Desperation has reached another level!

[Rusty Clifton]

Can anyone guess what the next level is after buying a type rating to secure that illusive first job?

That's right... go buy yourself a citation!

Could not believe my ears when i heard this, is there no limits to peoples spending to get ahead of others?

[davecr]

Wow, people are getting richer and richer, too! :confused:

[Jinkster]

My desperation - sent a CV to an operator in Lagos, Nigeria and to the Democratic Republic of Congo :rolleyes:

Hopefully, a free bullet proof jacket will be within the benefits package :uhoh:

[davecr]

Just make sure you check the landing gear bays once or twice before take-off ;)

[A320rider]

sometimes, I can not believe how low I have fallen, pre september 2001 everything was runnning well, good job, medium pay, girlfriend,...a car,...

3 years later: I have nothing left , no social help, no job, only problems with my family and a lot of negative replies from airlines.

Airlines are asking me to compete with people who buy 1-2 type ratings, who pay VAT tax,...this only If i want get a job back and with no guaranty of course.

I just feel I got it deep in the bottom!!!:ugh:

next step what airline will ask: bring your own customers if you want fly your next 150 hours...
I have eared some maintenance guys are paid with free airline tickets to resell !

[rbr919]

Shock Horror!

'Doctor pays NHS to learn how to operate!'

'Doctor pays hospital to work there for 1 year!'

'Doctor buys hospital!'

Do you ever feel exploited because you decided to follow your dream!

Its about time we adopted the Amercian system whereby everybody is on a level playing field. You train and then you work as an instructor till you get to 1500 hrs. When times are good airlines will take less hours and when times are hard you will have to do more hours but the airlines will still look at you first.

Otherwise its going to be those with the biggest pockets or biggest Daddies wallet can buy there way in. Is this what a Labour party would want....no!

[TolTol]

Some very very good points on this thread:ok:

[737Spicegirl]

So this has now become the state of pilot recruitment?

Going on a limb here, I would assume that this person is doing it to run some sort of charter operation, does he/she honestly believe that a low houred wannabe will have the credibility and experience to operate and fly paying customers around Europe in a single crew a/c such as a Citation.....give me a break!

People such as this are exactly who we try to weed out of this industry in the first place – cavalier attitudes and over confidence is the number one killer!

Buying your way into a job so blatantly, because you lack the social or flying ability is the ultimate in desperation. If that’s the state that you are in, shouldn’t you just carry on doing whatever employment you are currently doing. Especially if it pays enough for you to buy a bizjet!

For many of us, it has taken years of training, whether Military or Civilian – all with an end goal in sight, we do this cause ultimately we love to fly – stepping up the employment ladder bit by bit is in itself recognition for our hard work and achievement! To buy that sort of recognition is nothing short of pathetic...

Good luck to you whoever you are, hopefully I never see the likes of you in my company!

SG

[Saffer]

Way....Scheez!!!

This sounds familiar, the boys from the Bushe I see?

[Low Voltage]

I'm strugglying with this concept...

though this topic sounds familiar to this guy i know that also holds the record for completing the ATPL exam paper for VFR comms in 2 minutes. This guy is switch on. Maybe we need to increase our forward thinking to incorporate such plans... I hope not.

[ACN_Pilot]

Hey Jinkster,

what airline did u apply to in Nigeria? I fly in Nigeria and might be able to give advice.

ACN_Pilot

[VFE]

Threw a few CV's out to Falcon in Dubai earlier in the year. They fly cargo into Baghdad.... :}

Got no response whatsoever which does not exactly fill you with belief in pilot recruitment improving!

VFE.

[Jinkster]

acn_pilot,

check your private messages :)

[Mister Geezer]

VFE

You need a rating before Falcon will look at you... surprise surprise!

[woof]

'Doctor pays NHS to learn how to operate!'
'Doctor pays hospital to work there for 1 year!'
'Doctor buys hospital!'

I don't really think that you can link the two principles together.

One is working for the government in providing free health care to absolutely anyone (even when they are in private medicine - most if not all carry on with national health).

One is seeking to work for a business that has a main aim to make money.

I feel the self pity may have gone too far. I too am looking. Have been for a long time, have a little more experience than most, have bills like the rest and a child on the way, but we all have to remain positive.

Stories like this (and no disrespect to the thread starter) are harmful. This one, for example, has stirred up a huge hornets nest and is based on heresay. There's no factual evidence to say that this situation has actually happened. Even if it has, I suspect that it's as 737 Spicegirl says and theres more to it.

Chins up folks. Each and everyone of us has something to offer and we will get there in the end.:ok:

[rbr919]

Anyone who completes a VFR paper is 2 minutes is a ******!
Thats about 5 seconds a question and speed only leads to mistakes. Why take 2 minutes when you have 30 minutes and can double/triple check it. What a plonker! I don't care even if he got 100% the opportunity was there to make mistakes. Did he not learn from HP & L, that Humans make mistakes!

[VFE]

Mister Geezer,

Asked about the prospects with a BE1900 rating and low hours but got no response. Last I heard they had a queue of guys in the pool to keep them going for well over a year, mind you, that was a PPRuNe rumour so could be inaccurate.

VFE.

[stir crazy]

rb919

Holy 4 sector days, i bet you are a barrell of laughs to have to go to work with!

[essexboy]

If this guy has bought a citation he will probably own an airline in the not too distant future and start employing pilots. Try to see the wood not just the trees.

[benhurr]

Got 100% in VFR coms in under 2 minutes, screwed up HP&L and only got 96%.

Not big, or clever but there again I havent come across as holier than thou.

So which Citation?

How much to purchase?

Does this someone know someone who will add it to their AOC?

Go ahead, jump on a bandwagon - maybe owning and operating a citation could cost less than paying for a type rating and buying line hours?

No it isn't me - but why criticise when you have NO facts?


And no I don't own a citation - do own an aircraft though...

[ATP_Al]

'Doctor pays NHS to learn how to operate!'

I was all set for a career in medicine before I took a trial flying lesson, so let's continue the analogy.......

A medical student studies for 5-6 years. Given that higher education is far from free they have every chance of racking up £40,000 worth of debt, just like an fATPL wannabe. They then work 70+ hrs a week on a junior doctor's starting salary of £16-18k. With time it gets better but that's the way it is and the people who do it don't expect any different.

Meanwhile the student pilot does 18 months of full time training (or an equivalent amount of part time training over a longer period) and immediately expects a jet job paying £30k. It doesn't come, but instead of working their way up the wannabe gambles on buying a type rating.

It is all to do with expectation. A jet F/O job with a major airline is a senior position that you have to earn. Some people will always be lucky and get these opportunities early in their careers. There is nothing wrong with aiming to be one of those people, but if it doesn't happen to you then you have not failed or been wronged by the industry.

Instructing, parachute flying, glider towing, ferry flights, traffic reporting, air taxi et al are what you should be expecting for your first few jobs. There is nothing wrong with aiming for the big boys, but remember that the junior doctor I mentioned earlier probably doesn't expect to be doing open heart surgery six months after leaving medical school!

Al

[flybyshark]

Well said Atpl_Al

This may be the hardest industry to break into, but can we honestly say its the hardest to do after that?

I dont know a single Airline Pilot that after all the usual moaning and groaning you expect from any job, they still smile and thank the holiest of holies they aint grinding a 9-5 in an office.

It may still take hard work to keep your skills up to scratch but hey! Aint it fun!

I for one will be knocking on all the operations in my region at the very least to get a job and if I get some multi work I will be damn happy!

Doesnt stop me applying to Ryanair though and promising my soul for a rating and a job!! If its there apply for it, is my moto!

[Gufo]

Got 100% in VFR coms in under 2 minutes, screwed up HP&L and only got 97%.

I guess some answer sheets are cheaper than a Citation :suspect:

;)

[High Wing Drifter]

ot 100% in VFR coms in under 2 minutes, screwed up HP&L and only got 97%.
The only worthwhile pissing contest I heard was between test pilots on how many types they collected in their logbooks. However, saying that I knew this bloke what got 100% in PoF, the only person at the time on record for having done so. If you met him you would realise it wasn't a fluke or an answer sheet job.

[hollywood285]

He may be clever but can he fly, I've met too meny pilots who can talk the talk, pass the written with +85% on the exams but the flying standards, well a natural 50 hour PPL can fly better!!!

[747 Downwind]

Bloody hell, what a thread.. get all sorts in here don't we!

Is there any evidence that some bod bought a citation or was it just the topic starter making a cynical remark using a certain degree of irony to suggest what some wannabes MAY do to secure a job. It appears they were trying to be a clever dick and half the frozen ATPL holders on this forum jumped on the bandwagon.

Even if he does exist you would think that maybe he is a John Travolta type, who lets be honest is not bothered about flying for a living cos their so rich.. it's a 5-10 mil jet not a 20-30k type rating!

rbr919.. shut up with all that Labour party crap, their a bunch of muppets who couldn't organise a piss up in a brewery, or a smoking ban in public places, or a solid political stance on Zimbabwe, or a thorough policy to tackle yob culture.. :E
They couldn't give a monkeys about the current climate of social injustice surrounding aviation employment, you'd have to get Prestcott out of his comfy Jag first.

Spicegirl chill out.. I don't even think they're for real.
Stir-crazy.. nice words
Essexboy.. true words spoken by a scholar, just wish most of the boyz round Ilford, Barking etc had your intellect on a Saturday night, would save me a hell of a lot of grief :p

ATP_AL.. Nice piece. I initially pursued that path but even the air taxi sorts etc want experience these days, leaves some in a no win, no win scenario forcing them to pursue other avenues that they may wish not to undertake under normal circumstances

74 Downind:ok:

[RYR-738-JOCKEY]

A jet F/O job with a major airline is a senior position that you have to earn.

Well put ATP-Al. I totally agree with you up to the point about the economic aspects. A typical ab-initio pilot with 200hrs have payed up to 100.000 Euros. How is it possible to fly singles and earn virtually nothing and still pay off his debts?
An expensive education requires a well paid job. Fast. I wouldn't advise anyone to take the route that I did. Working nights and instructing on daytime. I think it's only fair that guys with 200 hrs get hired to fly jets. They certainly gamble on it. The problem here is how this business works, not that the low-houred guys are too demanding.

[purple head]

Hi, just want to give you guys some good news. I've just been offered a job flying 737-800's in China. I just finished my CPL/IR five weeks ago (total time 242 hours). The company will pay for my type rating, however I need to do some CAAC exams (5 in total) so the pay while I do the exams and type rating is not so good. I received a lot of help from a Chinese person, who I was put in contact with from a Chinese friend. She sat in and translated during the interview, made initial contact with various airlines through contacts she has and provided a lot of help, obviously she charges a fee for all this help. If anyone is interested please private me and I can pass the girls e-mail address.