Happy at Emirates?

[skysod]

You guys on here are starting to frighten me!

I have an interview next month but I'm begining to wonder if I'm wasting my/their time.

Every time I look on here there's someone complaining about the rosters/routes/accommodation/pay...........etc. etc.

So I'd just like to hear from anyone who's happy at EK please....there must be somebody surely!:confused:

Thank you,

skysod.

[dubble_dubble]

(this should b interesting):)

[scaglietti]

Now why would you think that there are any "happy" pilots out of the 2000 that are here?:)

I'm not unhappy here and as I have said before the correspondents on prune are not necessarily a scientific sampling but most of them do have real concerns.

The positives as I see them (in no specific order & not an exhaustive list) are as follows:
Job security, upgrade possibilities, medical coverage, good equipment, chauffeur driven to and from work, the housing, schooling, the awesome view while crossing the Himalayas, and the money is ok (unless you have Euro expenses) but maybe not reflective of the market.

The negatives are well known to anyone who reads prune regularly. The biggest problem is also the biggest advantage. Growth and the management thereof. Due to the exponential growth the company has a policy of doing more with less because they can't hire people quickly enough. In my opinion a short/medium/long/ultra-long haul carrier has no business trying to get it's crews (cockpit & cabin) to fly to/and beyond the legal limit (and actively trying to increase that limit) and this is why a job that used to be a 10 or 15 year commitment might only be a 5 or 10 year commitment now.

IMHO

Scaglietti

[Craic Ore]

You're going to hear lots of opinions, as have been stated many times on this site. I'd say way over 50% of the guys here are quite unhappy as "the package" keeps deteriorating. A lot of it depends on where you come from too. If you have a command in the near future and you like your home country, you'd be a fool to come here in my opinion. But for some, this place is a huge step ahead.

I think it comes down to money and conditions and neither are on the up and up. To be paid less today as a captain than being an FO 5 years ago is a farce. That is in most currencies outside the Dirham of course. Plus, no one is holding out much hope for any big improvement with the upcoming pay review.

I guess to put it fairly, it's not all bad but I'd say at least 75% are counting the days to get outta here, myself being one of them. If you think you're coming for a 15+ year career, to be honest, you'll be kidding yourself.

Good luck with your choice.

CO

[410]

skysod, I've enjoyed my time with EK, but I'm afraid I'm very much on the countdown. A new joiner asked me a month or two ago what I did on my days off and I surprised myself with my answer. Whereas a few years ago, I could have rattled off any number of things I did with my family, after pausing and considering what I now do on my days off, I replied "I sleep."

The company has grown hugely in the last few years, to the point where you can go for some time without crossing paths with another pilot you know. However, when you do, for me at least, it's usually a surprise to find how old and haggard everyone is looking. People 10 years younger than I am have grey hair and look exhausted.

I don't know how anyone in his early 40s could even fleetingly think he could maintain the current level of work we do for another 20 years and maintain is health.

[onglide]

:)
Good:
new aircrafts
great network
good career prospects
free pick up and drop off from work
medical coverage (free for you, small charge for family)
poor pension/provident fund
school partially paid (max 3 childs and up to 80ish%)

:\
Bad:
package gets lower and lower by 2digit's inflation in Dubai
if you need to send money home (mortgage, etc.) (pay is pegged to us dollar)
very hot 4 months out of the year
you need to plan to put money aside for your pension (personally 5% salary)
bonus average 4-5 weeks pay

It is always good to see it for yourself.
Good luck for the interview.

:ok:

[fatbus]

I heard someone the other day use the term, Most Captains are 'planning thier exit strategy'. Think that about sums it up.Its a job not a career.The bucket plan seems to be most guys plan and the non money one is filling fast, dont think the money bucket is going to change much come mid Apr ( bonus? pay raise? ). It has been good up to now for me, but living in DXB has become hard. As a pilot all you are is a skilled labourer and as such treated so. We use to be treated a bit better. Dont leave a good job to come or you will regret it, if you need a job than consider it.

[Jet II]

Bear in mind that the type of person who is going to spend time on an internet forum commenting on their T&C's are more than likely those who are unhappy with the job.

[5star]

Don't forget to involve your family, if you have one. For many wives it's a big challenge to adapt to the insane Dubai day-to-day living. Some wives never like it and leave after a while. No doubt everyone is putting his health at risk with all the dust and toxic fumes around here...
To be honest living here is the hardest part of the job for me and my family.

If you're single and you like partying: different story...

As to EK :
More than half of your check-ins will be around 1am. It messes up your body clock. I'm struggling more than in my previous airliner to stay fit. If you like hand flying don't even think of coming here. I miss that aspect of flying a lot though they restricted this some time ago with a good reason: most of us are sleeping dummies on arrival.....
And money wise... With the current dollar woes this must now be one of the worst paid heavy jobs in the industry. Might be temporary....donno.
3yrs to 4yrs to Command depending on the fleet. You'll need the captains pay to save some money....

[Gillegan]

Don't confine yourself to just the "happy chappies" but when you do listen to those more negative, get past the emotions and look closely at why. Some are happy because:

The job is better than what they came from.
The equipment is big and new.
The flying is interesting - you will see more of the world than at most other jobs.
Company provided accommodation.

Some reasons why others aren't happy:

The high rate of inflation vs. the declining value of the dirham/dollar.
Poor consultation by our management in taking decisions that directly affect our quality of life and working conditions.
Complete disregard by our management of serious fatigue issues. This includes poor rest facilities on the aircraft and trip schedules and layovers that violate some of the most basic tenets of fatigue management and safety.
To expand on the previous point - 24 hour layovers after flights exceeding 17 hours in length. Most appalling about this is that their own "approved" ULR FTL document prohibits this, yet they do it anyway. It says a lot about the quality of regulation here.
Flight Time Factoring. Again, a roster and fatigue issue whereby, your time spent in the bunk on a long haul flight does not count towards Flight Time Limitations. The result being that you could be rostered well in excess of 120 hours per month. My understanding is that it is not being used in a big way right now but expect it to be employed more and more in the coming months as the company reduces its recruitment targets for budgetary reasons.

I'm sure other can add a lot to either list. The point is that you need to do your homework on the specific issues and decide if it makes sense. I've flown with quite a few new FO's coming from smaller (RJ's) equipment who looked across the table at me with their jaws agape as I recounted specific rostering practices. They too only wanted to talk to the "happy pilots" before coming here. Come out for your interview, get as much information as you can and compare it with your current situation. If you make an informed decision to come, you will most likely count yourself among the happy. If you allow yourself to only consider the positives, you will find the negative issues looming larger in your psyche once you have been here a while.

[Iver]

Two questions for EK pilots please:

1. If you go to EK and get 777 type and flight time and then want to leave, where do you go then with that great type and flight experience? Direct entry at another ME 777 operator or maybe Singapore? Isn't it same type of flying but now you are junior? Would you go back to Europe on Easyjet or Ryanair after flying 777?

2. Will EK get new cargo 747-800s and will EK or Atlas pilots fly them?

Thank you for responses.

[Saltaire]

I'm happy but my bbq runs every night and I always have a rum and coke nearby. :ok:

[Wings Of Fury]

Iver:
sorry not an EK pilot but depending on your life style, with B777 time you could try PARC and Vietnam Airlines (6 weeks on 2 weeks off), not sure now but used to be good some years ago? That's some pretty long term planning maybe I should try it some day!!! :ugh:

Question to EK First officers:

I am thinking about joining EK soon as the company I fly for do not upgrade expat F/Os and I want to fly new equipment, averaging 10.5USD (Wide body med Haul) no tax. I am happy with my life now (except life long f/o)
So i am thinking not to join EK now because their money not good and work to hard? I might wait a little longer? maybe conditions improve no?

[jumbo1]

NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Iver]

Will EK get 747-800s and will EK pilots fly them or will Atlas fly aircraft? When will arrive?

[Wiley]

When I saw this thread, I thought I'd add some witty, oh so clever remark to the debate.

... but I'm just too tired (constanty, truth be told, over the last year or so) to come up with one.

[onglide]

most probably, Atlas pilot will fly the 747-800.
But you never know in Ek ... things changes by the minute ... see LCC and use of the mobile phone in flights ...

[skysod]

Thanks to all of you who have taken the time and trouble to reply.

Regards,

skysod.

[Easy Ryder]

I was at the EK roadshow at LGW, and i think they mentioned.... but not 100% sure, that the 747-8F will be crewed by EK drivers.

[my salami]

The 747/8 will be crewed by EK drivers.
Still deciding if CCQ's from the 777.

[bobsback]

I am happy here because of several reasons; the aircraft are new(ish), the routes are varied (as in I get to go to lots of interseting places), I am in the left seat (so can afford to live but struggled as an F/O), and mist importantly my wife is happy here:)

However accomodation dept is a mess & most dealings with it are futile:ugh: Construction is everywhere and drives you crazy whenever you want to sleep for a flight.

Depending where you come from & what you are hoping for I would recommend it here.

[ShockWave]

IVER..
After you have your wide body type stamped on your license and your command hours there is not much here to make you stick around if you come from a safe place to live. After you gain the above the money is simply not enough. The seniority has only a tiny impact. EK has a rotating seniority system and they now have restrictions on how many days off in a row you can bid for when in the top bid groups and manually insert trips on your roster to maximize the work you will do, so commuting is not an option. You will earn slightly more more money with seniority but you will eventually view this as not enough. Time will tell.

[fatbus]

777 ccq to 748 but not mff, crewing in the hands of skycargo if you can believe that

[Murrenfan]

Sorry fatbus, can you make it more clear? thanks
Mfan

[Roster Change]

B777 pilots will also be qualified to operate HS 748 twin turboprop "budgies"

When you come here to work......

Remember where you are, who you work for, then go with the flow !

[Gillegan]

I don't believe ccq or mff applies to B777 and B74-8. It will be a short course to convert but I have it on good authority that Boeing chose not to make the two fleets compatible because most of their potential buyers would be B747-400 operators and would prefer the ability to cross qualify crews between the two types.

It is also my understanding that a final decision on who will fly the freighters has not been made yet. They are probably waiting for a decision on the B74-8 pax version.

[haveago]

Ive been here here for 18 months. On the whole I think it is pretty good. Kids love it. My Wife is still getting use to it but definitely as time goes by she is beginning to enjoy it too.
You have to get involved here and keep yourself busy, and as far as I am concerned there is is plenty to do. I am from the UK and was flying widebody before I joined for a UK carrier. This is better! 3 years to command is not a bad incentive...
You do have a lot of late checkins but doing long haul in most places that is the case. People are very quick to knock EK but ask yourself the question "where is it better?" The pay might be declining against the week dollar, but factor in free house, schooling, good medical care, getting picked up from your house everytime you go go to work and the overall package is hard to beat!
Don't listen to all the negative nonsence you read on here. In by view most of the negative aspects could be applied to any airline in some way or another.
If your thinking of applying, give it a go and you might be pleasantly surprised!

[piloton]

Very well said.....:ok:

[Marooned]

If your thinking of applying, give it a go and you might be pleasantly surprised!

If not you'll have left any seniority, lifestyle, home and friends back at home and be stuck here for several years.

A great deal of the 'negative nonsense' is posted from bitter experience.

Come here with your eyes wide open :eek: and and see it for what it really is and not the spin that a great deal of money has been put in to create.

There is nothing given here for free:


The house? Where else are you going to stay?

Schooling? When there is space it may not be at the school of your choosing and the 'allowance does NOT cover the costs 100%.

Medical care? You and your family will need it.

The transport to and from work? You will be in no fit state to drive yourself after you get back from a trip.


As for the 74-8... the 787 delays will have an impact on delivery.

[Sheikh Your Bootie]

Haveago, habibi. At the moment you are in the honeymoon phase, your two buckets are fairly shiny, the happiness one is stiil pretty full.
The smelly one with the flies, is rather empty, but trust me the flies will increase as time goes on, as will the contents :( You are a newbie, promotion still to come, reality awaits inshallah!

SyB :zzz:

[Jet II]

A great deal of the 'negative nonsense' is posted from bitter experience.

At the moment you are in the honeymoon phase


If people are so unhappy here why not leave?:confused:

its not as though there ain't plenty of jobs available in other parts of the world.

Mind you I heard all the same complaints when working in London ;)

[Marooned]

If people are so unhappy here why not leave?

They have left and others are trying to.

The point is that it takes a great deal of time, effort and expense to come here in the first place and it is not that easy to just leave once you have gone through it... in fact is very hard and expensive. This is not another job just down the road where if you don't like it you just move on. It is far more complex than that and Emirates know it and manipulate it to their advantage.

BE WARNED.

[tbaylx]

Like anything in life some people like things that others hate. There are certainly worse jobs in aviation, and there are better as well. Dubai is what it is, you either learn to live with it or become a bitter unhappy expat.

No one can tell you wether you are going to be one of the ones that like it here or one of the ones that don't. Like any expat job you really won't know until you come here and live it for a few years. There are guys that have been here 6 months and hate it, there are guys that have been here 10+ years and still like it. All depends on you and your family really. EK can change the situation for the worse by messing with rosters and pay etc, but you just have to move on once you have reached your limit. That is a different point for everyone. It ain't all roses, but it sure isn't as bad as some would have you believe either.

If your family is on the adventurous side and you don't like where you work now, then its worth the try and see what you think IMHO.

[Sander]

PLUS

Company accommodation - provided it is given where you are happy - the lottery and you cannot easily buy another ticket.
(Move out and buy your own place some have- and then sell- a nice return on your investment but it will be eroded away as the company accommodation is 50% of actual cost and you will be paying at least $2000USD per month to make up the difference on a modest compromise)
Schooling
Good Equipment
Great crew to fly with
Nice Lifestyle

MINUS
If you want to include your pension plan as part of lifestyle - long-term- then lifestyle is a big minus for EK pilots

Pension- Due to a neat trick with flight pay the pension is being eroded as quickly as the USD is falling. Years ago the UAE Nationals saw that the pension plan in EK offered no long term security so they sensibly withdrew.

To make yourself happy in EK never strike a conversation with your friends in Cathay or Dragon Air about how they use the company accommodation allowance to pay off substantial real estate they have purchased.

After 15 years in Emirates your total pension is with $350K USD Including your own 1/3 contribution to that.

Traffic

Management with no real attempted dialogue with pilots- no meetings in three years.

[fatbus]

A CCQ ( cross cockpit quailification ) is a short cousre but varies between the types, MFF mixed fleet flying allows you to fly more than one type ( that are simlar)

The 777 to 748 are not simlar for MFF

Sky Cargo is tasked to determine the cheapist way to operate the 748, thatwill determine how flys them

[White Knight]

Sorry S-Y-B, but I've done over five years myself and still enjoy the job! Yes, I was accused of the old 'honeymoon phase' and the 'rose tinted specs' when I first came too..

What makes the job for me is the guys I fly with. 99.99% are top guys and - dare I say it - generally good operators too. I like the variety, I get to fly three different types of aeroplane, interesting network (short haul around Europe got a little tedious!) and I don't mind checking in for a flight at 00:15 - guess I'm one of the lucky few that can sleep six hours in an evening..

Sure, there are things that need to change - noticeably the salary! Long term the Greenback will rise once the Yanks have sorted out their trade defecit. In the meantime at least 30% is needed to combat inflation - glad I've got no foreign mortgage too, that would be interesting. I can see why some guys can't stand it here, and full marks to those that put their money where their mouths are and find a good job elsewhere - best of luck to them!

There's still a lot to see and do here (not always costing a lot either) if you can bother to get off your fat ar*e and do it.. I'm here for quite a while yet...

[FL XXX]

OK GUYS! After having read all this, explain to me since I have an EK interview coming up shortly how I would need to approach this opportunity. I try to be open 'positively' minded it seems that there's more negative than positive as far as I have read. I currently work for a famous low-cost European carrier as an F/O (not FR). Need some advice!! The money would be a important factor. MANY THANKS!!

[Wings Of Fury]

Boeing chose not to make the two fleets compatible (B777 and B74-8) because most of their potential buyers would be B747-400 operators and would prefer the ability to cross qualify crews between the two types.

And end up like the B737NG?, they still haven't learnt yet, but will the B787 be the same flight deck as B747-800? Now there is a smart idea.

[Sheikh Your Bootie]

White Knight Habib. I am also enjoying my time here, but the smelly bucket is filling up faster than the happiness one.
When i say this think

ULR flights with min rest and poor rest facilities
Poor or no villas for new joiners
No consultation with management. Except their mates on the golf course, who seemingly complain about minimal days off on bottom bid
Reduction in max days off for those on top bid groups, because AAR can't stand the thought that we might be happy with the system. Commuters will leave in droves post bonus payout


Of course if you happy with that and more, bravo for you!! :ugh:

SyB :zzz:

[scaglietti]

Just seen my Apr roster. High bid group, bid the same way I have for years. The new result "in the interest of safety" no more than 2 days off in a row, and a lot of turnaround flights that I have never received in my top bid months.

I'm not the sort to react out-of-hand but ooh that bucket seems to be getting heavier. I may have to take the advice of some of the other correspondents and just press 2.

Scaglietti:uhoh::confused:

[White Knight]

S-Y-B, seems to be bad luck that you're in the 777 side of the airline habib.. When you mention the poor crew rest facilities you're right, it's shockingly bad on your fleet. By comparison the 345 CRC is 'fairly' good, and as for the ULR slingshots to IAH, GRU - well, have to wait 'til the 380's sent there I guess!!
Never had more than 14 days XX in a month, don't commute so aren't affected by the 'roster changes'. And you know what - I couldn't care less, and I hear some of you clamouring 'thanks for the support WK', but remember that in such a diverse selection of flight crew that we all want different things, so generally there is no 'united we stand, divided....'

Obviously there is very little consultation with management, welcome to the sand-pit:E

[Cyberbird]

Sorry to say, but NO - anymore is the harsh truth!

as others have stated already:
"I've enjoyed my time with EK, but I'm afraid I'm very much on the countdown - i'm actively planning my exit strategy now" like so many others - for all the reasons stated as well:

too low payment, way to high accomodation costs , high costs, DXB become a crappy construction site whereever You go, company travel policy dreadful -
and now, they start messin' around with your rosters/ OFF-days - even when in top bid groups - enough is enough !!!

ten - nine -eight ....:}

[777Contrail]

I haven't been here long, but I can see what's beyond the honeymoon........

Get the training bond down, get the hours on type, GET OUT!

[PositiveRate876]

Some of you need to get out and enjoy the nice weather instead of wasting your time on pPrune. Summer's around the corner.

[fatbus]

Just had a chat with a EK 777 Capt going back to UK charter 75/76, everyone has there own reason for coming ,staying or leaving. best thing anyone can do is lots of good homework. Gulf news = goodnews, and for the most part PPrune= bad news. Dubai is fast becoming a zoo and not a good place for kids or should I say not kid freindly.yes there are lots of things for kids but at a cost in $ and risk to life and limb on the roads. If you are like me I worry every time my family is out on the roads and not just the highways. Kids on school buses going down SZR no f..king way would I ever subject my kids to the idiots who drive those buses, if you do give your head a shake. Also just heard from a freind that outside some of the school locals claiming to be CID to lure kids into their cars, great , whats next.

[Guns-A-GoGo]

What portion of the year do you have to be employeed to receive the bonus? My date to arrive in Dubai is looking like 1 July. Will I qualify for all or just a portion of next years bonus?

Thanks,

Guns

[MrMachfivepointfive]

Yes you will be elegible for the 8/12 of the pot. Cutoff date for 0/0 is end of September. If you have a wicked sense of humour and your friends call you cynical, Dubai is the place for you. It is for me.

[Guns-A-GoGo]

I'm in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

As a kid I was part of one of those "double blind" tests. They put me in a room with a big pile of sh1t. I turned to the administrator and asked for a shovel.

"Why would you want a shovel?" the Dr. says to me.

"YOUR the Dr, lady.........you can't see it! With all that sh1t, there has got to be a pony in there somewhere!

Yea, a glutton for pain, and the ultimate optomist!

Guns

[kingpost]

Just a quick reality check. If you join now you're expected to stay in temporary accommodation, some one bedroom apartment in a undesirable part of town for up to 6 months. The excuse is that there is no accommodation, crap, there is they just don't want to pay for it.

How does one join this company with a family, Ek have asked the new joiners not to bring their families across for the 6 month period, what a great start.... how the #%*# does one get the kids in a school.

[BIKKERDENNAH]

AHHHH kingpost!

No one really gives a F^&K here. That is an issue you and your families will have to sort out when you get here. Not EKs problem!!:mad: Sign the dotted line and be happy!

[GMDS]

Sarcasm on:
If after serious consideration of ALL the factors you still decide to join the sandpit (as of today, with today's T&Cs), you must be pretty desperate. To the point of scaring us stuck in there as to your ability of judgement, not to say your ability stand alone .....
This was sarcasm! (Not intended to insult any one of you, as myself I have once joined.):}

[scaglietti]

Can anyone confirm that the villas being built in Mirdiff (v.short final RWY30L) are for EK? If that is the case good luck resting at any time of the day as there is no downtime in DXB anymore. I would judge that you pass overhead at about 1,000ft, fully configured with approach thrust set.
Also what happens when you have one of those Russian freighters take off from 12R and then fly level for 5 miles?

Scaglietti:confused:

[7x7]

Ek have asked the new joiners not to bring their families across for the 6 month periodI'm surprised to find how many very senior EK pilots are in the same situation. Every second pilot I've spoken to over the last week or two (ok, a slight exaggeration:O) seems to be living alone in his villa with the family gone home. In my compound, the bachelors outnumber the families.

[Cyberbird]

Well 7x7 - i'm sorry to admit, but it's me too - as my wife left me with kids behind and was headin' back to scandinavia after 3 years down here at the sandy &crappy place - well, luckily not totally, but she prefers livin´at a civilized place w/o outreageous racism & reckless drivers - fearin' for the worst!
:ok:
naf furthermore - "Can anyone confirm that the villas being built in Mirdiff (v.short final RWY30L) are for EK?"

yes - unfortuneately i can confirm this - EK is going down the cheap road - cheap - cheaper - Emirates - which stands for:
English Management Indian Run - and the Employees Suffer - how true !:ugh:

[millerscourt]

White Knight is still happy at EK after 5 years, or so he says despite saying he needs a 30% pay rise so why can you not all be like him??

[410]

Ten EK pilots in my compound. Three, soon to be two of the ten have their wives with them. The rest are either divorced or the wives and kids live back home and the husbands (attempt to) commute.

[chofuan]

People forget where they come from.

[MrMachfivepointfive]

8 years in EK and still happy. Okay - some things that were great 8 years ago are just acceptable now.
But a couple of days reality check at my origins (about 50N 10E +/- 5 degrees) make me feel homesick for DXB.
Sheikh Mo & Co are trying to write a book down here that nobody else has ever tried writing. I ll be damned to bug out before I see the end of the story - whichever way it goes. My grandchildren will appreciate grandpa's war stories one day.

[Marooned]

If you live long enough that is...

You'll have a war story either way.

[kingoftheslipstream]

Things 'roun here 'er at an all time low. Never seen it worse. :cool:

[boeingoriaintgoing]

If Atlas ends up crewing B747-8s they are going to be required to go through Emirates "Advanced Intelligence Required" training program as the aircraft are going to have UAE registry thus requiring UAE licensing. Don't think there too many Atlas pilots that are going to put with the "teach yourself" training program at Emirates.

[YYZguy]

Yup, good and bad points about living here. I won't repeat what most have already listed but as a Canadian who's been here for 4+ years now, I sure wish I had a decent option to go home to. Job is not too bad (no flying job is perfect right?) but Dubai sucks the life out of you. I have nothing good to say about this city except for the fact that there's no snow here.
I find it odd that people are still leaving stable jobs in Europe to come here. Flying shiny new widebodies around the world ain't all it's cracked up to be. I promise you, if I could go back to Canada to a decent paying and STABLE job, I would be out of here like greased lightning. Due to the pathetic state of affairs in Canadian aviation I doubt that's going to happen in my lifetime.
Bottom line is: if you are living at home and already have a decent paying, stable job, stay put. The grass is NOT greener on the other side. You will regret leaving home eventually, I promise you.
'Nuff said.

[nolimitholdem]

Best job I ever had.
People forget where they come from.

Come on. If you come from a country where drugs, K&R are the major industries, then of course EK will seem like a good job. Hardly the gold standard though, is it?

Is this what we're reduced to? "As shi$$y as it is, it could always be worse?!"

The new recruiting motto! :ok:

[menard]

I used to....things have changed....I mean deteriorated....

Everybody will leave this place one day, some sooner, some later.

I find happiness with my family, friends...Not in the job or the city...

EK/Dubai, for most people I talk to, becomes the negative of your life....Give it time.

Sooner or later...

[Coldwing]

Well 7x7 - i'm sorry to admit, but it's me too - as my wife left me with kids behind and was headin' back to scandinavia after 3 years down here at the sandy &crappy place - well, luckily not totally, but she prefers livin´at a civilized place w/o outreageous racism & reckless drivers - fearin' for the worst!Cyberbird, there's racism against foreigns in UAE?

Moreover, pilots don't like the country, the company, or.... both???

[sioux115]

We were told at the interview that 747-800 freighters were going to be crewed by Emirates pilots. And also that the 777 freighters maybe combined into to the 777 pax rosters.

[mensaboy]

I had a chat with an acquaintance today who has been here for 12 years. I was commenting that I was thinking about leaving sometime in the future and he summed up things in one sentence. He said he would leave in a heartbeat except he did not want to go through the whole process and BS of joining a new company.

I thought about that for some time and came to the conclusion that in spite of my enjoyment of SOME of the attributes of Dubai and my annoyment with MOST of the attributes of Dubai......... and foremost being the continual decline of our T&C's , I too have that same obstacle deterring me from leaving. I just don't want to go through another change in my life.

This is dissapointing for me especially considering I have been a big supporter of EK in the past. If the company treated us well as professional pilots, I truly believe we could all overlook some of the huge negatives about Dubai. But in the past 3-5 years, it has been a two-pronged approach against us.

>>>>>>>>>>The city is clearly less desirable in which to live and the company is clearly less desirable for which to work>>>>>>>>

I am leaning towards a job with less money, hopefully better schedules but definitely in a better location. Avoiding the BS of Dubai by kite-surfing, golfing, scuba diving, dining out or whatever....... works for a while, but this place is sucking the life out of me.

I have no pride in my company. I only have pride in how well I can do my job. I save as much money as I can for this greedy company, I rarely call in sick, I do my best in other words ! And now I am questioning why.

Man, I hate feeling this way. There must be something better out there. Perhaps not, but if that is the case, then obviously this profession is a mess.

Ooops, time for the local brainwashing rant. Time to get off line and blast some AC/DC ! Glad my speakers are more powerful and my neighbours get a chuckle when they hear my music instead of the local rants.

[furbpilot]

yeah... the others just complain in the cokpit....

[28 deg South]

Absolutely spot on mensa boy....best and most accurate post i've read

[disconnected]

"Dubai sucks the life out of you"

How many times I've heard this. And so true. I've seen once cheerful people reduced to physical violence by the environment. Relationships flounder, kids go astray, values are lost, financial objectives crumble in this dog eat dog environment.

The financial benefits are highly debateable but the emotional degradation is guaranteed!

[Alchemy]

As a current an RJ captain in the states making about 70,000 USD per year, do you gentlemen think I would be misguided to consider employment at Emirates? I am generally happy with my job here (based in my hometown) but am gravely concerned about the future.

I am nervous because my regional airline is being threatened by its mainline partner with being "phased out" in favor of cheaper operators. Mergers and buyouts are on the horizon, and the economic of RJ's are looking less and less appealing with the current cost of fuel. My company has already put out a bid for voluntary leaves of abscences, no aircraft orders on horizon, and things are generally looking very bleak.

There are very few job opportunites for pilots in the states right now, and if my airline does close its doors, I will likely be hard pressed to find work. I have about 3700 total flight hours and 950 jet command time. Would EK even consider me with such little experience? I have filled out the online application and am on the verge of hitting 'submit'.

I am 25, single, and even if it turns out after 5 years or so that EK is not for me at the least the widebody experience will look good on the resume. The compensation as an EK FO would be about the same as my RJ Captain pay in the states maybe a slight increase when you consider the lack of taxes in dubai. Thoughts?

[Taylor01]

As mentioned before in many post, this is where the whinners go. If they aren't happy here they probably want be happy anywhere. Instead of coming on here and complaining, go work on your CV and leave, it would make everyone else here happy. There are alot of happy people here, so the best advice I have is to come see for yourself. Good luck on the interview.:ok:

[nolimitholdem]

What a load of dog's balls to say that here is where the "whinners" (whiners? whingers? winners?) post. Believe it or not, most people would just like those considering joining to have access to something they did not when they joined....the truth.

"A lot of happy people" in Dubai and Emirates? In my experience, totally untrue. There are many, many people who have accepted their lot for the short-term - the shortest they can manage - but that's hardly "happiness". What you call happy is usually people rationalizing their decision to themselves and those around them. We all do what we have to survive, and telling ourselves and those around us that things are great, the emperor really has clothes, Dubai is actually a real city, and on and on...it may help with coping, but it doesn't make it true.

But then what about Dubai and Emirates bears any resemblance to the truth? It's like a movie set, a cardboard cutout false-front name-brand paradise. Glitzy PR machine, no substance.

Two colleagues of mine are leaving soon. One of them, I always took to be quite happy here, always positive on the surface and cheerful. But he confided in me privately that in truth, he has hated being here for quite some time and desperate to leave. Being a normally positive person and for the sake of his family, he suppressed his true opinions. Thankfully for him, he made a plan for his exit strategy and executed it. Makes me wonder how many others are in a similar state, that "quiet desperation"? Perhaps sometimes we don't even know how much our current situation is affecting us until leaving is a real plan, not just an abstract concept.

Interesting times!

[BigJetDog]

I love it here!!! Emirates and Dubai

It all depends on what you are used to. It is getting very expensive here, but we can still do everything we want. In my opinion the schedules are not bad, I used to work much harder. If your family is happy here you will be happy that is the most important thing. I once flew with a captain, he did not complain at all. I thought he was happy at EK so I asked him. He said “I hate Emirates, but my family loves Dubai and that makes me happy at work.”

So if you are married, make sure she is the one to make the move, and you can deal with any crap the company sends you.

[Alchemy]

Would my age be hed against me if I had the opportunity to upgrade at EK before I turned 30? Since it's done out of seniority order with an "interview" type of procedure, Is it possible that I would be held in the right seat indefinitely due to an arbitrary thing like "not being old enough".

I don't mean to get ahead of myself, I don't even have an interview much less an offer of employment, but I've heard the good about EK now I'm trying to educate myself on the bad.

[yardman]

Alchemy,

No your age wouldn't be a problem whatsoever. Given where you are professionally, EK represents a significant step up and a great opportunity to get some good international exposure. Given your age, you really have very little to lose by coming over for a few years and getting to the left seat of a 330 or 777. That's pretty much impossible in the US given the state of the industry there now. Once you do that it should be pretty easy to move on if you decide that EK isn't for you.

[Thylakoid]

Hello Coldwing, in Dubai, there is no racism in the sense of the regular definition of the word (you know, whites hating blacks or browns and vice-versa).

There is, in my view, some discrimination based on country of origin, religion, and social status. Usually, but not always, Arabs in general have a better treatment in everything. Obviously, the government tries to show otherwise. Also, generally, Brits and rich Indians have a bigger size of the pie as well.
Again, this the view I have formed after being here for seventeen years.

Most of the pilots coming from more "civilized" parts of the world, dislike the city, the driving standards, the culture, and the unbearable heat.
Most dislike the company as a whole. The harsh flight scheduling, the lack of representation from the pilot's group before the management, and of course, the dictatorial management style.

If you need the job, you have to find psychological means to tolerate the whole crap :ugh: