing history of research and development.

ps In 'Wings over Thurleigh' I figure in the photograph on page 98 :)

[green granite]

i also recall a Jaguar coming in that had had some of it's wing ripped off, young pilot did not eject, brought it in safely

IIRC he lost the rest of it on the guy wires at the Sandy Heath TV mast.

[green granite]

YDNRC - You do not remember correctly!

I'd left by then and that was I was told by what I thought was a reliable source. :suspect:
Charwelton Radio Tower is even more solid than Sandy Heath twr.

[HZ123]

Well someone from Northants eventually had to be famous I suppose. I lived in Bedford in the 70,s and remember the RB engined VC10 doing circuits in the distance. As with so many things in life in those days had no interest in aviation and only recall driving past the airfield once.

[mandylifeboat]

Anyone know where I could get a copy of "Wings Over Thurleigh? Booksellers of the world seem to be bereft of copies.

[green granite]

Try putting in a request at your local library and tell them that Bedford Library has a copy.

[mandylifeboat]

Thanks for that, GG, I'll give it a try.

[matt_hooks]

I had the privelege of a guided tour of the windtunnels there a while ago, what a fascinating place! I live locally, went to school within a couple of miles of the airfield and wind tunnels.

Unfortunately the airfield is now covered in parked cars. I flew over it many times during my training. Of course now part of the runway and some of the taxiways form the Palmer racing track. There were plans mooted recently to turn it back into an active airfield, but I think they've been shelved because of complaints from locals.

[compton3bravo]

I also lived in Bedford during the 1960s, 70s and 1980s and well remember Monarch Britannias and B720s pounding the circuit doing training as well as BOAC aircraft (cannot remember if they were B707s and B747s probably both) - am now an old git. As a member of Air-Britain Luton branch we managed to have a tour round in the 1980s and a fascinating day we all had. I could not believe the amount of aircraft they had there ranging from Tornados to a Vickers Viscount. Also went to an Arthur Piercy lecture in Bedford - he used to work at Thurleigh - very interesting it was too - he was also trying to sell some of his books as well - good old Arthur now sadly missed.

[chevvron]

I did a liaison vist there years ago when I first arrived at Farnbrorough. The wind was south westerly favouring runway 24, but this didn't have ILS, so there was a Monarch '720 doing visual and ILS circuits on 27, interleaving with an Andover doing 5.5 deg MLS approaches; on the reciprocal 09 there was a Hunter doing 1 in 1s, and there was the odd departure/arrival on runway 24; yes it did get busy!!

[VictorGolf]

I believe there is a strip available for "fly-in" visitors to the Jonathan Palmer driving days. Anyone used it or know where it is?

[CharlesM07]

we lived in the 'Officers Mess' at Thurleigh in the late 60's early 70's. I went to school at Pilgrim in Bedford, and learnt to fly at Cranfield..The most interesting aircart were the VSTOL 'flying bedstead', the Trident, Canbera and 111 'blind landing and ILS aircraft' - comet, also, I recall - with nose extention full of electronics; a couple of Shackletons; the STOL Harrier test facility, with the 'carrier ski-jump' set up, and the runway / carrier hook/wire set up.. Every morning an RAF Heron or Dove would arrive carrying who knows what/who. Phantoms would beat up the runway going afterburner / wertical at midpoint. But the Flying bedstead was the most unique... I used to ride to the fence near the approach or the hangers and breath in the amazing sights - wish I'd had a camera then, too..:cool:

[CharlesM07]

Almost forgot the Concorde wing test bed on a delta winged.....(forgot the type..!!) also the Olympus testbed Vulcan that was a very regular visitor. I often asked for a 'touch and go' when out from Cranfield - never got past ATC. I think the ATC boss knew we were all after his daughter...!!!!

[chevvron]

Charles; the 'Heron or Dove' was most probably the 'Bedford Ferry' Devon from Farnborough. It usually ran for the 'boffins' twice a day morning and evening, with a lunchtime one added when required. There were 4 Devons on strength at Farnborough and they also served the other RAEs at Aberporth, Llanbedr and West Freugh.

[CharlesM07]

Chevvron, thanks for the Devon correction. I also made an error on the 'flying bedstead' - I meant the VSTOL prototype the Shorst SC1 (I think) - an amazing aircraft that looked like a bumblebee with a very long probe on it's nose. The test pilots were very regular habitants of the officers mess. I also enjoyed the boac 747 crew familiarization 'touch and go' flights, and the VC10 RB test bed, there were also a number of Hunter test aircraft, but not sure of the project, etc. I met a retired BA Captain many years later who flew the 1-11 test aircraft from Thurleigh, and who, as a training Captain, made 747 familiarization flights to the field....

[Helen49]

Back in the 70s Thurleigh was considered as a 3rd London Airport.....along with Foulness. Alas we got Stansted.

H49

['India-Mike]

Chevvron

Quite right about the Devons. and they were far superior (from a passenger point of view) to the Chieftains that replaced them. The Dak was occasionlly used as well for the ferry - got it all to myself one day to Farnborough!

[green granite]

and they were far superior (from a passenger point of view) to the Chieftains that replaced them.

Especially when the Chieftains undercart refused to retract, which seemed to happen with amazing regularity. :O

[chevvron]

The Transport Flight pilots who flew the Devons (and later the Dakota and Navajos - we NEVER called them Chieftains) were characters in themselves although they weren't TPs.
The was 'Denny' Dennison for instance. If he was flying the morning Bedford, we expected the altitude readout on his transponder to fail about 2 miles south west of Halton, and miraculously re-appear about 2 miles north east of Halton!! Talking to an SNCO at Halton one day, he told me he'd been taxying a Jet Provost on the airfield demonstrating to apprentices how to taxy aircraft, and close to the edge of runway 02, he'd looked up to see a Devon on short final, gear and flaps down!!
One day I did the Bedford - Staverton ferry with Denny. They served Staverton for boffins to/from the radar establishment at Malvern. Midway between the two airfields, the aircraft suddenly went into an almost 90 deg bank. Avoiding action? No, I could see Gaydon directly beneath!

[John Farley]

How time flies and things change.

When I started commuting to Bedford from Farnborough on the 'Ferry' in 1954 it was a Rapide or if you were unlucky an Anson (unlucky because you could be asked to wind the gear up and down).

[chevvron]

Or if you were VERY unlucky it was the Miles Marathon in winter (no cabin heating!!)
I understand the ferry also used to drop in at Westcott too. The Flying Order Book still had details of procedures for landing at Twinwoods Farm when I first started at Farnborough.

[CharlesM07]

John, forgive my 'newness' to pprune, but do I recall that you flew the Shorts SC1 at Thurleigh as TP ( my memory raclls it as 'SC1' - but I might be a little off there. Did you TP the Harrier 'ski jump' etc..?

[chevvron]

What IS the true story of the proposed 'long' runway at Bedford? One source told me it was to be built between Thurleigh and Twinwoods Farm, hence the reason a public road south of Thurleigh had a cutting built for it (so it could go under the runway) whilst another source told me it was to be built between Thurleigh and Little Staughton to the east. Or are both stories true?

[yakker]

The original proposal was that a 5 mile long runway was to be built between Thurleigh and Little Staughton. The cutting was built as there was to be a taxi track between the airfield and the Tunnel Site, which was built along side Twinwood airfield.

[John Farley]

CharlesMO7

Yes to both queries. The SC1 64-67 time as an RAF tp on Aero Flight while the Ski-jump was 77-78 as a civilian tp for Hawkers.

JF

[BarbiesBoyfriend]

As a nipper, one lived briefly in a village called Sharnbrook. One of my very earliest aviation memories-maybe the first- is of the HP.115 flying over my house. Quite a unique shape to look up at. Another is of some helo beating up the school playground.:ooh:

Might have been 1967?

[pulse1]

Spent a happy year or so gliding there with the RAE boffins. Very relaxed and spoiled me for joining an ordinary gliding club when I moved away. Landing a Tiger on the short runway in a crosswind was fun as there was a barbed wire fence down one side.

I seem to remember some good parties there as well.

[Simtech]

My office window has a nice view of the Tunnel Site.

Happy memories of working with the Radar Research Squadron in the 1980s (I still have my personalised Squadron mug). The father of one of my colleagues was a pilot there.

Also enjoyed seeing the exotic aircraft that visited there - Concorde and the TR-1 to name but two, as well as the research fleet. I never saw a 747 there but BA DC-10s were regular visitors for crew training. Plus, of course, Cranfield Radar (of hallowed memory) operated from a console in the Thurleigh approach room.

[fastener]

I served my "time" there as a airframe/eng fitter during the early eighties. If you would have even suggested to me then that the place would close I would have not believed it. I loved working on so many different types of aircraft and gained experience there that would not be possible elsewhere. Many "characters" worked there, the crew room resembled the bar in the first Star Wars movie. Still miss it.:{

[yakker]

Talking of a 747, I remember one landing heavily and bursting a tyre, it was parked between the hangars and waited for a crew to come up and change the tyres. While it was there many of us went onboard and had a look around. Sat in the cockpit, thinking this is 'massive'. Maybe 1973 ish?

Fastener, I agree about closing, and now a carpark.:sad:

[CharlesM07]

JF- Many thanks for the reply and confirmation, I now recall the HP 115, as well. Did that model, or the SC1, survive as a museum piece? Last question.... did the Concorde sim survive at Bristol?

[BossEyed]

HP 115 and Shorts SC.1 can both be found at Yeovilton. (On second thoughts, has the SC1 moved to the Science Museum? )

[chevvron]

HP 115
Apparently it wasn't desigend with endurance in mind. If it visited Farnborough, it had to be booked for re-fuel at Benson 'just in case'.
The main gear was, I am told, Piston Provost legs. One day as it took off, one of these became partially detached. The pilot (Clive Rustin-OC Flying Farnborough when I arrived there) elected to land back again although ATC advised him the leg was wobbling about. On touchdown, the leg not surprisingly folded, and the late Johnny Mansfield, manning the runway caravan, had the dubious distinction of seeing the aircraft do a complete circle round him on the grass!

[John Farley]

Mmmmmm.

The pilot was Jack Henderson not Clive. After a roller landing Jack felt a marked jolt and it transpired the left leg had displaced 80deg left. Since part of a ground loop was clearly on the cards we were all concerned that the aircraft would roll RIGHT as it slewed LEFT and perhaps ding Jack by going inverted. After touchdown the aircraft actually turned left through about 120 deg but did not roll right.

JF

[chevvron]

Thanks John. Johnny Mansfield (died 30 years ago) told me the tale, so I obviously got the wrong pilot. Mind you, Clive always wanted to be 'first' at something, so he was first to do a 'Martin Baker' from a Jaguar when he went to Bsocombe.

[John Farley]

so he was first to do a 'Martin Baker' from a Jaguar when he went to Bsocombe.

I must ask him who was quicker on the draw from the Jag, Clive or Colin!

[chevvron]

I remember Clive saying in a TV interview that he gave the order to eject, but if command eject was selected, who knows?

[Busa1400]

I recall the Apprentice classrooms being over the far end of the air field, this would of been in 84, 85. I cannot recall the name of one of the instructors but he drove a reliant robin, and had some amazing stories. Some time later when transferred to the Number 1 hanger to continue my apprenticeship, he was described as a 'sprucer', a term i still use today

[CharlieJuliet]

Never had command eject in a Jaguar

[Loki]

Chevvron

Your description of a busy period at Bedford was lacking one vital component....
At least they weren`t firing a Phantom of the steam catapult in between all that!
Was there as a trainee ATCO in the early 70`s

Yakker

Are you sure it wasn`t Court Lines Tristar "Halcyon Days" that was parked overnight? I seem to remember that happening in 1973.

One particular event I recall was working 3 Hastings at one time in the circuit. One being delivered to the fire dump and burning off the last of its fuel, the other to collect the crew of the first, and the last being the RaE one doing things with the ILS.

With thanks to None Of The Above for pointing out this thread...he was there too.

[None of the above]

Does anyone remember the Phantom that was doing high AUW trials in 74 or 75?

It suffered a burst tyre at high speed in the take-off run and departed the runway to the north. The crew were unhurt but set up the world record for the 100yds in full flying kit.

The port undercarriage leg had collapsed and was pushed through the upper wing surface. I don't know what hidden damage there was, or whether it flew again but, to the uninitiated, it didn't appear to be beyond repair.

I can't remember if it was an RAF or RN aircraft, but I do recall that Hawker Siddeley supplied the crew. That struck me as an odd arrangement at the time, but a lot of odd things happened in R&D.:hmm:

N o t a

[Loki]

Turned up one morning in thick fog and prepared the Land Rover for a runway inspection in case BLEU wanted to do some autoland stuff. Briefed the assistant...a lovely bloke called George and set off.

As the runway was 300 ft wide this required several passes, with ones head out of the window whilst driving slowly down the runway....the better to spot any debris etc.

About halfway down the runway I heard George on the RT clear a vehicle to cross the main drag...I was deliberating whether to to remind George that I was on the runway, when said vehicle suddenly appeared seemingly 6 inches away from the nose of the Landy before being swallowed up again in the murk. When I appeared again in the tower, George looked at my ashen face and looked suitably crestfallen.

I got my own back on him the day I managed to creep up on him as he was manning the caravan and fired a bird scaring flare in his direction, it arrived just over the roof of the caravan before detonating.

I remember being nicely asked by the fire service not to have practice alarms whilst the naafi wagon was delivering the morning sticky buns to the fire station.

Nugget 93 was, while I was there, engaged mostly in driving the Sea Vixen at speed into the arrestor wire over and over again....I never did find out why. He was a Scottish guy Millar/ Miller? I can still hear his voice if I close my eyes and think for a moment....he used to sound completely knackered at the end of each serial.

[safetypee]

Loki I assure you that Nugget 93 (1976-80) was completely English (not TM), and that I thoroughly enjoyed the love-hate relationship with ‘my’ personal Sea Vixen. The aircraft was ‘given’ to me by the outgoing (and last RN base commander) because he considered that I may have had some semblance of experience in naval operations – a false assumption for a RAF pilot even with USN associations.

The arrestor wire trials were a mixture of testing the pullout characteristics of bottom wire on net barriers and developing new arresting devices, rotary hydraulic, chain, etc. The spray system (SPRAG) was one of the more interesting which produced fountains of water from many yards of pipe across the airfield, but if the pipes/holes were mis tuned, the cable would pullout asymmetrically swinging the aircraft toward the runway edge. The ‘completely knackered sound’ was probably the result of the boffins mis calculating the retarding ‘g’ – resulting in a harsh stop, even worse if the hook engaged a ‘temporary cable support’ in error – spring steel ramp bolted to the runway.

The Sea Vixen was also used to check HMS Bedford’s steam boiler every 6mths. My first launch required a ‘Naval’ briefing and attendance of a Deck Launch Officer, who turned out to be an engineer who pulled a lever when you saluted – giving you a ride of your life. The subsequent landing was complicated by the airfield being contaminated by extensive wild life which normally resided beneath the catapult structure and had made a hasty exit during the first launch! In addition, the SATCO banned tail-dragging aerodynamic braking (keeping the brakes cool) as it ruined his runway centre line lighting.

[Loki]

Ah, the Nugget 93 I refer to was a predecessor circa 1973.

When I was there the catapult was in regular use, with F4s being the most common projectile, the the Sea Vixen, visiting Buccaneer and once a Gannet all being customers.

['India-Mike]

I'm amazed that this thread has run and run. The place is obviously held in some affection. I always felt that it was a privilege to work there, and put down some deep roots in the area.

Here's one of the only two photos I have from my time there, and I now remember the photographer's name - Pete Hudson.

Vividly remember the photo being taken - late '80's and crewed by Lt H, Mr H and Dr H. Cockpit air was blue 'cos Mr Hudson was setting us up like family at a wedding. Happy days:)

View north from the pan at H3. If memory serves correctly the Bucc in the image was an S1

http://i287.photobucket.com/albums/ll121/602fan/XW241.jpg

[yakker]

Busa 1400, the instructor you refer to, would have been Keith Paull, head of the electronics school.

Loki. I'm not sure about the year, but I'm sure it was a 747.

As an apprentice in the early 70's and as the apprentice school was by the catapult, we spent many an hour watching Phantoms take to the air. The Jaguar trials were interesting, especially when the departing French painted their hire cars red, white and blue.

[None of the above]

Re the Sea Vixen conducting arrestor wire trials.

There's some footage here (http://www.seavixen.org/index.cfm?fa=contentGeneric.nqqrtkpqvvyefuol&pageId=157857) of the other end of the process.
The quality isn't exactly high definition but it might be of some interest.

N o t a

[chevvron]

Loki: no there wasn't a 'catapult' test that day, but they were firing something into the arrestor barrier on the north side using a rocket powered rig!
I'm not sure if it was that visit or an earlier one, but I remember seeing the Hunting H126 leaving on the back of a lorry crossing the 08 undershoot. I think I saw it a few years later at Topcliffe, where they also had a couple of Avro 707s and the Short SB5. I think they were all moved to Cosford when Topcliffe closed.

Edit- Memory playing up; thinking back, I went to Topcliffe in '71, long before I went to Bedford, so the '126 can't have been there! (The '707s and the SB5 definitely were though)

[Genghis the Engineer]

so he was first to do a 'Martin Baker' from a Jaguar when he went to Bsocombe.

I must ask him who was quicker on the draw from the Jag, Clive or Colin!

My understanding from several conversations with Clive on the topic of that accident is that his memory of the accident is pretty much nil between briefing and recovering (in hospital).

If memory serves however, if both pulled together, there was an inbuilt 1/3rd second time delay between the two seats to stop them leaving absolutely together. Rear seat first I *think*.

G

[Busa1400]

I seem to have had a memory failure, but I remember U2's coming in sometime when there was a cross wind where they were suppose to be landing !!

[green granite]

Bedford I believe was the diversion airfield for the U2/TRS1 aircraft from Alconbury, they used to come and do PFL's quite regularly..

Pickie of Bedford's Tonka Toy.

http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i11/orangeherald/tonka.jpg

[chevvron]

Actually Farnborough's tonka but permanently (it seemed) detached to Bedford.
Bedford was what the yanks called a 'COB' or Combined Operating Base for Alconbury, and I believe there was an almost permanent detachment of 'handlers' ie guys in a high powered car and some sets of outriggers in order to handle TR1's/U2R's.

[green granite]

Actually Farnborough's tonka

Indeed it initially flew with a 'Nugget' call sign but changed over to a 'Blackbox' one later, when, I assume it became Bedford's.

[fastener]

If I remember correctly, that Tonka never did work as advertised. I left not long after it arrived at Bedford. The Puma was a developement batch a/c and one of the first built. (s/n 006?)

[cometracer]

RAF Alconbury

[T-21]

Vulcan XA899 was used for Concorde take off work and was adorned with dayglo on the rudder and leading edges. Can anyone confirm if the undersides in the engine bay areas were white or dayglo ? The rest of the airframe was silver . Would make a nice different colour scheme for a model.

['India-Mike]

The Puma was DB08 - I'm not sure if that meant it was 'development batch no. 8' or not. Seems logical. Became rather non-standard, especially regards the blades. Remained metal to the end. Good for fitting pressure sensors and strain gauges.

241 was actually a world-class piece of kit, and as an experimental vehicle for basic research, well ahead of its time even towards the end of its working life. It had the usual range of aerodynamic and inertial sensors, plus with each blade hinge instrumented to record flap, lag and feather. Research blades measured pressure and strain. There was even an instrumented tail rotor blade.

Fabulous stuff. Never really warmed to the Lynx that replaced it (ZD559)

[dwbroughton]

As this string started with a Seaking with a radar bulb on the nose, I can give an update on what it was used for. I was a Spec Nav at Bedford 1978-81 as Nav Leader and then OC Radar Research Sqn (RRS), which had moved fm Pershore in early 78.

RRS had 15 aircrew (pilots, navs & an air eng) and over 20 ac - 10 Canberra (Mks 2, 3, 4, 6, 6-7 hybrid, 7 & 9), 2 Buccs, 1 Hunter 8, 1 Meteor 14, 1 Nimrod, 1 Varsity, 2 Viscounts, 1 Comet 4, 1 Seaking, 2 Wessex & 1 Puma. I can give ser nos and what each was used for if anyone is interested.

Seaking XV651 had the Naval Lynx 'Seaspray' radar in the nose for basic development work and mating to the 'Sea Skua' sea-skimming missile, which it guided. A Sea Skua radar head was held captive in the nose of one of our Canberras - B6 XH568. A typical sortie saw the Seaking hover over the sea just off Aberporth at 275 ft; the Canberra would fly beneath it at 50 ft, simulating having just been fired from the heli. The Canberra would follow the missile head whilst the naval target tried to decoy it.

Flying at 50 ft was interesting - the pilot did not look inside and the nav gave a continuous patter of height and speed, whilst the 3rd-seat boffin would give steering info from the missile. Each sortie started with 50 ft runs over Thurleigh runway to get the pilot/nav patter working.

'Have more info and a few pics fm Thurleigh - was certainly the best flying in my RAF time.

David B

[Kronenburg]

I grew up just down the road from RAE Thurleigh and from my very earliest days (B747 in about 76)can remember many, many types of aircraft in the overhead at low level. Many local people were employed at the airfield and tunnel site and my uncle flew as a boffin / observer on some of the test flights in the Canberra, Meteor, Javelin, Comet, etc.

It was an unbelievabley busy place and to think that there was not a single major crash incident, was quite an achievment for the standards of the day. We half expected it to happen at any moment with all the stuff whizzing about.

The tempo seemed to keep up right until the last flying days in the mid 90's when the airfield closed. I know there is no chance of reactivation, but I'm still hoping!

['India-Mike]

Interesting projects.......

When I was a vac student at Farnborough in 1979 the section I was with (Acoustics) had a project involving experimental work at Thurleigh. Long story short - microphone(s) mounted in a 6ft dia polystyrene sphere, suspended from a Wessex, under which flew a BA Tristar. I think the idea was to measure engine noise shielding afforded by the wings.

Boffins, eh?:ok:

[green granite]

It was an unbelievabley busy place and to think that there was not a single major crash incident

Apart from the Hawk in early 1982.

[Loki]

India Mike

Sounds like a continuation of the noise trials being conducted in `73/`74. Airfield was festooned with microphones while various aircraft were flown overhead in a number of configurations. I believe they were going to do something of the sort you mentioned with Court Lines providing the Tristar, but they went bust before it could be done.

[Fitter2]

Ah, the noise trials. I had great fun doing the temp/humidity ascents for atmospheric corrections in an instrumented Slingsby T61 (main role meteorological research). The best bit was returning down the approach at Vne to stay ahead of BA 747s or Concorde doing practice ILS approaches.

[chevvron]

The T61 had a climb speed of 60kt, a cruise speed of 60kt and usually flew final at 60kt so what was Vne?

[Fitter2]

As I recall (not having the POH to hand - it was over 30 years ago) at full throttle a 3 degree approach could be done at around 100kts. One then 'flared' and speed slowly bled off until arriving at the secondary runway intersection turned 30 degrees left, throttled back and touched down 2/3 of the way down to taxi in to the hangar. Seemed to cause mild amusement in the tower.

[Kronenburg]

[quote]
Apart from the Hawk in early 1982

Apologies GG - Was not aware of that incident. Info for this can be found here:

bristol britannia | 1984 | 0205 | Flight Archive (http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1984/1984%20-%200205.html)

[chevvron]

Of course there was also the earlier non-fatal accident(mid sixties?). Comet (Mk 3?) backtracking runway 27 prior to departure (no full length taxiway) and a BEA Trident doing circuits was apparently cleared to 'land over' it but didn't, taking off its fin (the Comet's that is).
I first heard about this when arriving at Halton for gliding; one of the parked Comets there was minus its fin which had been pinched to repair the one at Bedford!

[green granite]

Thought it was Bedford's VC10 and a BOAC 707 which was cleared for an overshoot not below 500' and got caught in a wind shear situation, but I could well be wrong.

[chevvron]

That could have happened as well, but it would have been late '70s or early '80s 'cos I remember the VC10 visiting Farnborough after I arrived in '74 and a few years later we were told it was grounded indefinitely with a 'broken back'(?) It was parked at Bedford for many years after that (you could see it from Santa Pod Raceway about 5 miles west) and I suppose it was broken up when the airfield was closed.

[Loki]

The Comet incident was in 1971

report is here

ASN Aircraft accident de Havilland DH-106 Comet 3B XP915 Bedford-Thurleigh Airport (http://aviation-safety.net/database/record.php?id=19710119-1)

[safetypee]

IIRC the VC 10 was grounded and prepared for sale, but with little interest as it was ‘non standard’. One viewer from ‘Africa’ seeking a source of spares commented that the aircraft was in better condition than his that were still flying!
Didn’t the Bedford’ fin end up on the test VC10 tanker after a crack was discovered?

[yakker]

Qinetiq is be closing whats left of RAE Bedford, the lease finishes at Thurliegh next March, so that is the end of that.
The good news is I have heard the old documents, photos and film is being trawled through by some ex-boffins. This may then be published including a DVD documenting the history of RAE Bedford.

[saman]

Seeing mention of the noise trials raises a question from me. I joined Hatfield in September 1973 and worked in the Instrument Lab as an introduction to the industry before moving to the Project Office in December 1973.

During that period, we took part in an excercise on airframe self noise generation that required flying an aircraft over a microphone array in a variety of configurations (u/c up and down, u/c doors open and closed and with different combinations of slat and flap position) with a minimum level of engine noise - as close to low level gliding as safety would allow. This excercise employed not only the HSA team from Hatfield but also a team from BAC at Weybridge and some folks from RAE. The ex-BUA VC10 was used during my time at the site and some of the flying was 'quite dramatic' with a low power pass over the microphones followed by a very late and noisy application of power with the runway ever so close! And boy was it cold!

Whilst we were there - Nov / Dec time in 1973 - a Hastings and a Comet - both allocated to RAE for some research works - did a photo flight with the airfield as the backdrop and a Dove/Devon as the photo aircraft. The Comet and Hastings changing position to be closer to the Devon and the airfield. We were told that both the Comet and Hastings were about to go and so the photos were taken as a momento. My very unreliable memory tells me that bo the the Comet and Hastings were in more or less standard RAF Transport Command colours rather than RAE colours - unlike the VC10 and the 1-11.

Has anyone got any of these photos? I would love a copy to remind me of some very happy days when I learned a lot.

[Earlonics]

I have photo's of the RAE fleet during 1992. What are you after I have pic's of the Seaking in fact I used to Fly a RC Helicopter with a similar setup as I attached a Camera to the front of the RC Helicopter in the same arangement.

[Loki]

saman

As far as I can remember, the Hastings was in a predominantly blue finish. I think you`re right about the Comet. We are of course talking about 35 years ago....ho hum.

I remember the VC10 noise trials, certainly looked amazing from the tower!

[saman]

Loki,

Trust me, from out on the airfield - I seem to remember we had our caravan near the VTOL pit - they were sensational! Especially when, after one particular pass, the usual noise did not come on after the usual 'x' seconds after it passed overhead - and we all rushed out the 'van to see the VC10 just climbing away from a very very very low altitude at very high alpha supported on solid black carbon and solid noise!

Saman

[Robert Woodhouse]

Back in 1966 I recollect the walking out to the main runway to greet a U2 pilot who had just landed. Years later I met him again - his name was Ed Smart and he had become the IFALPA representative on the ICAO Air Navigation Commission. Small world!

[T-21]

During April/May 1967 a WU-2A "66722" was detached to Thurleigh for a clear air turbulence research project "Hicat". it entailed flights of up to 9 hours from Scotland to Norway. The pilot was Captain Ken Mason of USAF. The U-2 is now at the Wright -Patterson Museum.

[Earlonics]

U2's would land at RAE BEdford when the cross wind at Alconbury meant they couldn't land safely, it was interesting to see a pilot exit an aircraft in a space suite.

[Earlonics]

I was also aware of a colision of a Comet and Trident touching each other whilst one was about to land while the other was waiting to take off at the end of the runway, not sure when I think in the 70's, not sure which was on approach though. I think the tail fin was damaged and if the story is true tyre marks on the roof of one of them. A ery close call.

[T-21]

A landing Trident 3 hit the top of XP915 fin and rudder whilst waiting to take off . This occurred on January 19th 1971. It was repaired and used in foam arresting trials in 1973.

[M2hover]

I've just picked up your question about "Wings Over Thurleigh". I've got the same problem - I'm reading a copy that belongs to someone else and cannot find another copy. Details: ISBN 0-9541594-0-3; published by Allison Printers, Wollaston, Northants. The only place that seems to recognise the book is Amazon but they don't have a copy. If you find a source, please let me know.:)

[John Farley]

It was printed not published by Alison Printers

Could affect a search.

[Terraplaneblues]

Seem to recall in the dim distant past, there was a cartoon of the incident somewhere on the airfield and the Trident had been renamed "Fourdent" in commemoration.:)

[A2QFI]

Not found on AbeBooks Official Site - New & Used Books, New & Used Textbooks, Rare & Out of Print Books (http://www.abebooks.com) and if they haven't got it (110 Million books on line!) it is going to being hard to find!

[Trident man]

Re Trident incident G-AWZA was the aircraft and was on autoland training detail.I know the training captain who was in command at the time as well as the chap handling as P2.

report here....
Air Accidents Investigation: 4/1972 G-AWZA and XP-915 (http://www.aaib.gov.uk/sites/aaib/publications/formal_reports/4_1972__g_awza_and_xp_915.cfm)

[T-21]

Thanks Tridentman for the Trident information, the best photography book on RAE aircraft is "Testing Colours" by Adrian Balch,Airlife 1993. It will answer the queries on the Hastings colour schemes.

[Pegpilot]

Interesting thread on Thurleigh, guys, but I'm interested to know whether my departure from Thurleigh on 14th April 2007 was the last recorded from the site ? My colleagues and I were offered a Blanik L13 glider which was quietly rotting in one of the old workshops there, and because the workshop was itself due for demolition, the glider's owner wanted rid. Because the glider's trailer floor was shot, we decided to aerotow out on the last remaining 500 metres of runway not covered with cars, vans or sheep. So 14/4/07 saw Blanik G-DCVB towed out by Wilga G-BXBZ to Lyveden in Northants. If anyone is documenting the history of the airfield, the departure was recorded on video and I'm happy to make a copy available. Any advance on 14/4/07 ?

And if T-21 is reading this, I've worked out who you are. Remember us together in a K7 at 600 feet over the A1 on a Navex to Crowland in 1998 ? It would be great to see you again.....

Cheers all

Pegpilot

[Anonflyer]

Are you Paul Earl, Avionics Apprentice Instructor from RAE during the early 90's?

I was an apprentice there with Mr. Blyth and Handscomb as my Masters when in the Apprentice Trade Training School and remember an instructor when did fly a model helicopter from RAE.

I also joined the model flying club during my last years at RAE.

I still remember those days and would love to see some photos of RAE as it was in 1992. The only Photos I have are photos of photos taken after the Open day that was held but they are terrible quality....

Thanks

[Earlonics]

Hi Yes thats me How I miss Working at RAE didn't relaise at the time but is was great to work there.
I do have a number of photos that I took during the open day and still have a video of flights out of RAE during The closure of the Airfield.

If your interested drop me a line.

Regards


Paul

[email protected]

[Earlonics]

Its been years since I heard that term for the RAE Tornado, I seem to remember a form of elitism going on when working on the Tonka Toy.

[Life of Brian]

Around 1960 whilst living in Clapham, spent many hours during our 'half day closing' at Woolworths looking through the fence......memories of :- Short S C 1.....Comet 3 ....French Etendard....Buccaneer on catapult trials......a 'non flying' Swift painted blue on static/gate display.........went over one afternoon and saw four Valiants on the ORP when they were into dispersing the V bomber fleet all over the country...........impressive

[Tim McLelland]

Some interesting stuff here - anyone going to post-up some photos of all the magnificent aircraft seen at Bedford? I'd love to see some for sure!!

[ground_star]

Not sure if this has already been mentioned, but a corner of Thurleigh is also now home to many of the uplinks for satellite TV originating from the UK.

[green granite]

There is a video called "The last days at Bedford" or similar, unfortunately my copy's seems to have gone walk-abouts. :(

[Mr Optimistic]

Eh ? Did you make that up ? Nothing heard locally for years -it was decommissioned and sold for a reason.

All the 'Not Thurleigh' signs are long gone thanks to Standsted.

On another point, the cutting build in anticipation of extending the runway/taxiway is still in evidence: there is too much concrete and drainage arrangements to make it economic to demolish it apparently. And finally, extending it to Little Staughton ? Again are you sure: Twinwoods maybe ?

[green granite]

And finally, extending it to Little Staughton ? Again are you sure: Twinwoods maybe ?

It is correct, the original requirement was for a 5 Mile long runway, but it was soon deemed unnecessary as jet engines were getting rapidly more powerful.

[John Farley]

My piloting GA friends assure me that part of the Thurleigh runway is now available for club flying.

JF

[LastMinute]

The eastern end of the airfield was licenced earlier this year as Bedford Aerodrome (http://www.bedfordaerodrome.com/) (EGBF).

There are some photos (new and old) in the gallery (http://www.bedfordaerodrome.com/gallery.aspx) on its Web site.

[Genghis the Engineer]

Also page 94 of the current Pooleys.

G

[John Farley]

Just to confirm that when I was working in the 13x9 and the spinning tunnel (RIP) in 1954 it was joining Little Staughton and Thurleigh that had been considered for a long runway.

Twinwood is south of Thurleigh so not in a suitable direction. The cutting to which you refer was connected with the ability to taxy aircraft to the tunnel site for use with a possible blower tunnel facility like the one at Boscombe.

[chevvron]

I think you'll find the newly licenced section of runway is strictly PPR for Dr. Jonathan Palmer's motor racing school. He owns a Kingair based at Dunsfold and as visitors by this means are fare - paying, the airfield has to be licenced.

[Mr Optimistic]

Thanks to all: news to me and I live one mile away. Haven't seen any GA from there, stuff seems to come from Little Staughton. The whole area is so twitchy about development with Palmer's and Yarlswood to keep us occupied, doubt that any significant change to the status has happened. Hospitality stuff for Palmer, perhaps.

5 mile runway, now that would have been something.

[chevvron]

The Kingair is not used daily - maybe max once or twice a week.
When I closed up friday midday, it was on the ground at Fairoaks where it's used by Synergy Aviation when Jonathan doesn't need it.

[green granite]

Thanks to all: news to me and I live one mile away.

Kept very quiet wasn't it? I saw nothing in either of the 2 local rags about it, nor were we sent any planning info about it, I too live about a mile from it.

There was also an ad on here for an airfield manager for them.

[chevvron]

It's all very low profile as they wouldn't want to annoy people; they don't even have an ATZ as far as I know, and strictly PPR so they have some control over what types of aircraft can use it.

[Mr Optimistic]

Can't say I would deny or get stressed about a little local flying. After all, a thundering great Hercules stormed over the house at low height this morning, filled up half the window (erm, optically). When I first moved here there was lots of traffic (aircraft and ground) so it's all much quieter now, hence no reason to get excited about small things.

PalmerSport - Your venue - Bedford Aerodrome (http://www.palmersport.com/venue-aerodrome.aspx)


Apparently the strip of land from the Wind Tunnel site to the main site, and presumably the airfield itself, is a designated 'white zone' wrt planning. This is a form of reserved status which reduces local authority control.

[cageordie]

I was there as a student in 1983 from about May to September in lab 13 in 115 building. I saw the Jaguar with part of a wing and a bit of bodywork missing, it also had around 10 feet of galvanized steel ladder attached to the damage, Pete F (don't suppose I should be using full names) was with me at the time. I flew on XX105 a couple of times, once ostensibly observing a problem with the DME and another time taking the head pilot's pal home to RAF Leuchars. I got the jump seat for the flight back. I also took the ferry, a Dove, to Farnborough one day to pick up some bits of coloured glass for Sam Kidd's PAPIs. (Sam is long dead and beyond being irritated by the Internet.)

[NutLoose]

This will sadden you all..

Report - RAE Thurleigh, Bedford - Nov 2011 - UK Urban Exploration Forums (http://www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=67155)

Report - RAF Thurleigh, Bedfordshire. Jan 2011. - UK Urban Exploration Forums (http://www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=56521)

Report - Thurleigh Airflied April 2011 (pic Heavy) - UK Urban Exploration Forums (http://www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=59863)

You will find more links at the bottom of the pages.

[malcolm380]

I remember as a young avionics design engineer with Westland Helicopters doing some study work into CRT displays for the EH101 helicopter. I and three colleagues drove from Yeovil to RAE Bedford, and then flew back to Yeovilton in a 1-11 equipped with some large Smiths Industries CRT displays. This would have been around 1981/82.

[cageordie]

So was that on XX105? Weren't they beam-penetration displays. Small by modern standards but bright and sharp compared to other things at that time. They were only fitted on the pilot side of XX105 when I was there, I think Dennis Stangroom (no idea about the spelling) was in the right seat on one of my few flights and said he preferred to use the CRTs even from the other seat.

[Padhist]

green granite
Just for interest sake.

Thurleigh
On the 5th December 1962 I carried out 4 landings in thick fog at London Airport ( see GOOGLE- Flt Lt. C. Grogan)
The following day Mr Prescott a senior BLEU Scientist telephoned me to say that he wished me to be ready to go with him to Cambridge that afternoon to do a broadcast for the BBC.
I must say I was pleased he was driving because it was quite foggy and my ground navigation was rather suspect. On route he said " I hope this is going to work out OK. I have been briefed to find this garage on Jesus Street and ask for the keys of the studio." Well I thought this is going to be more hazardous than landing in fog.
However in the event. We found the garage, and with my fingers crossed, I asked for the 'Keys to the studio'. Without batting an eye lid. I was handed a bunch of keys.and advised that if we turned the corner and parked the car we would see a GREEN door, All will be explained inside!
Beyond the door through a rather tatty corridor, was a modern office door, which we entered. Inside was a modern studio, a desk, on which was a large, old style micriphone and a telephone, also under see through plastic picture frame, was a notice which read,
If there is noise coming from the room next door...Bang on the wall...If the noise persists, ring this number.
After a while the telephone rang and Mr Prescott was advised to go over to radio broadcast. We were now both able to join in and we were told we were being taped. Remember Mr Prescott was an expert at this and I was quite green so during extensive questioning I was constantly challenged to simplify my answers for a non flying public.
OK. Ordeal over, we were now on route home. Mr Prescott said."That broadcast is going out just before the 6 O'clock news. Let's pop into this Pub and see if we can listen to it!" Inside he asked the landlord if we could. Well we were told the only radio was in their front room.They had never done this before, he would call us when the programme was on. We were duly called and looked at vey suspiciously by his wife and Mother. But when the broadcast began, it was miraculous, they recognised our voices and their eyes glowed. They were in the midst of celebreties
I was truly amazed to hear my side of the story It sounded quite professional, such was the expertise of the programmer. It certainly was not down to me. As we left, the old lady said to Mr Prescott..." Our television has stopped working! Is there anything you can do".

Having re read this I think I may have made a mistake with names..It could have been Mr Shayler. Anyway it was one of them...Sorry.Paddy

[green granite]

For those that haven't seen it here's the video of the Final Days at Bedford

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9U8h4p_8lw&list=UUpQ2EDMA9_cTArlQVI3RrFA

[darqdean]

Hi, not a pilot or even a boffin, just an ex-RAE apprentice wishing to share some unique and rare photographs and memories. I worked in Flight Systems on the flight simulators and the telemetry equipment. In a previous post someone asked for photographs of the aircraft we had at Thurleigh, I have some of the T2 Harrier (XW175 - before its garish respray) piloted (I believe) by John Bolton (sp?) and a couple of Mr John Farley (see picture below) and his non-RAE T2, all taken in Feb 1977 aboard HMS Hermes somewhere in the Moray Firth. My role in this little exercise was to man the telemetry equipment recording flight-trials information (I also built a bit of it) - all of which was housed in the little orange and white cabin to the left of the picture - which incidentally was made at Thurleigh from a section of old wind tunnel.

http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa289/darqdean/Harrier%20T2/H-T2-11_zps6614caea.jpg (http://s198.photobucket.com/user/darqdean/media/Harrier%20T2/H-T2-11_zps6614caea.jpg.html)

I have 14 more pictures like this if anyone is interested in seeing them.


erm... some memories - The head of Electronics School was indeed Keith Paull, and he drove a Reliant Regal, not a Robin. His expertise was in thermionic valves so solid state electronics was an alien tech for him ... but he did fill our days with a lot of esoteric stuff like his memoirs as a dispatch rider, the Scouts, his thoughts on paranormal stuff and research into flying fortresses based at Twinwoods. As someone said, a lot of "characters" worked at the RAE in those days...

During my time there I worked on the telemetry equipment of the Flight System's T2 Harrier and the Gnat (Tonka toy... that's a new one on me) and as a radio tech the Sea Vixen, Lightning, HS125, Hunter, Sea King, Puma and Wasp. Being based in the Electronics School for two years, I also watched many launches from the steam catapult, including the Fairey Gannet, which would drop off the end of the deck and run along the grass for several yards before finally getting airborne.

[jpbwarwick]

Does anyone who worked at RAE Thurleigh remember the Fairey Ultra-Light helicopter G-APJJ being mounted on top of a bus for rotor performance trials of some description? I should be grateful for any information at all, including dates and personal comments, but especially any images of this setup for a history of the Midland Aircraft Preservation Society which acquired 'PJJ on loan from the then College of Aeronautics at Cranfield in the mid-1970s.

[XR914]

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but I'm doing some research into Thurleigh, fascinating place. For those of you that haven't found it "Wings Over Thurleigh" can be bough from BAHG for £15 + p&p (£6.00 I think) and its a great read.


I was wondering if any of you chaps have photos of the NAD areas pre the closedown. I'm particularly interested in the cats, the flush one, the steel deck one and the cordite one, the Oscillating Platform and "HMS Kid"


I've managed to get some information that shows the remains of the oscillating platform on the southern end of the "cordite cat" but not sure if this is where it always "lived". I had read mention that the tracks that it was mounted on went back into a Hanger at one point, but I can't see where this could have been.


I've no idea where "HMS Kidd" was on the site, so any information would be really useful, as would any images showing the other two cats or the arrestor gear.


All the best,


Ben

[fantom]

Can't help you Ben on the pictures but my son carries on the tradition there.

He's a design engineer and has exclusive use of a 3-d printer...

Thurleigh lives on.

[safetypee]

I don’t think that I can better any of the published photos. My time with RAE was post NAD, but I did manage to exercise the raised catapult on several occasions.
Sam Kidd was associated with building many things, but I suspect that due to the complexity of the rolling platform it was contracted out – as was the ski jump.
HMS Kidd might be what I knew as HMS Bedford which was constructed in Sam Kidd tradition to replicate a carrier deck and conning tower with full night lighting for Harrier trials. It was impressively real when all of the other airfield lights were off. IIRC this was aligned with the arrestor runway on the N side.

[Ian Britton]

I used to work at RAE Thurleigh about 20 years ago. At the time they had a BAE111, amongst others. I seem to remember a Seaking with a radar bulb built on the nose. I know it is a long shot, but anyone got any photos of the Thurleigh fleet ? Check out on facebook "military bedfordshire" he has an album of old phots from RAE Bedford on there :-)

[jpbwarwick]

Following the 50th anniversary of what was initially the Midland Aircraft Preservation Society (now Midland Air Museum), the founding members are compiling a detailed history, covering its origins and development up to the early-90s. Several of the aeroplanes secured during that period have links with RAE Bedford, notably the Boulton Paul P111a VT935, the Fairey Ultralight Helicopter G-APJJ and Meteor NF.14 WS838. Consequently, although we do have some images of all three at Thurleigh, it would be very helpful to obtain any further information regarding their use and testing there, together with personal recollections of particular incidents.

[chevvron]

So was that on XX105? Weren't they beam-penetration displays. Small by modern standards but bright and sharp compared to other things at that time. They were only fitted on the pilot side of XX105 when I was there, I think Dennis Stangroom (no idea about the spelling) was in the right seat on one of my few flights and said he preferred to use the CRTs even from the other seat.
Bedford had more than one BAC 1-11.
In the early '90s, not long before research flying moved to Boscombe, their latest one, a -500 arrived at Farnborough flown by OC Flying Bedford (I do remember his name but it wasn't Dennis Stangroom - correct spelling) .
For some reason, COEF objected to this and having told us (ATC) off for accepting it, instructed the crew not to disembark and to return to Bedford immediately.
I have no idea what the problem was; this particular COEF was one of the more easy going ones to hold the post, in fact he was the last because a short time afterwards Experimental Flying Wing was formed with a Wg Cdr in charge (COEF was a Gpt Capt post and oversaw Farnborough, Bedford and the other RAE sorry DRA airfields) prior to their move to Boscombe Down

[chevvron]

There was mention of Clive Rustin earlier at #46.
Clive was Wg Cdr OC Flying at Farnborough when I arrived there (as a civilian ATCO) in 1974. I met him again at RAF Bruggen in 1986 when I was visiting in my capacity of Flt Lt RAFVRT(T); surprisingly Clive was still a Wg Cdr whereas you would have expected him to be somewhat higher in the ranks. There were rumours about this being because of the Jaguar incident but I was told by a subsequent OC Flying that he had put up another 'black' in addtion to the Jaguar occurence; I think I know what this was but as I'm not sure I won't quote it here.