(Recent) Pilot's Experiences@Etihad Airline

[dubble_dubble]

Hello, this is my 1st post!

Ok i see that there is a "merged" etihad employment forum but it seems that many comments and experiences are from 3 to 4 years ago!

I believe Etihad was established around 5 years ago, when it was just starting and im sure they havent kept all thier promises due to shortage of money and so forth. But today, It seems to be going in a very strong, upward and positive direction in terms of growth.

I have lived in Abu Dhabi for 14 years, i moved to Canada and have been here for about 7 years now.

Im currently enrolled in University (3rd year) studying Accounting and been planning to get my MBA and all that good stuff.

However, Ive been going over my career options and seems like the taxes here on you income is way too high. For example, if you make $155,000 you come out with approx. $100,000. And this is ONLY after federal and provincial taxes (not including CPP, EI, etc etc etc)

As my dream ever since I was a child, and considering alot of my family are in the AVIATION industry, Ive always wanted to be a pilot for a mjor airline, such as etihad.

If i do take this path, i plan to join the canadian military which will take care of ALL training expenses, given that i have to work with them for about 7 years in total (including training). Thus, by time im around 30, i should have all the neccesary hours and experience to join etihad as F/O.

Starting pay is US$6655 x 12 = approx US$80,000 per annum TAX FREE. Thats equivalent to someone making about $120,000 here in canada. Considering the high costs of living and the soaring gas prices and inflation and all that, its very hard to make an above avergae living here in Canada.

Now its says on the Etihad website that F/O's get housing allowance upto US$31000 per annum. Lets say that realistically they give about 70% of that allowance when your first start which works out to be about US$21700 per annum +US$80,000 = US$100,000++ working at etihad at the beggining of your career. Thats equivalent to someone making $155,000 in canada. People here work years and years with significant graduate degrees to get to the 6 figure salary range and when u consider the really high costs of living and all the taxes and deductions from your pay, it makes the value of ur income in canada even worse!

My question is, am I being too optimistic here? From recent etihad F/O recruitments, what housing allowance did etihad start you off with? How is the management there? I know that UAE has some discriminatory problems but im used to that and i know its not as human-rights associated as for example, Canada. But i just want to get FO's first hand experience with Ethad. Was it difficult landing the Job, is it hard to progress, etc etc. Compared to other airlines around the world, how does etihad rank from on your opinion?

Also, do you think joining the canadian millitray and sacrificing 7 + years of my life to be worth it? Will they view that experience highly or is is just a waste of my time joining the military? (remeber, military pays all aviation training costs, an estimated savings of around $40k to $50k)

Also, my most curious question, hows your scheduling on average?

Thank you very much!:ok:

[Dixons Cider]

Also, do you think joining the canadian millitray and sacrificing 7 + years of my life to be worth it?

Well, I think you've answered your own questions there old chap - if thats the way you see it, then certainly they will too.

time to re-think your grand scheme me thinks.

[dubble_dubble]

I dont understand what you mean?:confused:

[Men on pause]

I dont understand what you mean?:confused:

You sound like an ideal candidate for the Etihad VPO job although without Gulf Air in your resume you don't stand a chance.

[dubble_dubble]

Hey Men on pause,
Whats "VPO"?

And why do i need "Gulf Air" on my resume? Please get me upto speed here! I know guf air downsized and have many pilots looking for jobs.

[Toubob]

Dubble;

You need to get some more info re the Canadian forces and your career plan at Etihad.

If you are accepted into the CF and manage to pass Officer Candidate School, PFS and Moose Jaw, you will probably have served almost three years before you get your wings. You then owe another five years of service.

You may be flying anything from a Griffon to a Hercules. In your first two tours you will not be flying the C-17 or the A310.

You will build around 3-400 flying hours per year. Now look at Etihads requirements. Are they accepting 2000 multi turbine pilots as F/O? No.

The CF is not the easy route you seam to think. It is a lot of very hard work
and wont get you where you want to be at age 30.

If you are lucky enough to get to serve in one of the most proffessional
armed forces in the world, you will probably have found a career that is way more rewarding than being an F/O at Etihad anyway. Do your 20 years get a pension then go fly for Transat or Sky service is my advice.

Good luck and remember the Air force moto. "Per Ardua ad Astra".
Lokk it up.

Cheers

[dubble_dubble]

Thanks Toubob. Yes i havent done my full research with the CF yet but I just wanted to get some info on EY!

In your first two tours you will not be flying the C-17 or the A310.

I dont undestand:confused:!

[fatbus]

pipeliners now on the C17

if you can make the grade for the CAF, do it and stay in

[Tintin]

double double, it's seem you chose that profession for the wrong things.. If for you the money is important, do something else, sorry.

For the amount of work and sacrifice you will need if money is your motivation tool you will regret it. If you can pass the RCAF screening you can be accept in all good university and choose something $$$ from there..

good luck

[dubble_dubble]

Hey tintin and others,
Money is not the main motivation. I mean if it were i would take the path to become a doctor/lawyer like many of my friends.

I love flying i defiently have the "flying bug". Sittting at the airport by my house with my lawn chiar(in the summer) and just watching all those cessnas and king airs land and take off!!

Its somthing i would love to do. But im sure its possible to find a decent Fly job with Good pay and benefits overall. Compenstaion packages that are better than what i could find here in Canada etc.

Im just trying to get some insight here and how bad things are really but I see the culture here consists of sarcastic replies and just weird comments that i DONT get.:ugh:

Its hard to tell when ppl ae trying to be funny/sarcastic on a forum.

Anyways im willing to sacrfice alot but at least in turn to have a decent life in the future. Its really not worth it, even if its somthing you love, to live such a different (and somtimes difficult) life and not get at least fairly compensated and treated with the respect u are due in your workplace. Airplanes are my life , If you guys could see my room....As i said, ALL my family on my dad's side are in the aviation in the ME. Not as pilots though.

[sec 3]

Hey Bazooka Joe, buy yourself a scanner so you can listen in on the freq's while you sip on a few cool ones in your lawnchair. It'll help with your radio work in the future:)

[dubble_dubble]

haha sec 3 andy why "Bazooka Joe"??

Stupid radio shack used to carry those scanners but they dont anymore

[Tintin]

I'm sorry Double maybe a got you wrong but since on your first post you have talked about money or salary about 10 times I tought it was your priority.

Just to give you an insight at college we were 21. On that only 4 have job in aviation and only one on a big jet 15 years later.

Don't get me wrong, it's a wonderfull job but dont do it for the money. In Canada a city bus driver make more and they don't put there job on the table every 6 month. But we will agree it's a boring job..

Good luck

[tbaylx]

Yeah basically coming from Canada prepare yourself for 10 years of pain financially before you can start to make a decent living out of it. The industry is just dismal in Canada, guess that is why so many of us Canucks are over here.

On the good side of things there is some damn good ice hockey over here now at least.

[dubble_dubble]

tbaylx,

exactly my point. Aviation is CRAP here....i love flying and all, but im not willing to living pretty much just above the poverty line here with these salaries and taxes!
Compared to Canada, almost any proffesion over in UAE will earn you much greater $$$, even if a job here pays the same as in UAE, ull still be SIGNIFICANTLY better off in UAE money wise.(mann am i gunna get bashed for this)

But ofcourse wee alll like the human rights stuff here in canada and so forth, somthing the ME desperately needs,.....sighhhhhhhhhhh cant have everything. Today was -27 C w.windchill :eek:

where do u fly tbaylx??

[tbaylx]

The problem is you still have to get your experience in Canada before any of the overseas airlines will hire you. Everyone wants jet time which is even more of a pain to come by in Canada.

If you have the right to live/work in the EU it's the ticket. You can get onto a 737 or similar with really low time there compared to Canada and get the 1500-2000 hours of jet that seems to be the magic number.

If you have to start in Canada then do what you have to to get the 2K jet time and then work on moving overseas if that is what you want to do. The only problem is surviving on the salaries they pay there until you can make the move. Don't get me wrong, if you know the right people or are lucky you can make a decent career in canada, but it's the exception rather than the rule.

AC has lowered their time requirements now, since basically a generation of guys that started in the late 80's early 90's gave up on ever getting on there and either went to WJ or moved overseas. If you can get onto AC when you are in your mid to late 20's, still living at home with the folks so you don't have to pay rent, or have several roomates, then it's still a viable career choice. You will eventually make decent money, you just have to get through the first 3-4 years, same for WJ though its a bit better. Guys in their mid 30's with bills to pay and families to take care of who have 7000+ hours just can't afford to work for AC/WJ and alot of us went overseas. Nevermind the fact that you'd have to wait years for a command on anything bigger than a RJ. I think if I had gone the military route i would have just stayed with it, got some good friends in the CF still and they love it.

I've been working in the Middle East for the last 3 years or so and like it so far, though there have been days at a certain staff travel building where homocide seemed like the best solution to an issue. :)

[Toubob]

Dubble;

After earning your wings you may be flying anything from the Griffon Helicopter to a CF-18. For your career aspirations to become an airline pilot you need to fly a large multi-engine aircraft.

Etihad and every other carrier in the middle east want jet time.
Currently for the A320 position their minimum requirement is 1000 hours multi-crew glass cockpit jet time.

In the CF out of flying school your two first three year tours will be at best on the C-130 Hercules which is not a jet but a multi turbine. You will probably have built up around 800 hours on the Herc in those six years. After those two tours you will most likely get a ground tour in a staff position. During those three years you will try to get onto the large heavy jet's the C-17 or the A310 for your next three year tour. To become attractive to Etihad at their current requirements you will probably have put about 15 years into the CF. At this time you will be an experienced Air Force aircrfat commander and the thought of being a juniour F/O on an A320 might not be appealing. Also you can sort of take your CF pension into Air Canada. Most of my CF friends do their 20 years get a nice pension then go looking for airline jobs.

I hope this helps,

[dubble_dubble]

Oh i see

Great info tbaylx and Toubob

So toubob, thats how the CF works ehh...I still had to do research on how long it would take for me to get the hours i needed.\\But still, i mean i could join by next year (when im 22) stay for the 7 years i needed...ill get all my trainig subsidized and build great experinece (not just aviation experience but also military life, discipleine etc) even if its on the hercules and stuff, better than nothing.

My point with joining the CF is that I think il can be highly marketable in the future..I mean looks like everbodys going thru ground school and really suffering the tuition fees they have to pay and sounds really tough to buiild hours (on minumum wage etc) with what little aviation we have here in canada. So do u think the airlines (ie EY / EK) will view military experience highly?

I saw on AC website they just need 1000 hours of flying time....but god knows what will happene to AC 7-10 years from now! theyve been bankrupt once and very close to being bankrupt quite a few times after....

sighhhh tough decisons. is there any other way of building jet hours here in canada? I will be living at home iwth my folks i guess so min. wage is meh:ugh:

[dubble_dubble]

Im booking an interview time with a recruiter at CF soontime to see what kind of hours i could expect to get at CF


And im damn lost with all the lingo

What is PIC time
WHat is "Fixed wing aircraft" dont all aircraft have fixed wings? lol
jet/glass cockpit?
Multi -crew?

[clevlandHD]

Start walking before running! If, and that's a big if, you get selected by the CF, you will do your 7-8 yr and by then the aviation landscape will have changed again. Good jobs might (most probably will) be somewhere else than the ME. So don't fix yourself with EY. And forget about the money. What if you never get selected by EY or EK?

[dubble_dubble]

clevlandHD, And why the Big IF? lol i have a 3.2 GPA and lotsa extracuricular activities under my belt...plus i have a business registered under my name and a partner with yearly profits of 35k to 50K!( i dont knwo if thats relevant but shows some leadership) Im confident about getting into the CF and thats the least of me worries:cool:...

You are correct with regards to the aviation landscape changing. And that is somthing always on my mind...what if the ME is not doing so great down the road? Then things go sour hahaha:ugh:

Im still doing alot of research im not 100% sure if i will take this path...im going to Abu dhabi in april after exams to visit my fam...my dad works closely with EY and occasionally w. our favuorite character, JH:D
so im going to see whats really happening there.

One thing that really makes me believe that UAE has a great advantage over any country in the world is this, they have legally unfair business laws lool...They control competiton..if they see that a foreign carrier (or any foregn company) is digging in to thier piece of pie, they just wont let them do so. Ive learned this from the 14 years ive lived there. But thats just my opinion..its not like in the states were there are soooo many airlines competeing agaist each other and many going bankrupt.

Also, Gulf air is a BIG exception....alot of my fam used to work there inclduing my daddy, and from day 1 its been a shaky compnay to work for with many near misses in terms of going bankrupt. But i think that generally EY and Ek will be doing good over the next decade. I can almost say with confidence they will NEVER go bankrupt or anything like that.

And again, i understand thier low pilot morale..That does suck. I think the main reason for that is, UAE is still kind third world-ish.....sighhh cant have everything:sad:

[dubble_dubble]

Hey SNAM, good point! if there is more competition then i guess there would be better wokring conditions as companies will compete to get u flying with them! But still, i think this way kinda guarantees thier EK/EY existence!

Thanks for the terms so ive seen some ppl say PIC 1 or PIC 2,, any difference there?

Fixed-Wings LOL

And im guessiing "3500 TT" means 3500 total flying time?

[dubble_dubble]

maybe true... but this shows a huge amount of Nationalism which is obviously very much present in that area... also, no competition means that you are "stuck" and, whatever they (CEO/Chairman/President) decide to do it becomes the norm with no ways to change that decision, since no other competitors around to compare with.


Ok someone teach me how to quote!

Ya trutru i guess its a tradeoff!! Our main man JH today announced "middle east the Centre of aviation" lol
https://www.zawya.com/story.cfm/sidZAWYA20080226084515

[sec 3]

Comics no longer come with the gum? If your dad knows the boss at EY, you should try to get in the EY cadet program:)

[dubble_dubble]

mannn i dont know how much easier that would make my life! Pretty sure its "emiratis only":ugh:

[sec 3]

Things have changed recently i think. It's not only for Emiratis any more. Check it out.

[dubble_dubble]

Sec 3 dont give me aheart attack like that lol im gunna check it out but i highly doubt...i know how well they treat thier own ppl. Even when i used to go to high school there , all the local kids would get big incentives to do well in school like a big amount of $$$$:rolleyes: