MAS Floodgates Open(Merged).

[MAStake]

For the first time in history MAS has employed / is employing foreign pilots on its 744 fleet.

Local pilots are all on high hours and flights are "re-scheduled" almost daily.

Knee jerk reaction?

Or just plain bad management?

There goes the Nationalisation Policy in one fell swoop.

[speedtwoten]

you won't belive it MAS just open a walk in interview in JKT on 27/28/29 April and 11/12/13 May SariPanPacific hotel they will recruit 70-80 pilots for its wide & narrow body so be happy-lah and good bye MAPA, apparently MAS will have cheap pay indon pilot's than rising their local pilots:\

[Shintaro9]

Speedtwoten,

I am just, if not more dissapointed than you. Yes, MAS would rather employ outsiders and eventually pay more than give concessions to locals. Also MAS (Taody) too proud to make moves to at least encourage those that left to come back. Even the govenment is trying to entice professionals to come back and serve the nation. But for MAS no way. Too proud/arrogant I guess.

I heard (from the scheduling people) that many pilots have exceeded hours. Many flew more than 100 hrs per month and heck, 1 chap even logged 140 hrs. Mockery of the FTL scheme, I say. And MAS has the cheek to go and ask DCA for dispensation to exceed 90/900 hrs quoting national interest. :}

MAS Flight Safety and DCA, what have you to say? And MAPA, I reckon you should encourage your members to refuse those call ups cos at the end of the day you're helping a company that does not appreciate your value. Those rescheduled call ups disrupt your family life and in the end will upset you. Then your health will be affected. Remember that unwittingly, you are helping MAS cover up their mistakes.

Should this sad state of affairs continue, I am forced to draw the conclusion that MAS operations are neither safe nor legal.

Sad, really sad.

:sad:

[ROCKSTEADY]

How come this is not posted on their website?

[emilio69]

hmmm.. and i thought not so long ago somebody in the higher management said that the company had enough drivers to last them a lifetime...

I wonder what song they are singing now... "desperado'' by the eagles would be a nice song to start off.. ;)

[speedtwoten]

shintaro9 and emilio69

like I said soon you are going to be stranger in your own plane mann, MAS has approval of 70 to 80 direct entry Capt and F/O limitation only F/O must hold ATPL or frozen ATPL that's all and soon they becoming Commander giving instruction to local F/O and TOADS and his club band going to A380 and be retiring at age of 60, and say thank's to MAPA to make a little noise:\

[freightdriver]

speedwoten

Dunno how cheap the indon pilots are but the local aviation industry is taking a dive with the rising fuel price and most would like to get a job somewhere, anywhere....beats sitting at home...

;)

I know that a lot of pilots showed up for the interview in Jakarta, they will be contracted through a 3rd party agency. Not sure about what they are offering but like I said better than being an unemployed pilot.

I am curious to what is the present condition of the company, since I've heard that there was an exodus of Malaysian pilots to the middle east, thus creating the present shortage of qualified/rated pilots. As I am sure that hiring of expats will be a short term solution, like to hear all of your opinion to what is really going on within the company and how you all feel about the hired guns driving MAS airplanes soon.

Thanks!:ok:

[freightdriver]

Before this thread is going to be merged with other similar topic about MAS, I like to know from all pilots who are presently flying for MAS. (malays, other locals and expats)

1. Reasons for many local pilots fleeing MAS, thus creating shortage of crew. (of course the obvious for more money) but like to hear your opinions anyway.

2. How many expat crew and countries
3. How do you all feel about more expat crews coming on board
4. MAPA or MAS pilots assoc stand towards MAS management

I am not a journalist looking for a story, I have been offered a SIM eval soon as part as the expat crews coming on a contract basis and would really like to know how you all feel about this....

:suspect:

[Kaptin M]

speedtwoten, with the apparent hole MAS have dug for themselves - by allowing their EXPERIENCED Captains to depart - what did you think the solution was going to be, other than to replace EXPERIENCE with EXPERIENCE?
Upgrade F/O's who are not yet ready, in terms of experience?

Further, I doubt that - even if that option were exercised - the training department could handle the volume required, nor do it quickly enough to prevent the "re-scheduling" from eventually becoming ongoing cancellations.

MAS has cut off their nose, to spite their face, by allowing their long term Captains to leave the company, rather than increase their benefits to retain them - a decision they are going to regret, and one that is going to cost them FAR MORE than they have saved.

[emilio69]

hey speedwoten... sorry to dissapoint but i have been flying with a different company since last year (thank god!)...and looking at the mess which i am seeing now in mh which gets even harder even to clean at regular intervals... looks like my decision to leave was not bad at all..

What irks me is that the so called 'big' boss has boasted that they do not have a problem making up the numbers....and at the same time hiring outside help and depriving your own pilots what is due to them is,i personally feel, really acting on bad faith.But then again...does he really give a s**t? :mad:

[triplebogey]

Top Brass in MH is either
a)not giving a s**t
b)too dumb to give a s**t
and its all of the above, they are more interested in saving 'face' and their position rather than be interested in how the future of MAS will be.
So much for the 300 pilots we have to be put in place of these "traitors" who have left for greener pastures and much better companies.They are now re-scheduling on a daily basis and asking for an increase in yearly hours.Short term thinking for short folk...

On the contrary to what Kaptin M has said, most FO's have the hours required for command and because of the lack of ability to plan, they have not been getting their upgrades and are now leaving in droves to other jobs.IF what spedwoten has said is true, that will push even the guys who are/were thinking of remaining in mh and will compound the problem....

[EY777]

Freightdriver, welcome to the perpetual circus call Malaysia Airlines.An airline which has more take offs & landings (as proudly claimed by the SGMFO) than a popular national carrier down south but inexplicably,they can't even make a decent profit, let alone retain their pilots.

Contrary to popular propaganda by the management, pilots are leaving not because of the 'pull' factors (more known as the USD factor), rather it's the 'push' factors :p

Working contracts (the locals call it the MoU) are not being honoured, medical benefits are eroded, travel perks are curtailed & the wanton dirsregard of the MoU by management have made the pilots demoralised.Leave are all but frozen now to meet the shortcomings of the mismanagement of the manpower requirements.

While you will not get the red carpet treatment by the locals,don't expect to be treated unfairly either.They are generally a good bunch of blokes (albeit demoralised) & professional to the core.The present pilots are in the midst of a pay revision & the management are torpedoing this effort by taking in expats at a 'penny wise pound foolish' face saving exercise by taking in expats while waiting for the '300' cadets to fill in the present void :confused: So defintely your presence will make all parties uncomfortable except management of course :p

Another word of caution, think very carefully why MAS are not able to retain their locals let alone their expats pilots.Bottom line is if you are offered a contract by them, read it very,very carefully.You might just be in the same boat as the locals if you blindingly accept the first 'version' :} If they treat locals till they leave their own country what would that make you? :E

[freightdriver]

EY777 thank you for your cander insight.

As much as I do not want to be part of the problem for the guys fighting for their rights or be part of a lousy management temporary quick fix, what is being offered so far is attractive for me to consider making the move.

As I am sure there will be fine prints that needs to be clarified and further examined.:hmm:

Facts: management in this part of the world still mesmerized with past glory days of monopoly that they have not adapted to today's supplies and demands.

To all MAS driver, my best wishes for your fight and struggle and know that for most of us we have been through this hard times one to many and for what is worth know that if we do come, we come in peace....:ok:

[freightdriver]

Any info what current benefits are for narrowbody Captain and First Officer would be appreciated:D

We could try to demmand at least the same on a contract basis with no job security and no additional benefits

Hoping that we will not obstruct current negotiation of MAS pilots and management.:hmm:

Just a thought....trying to be wise and seek a win-win formula.

In an ideal world: We could come in and help out...MAS management is pleased and come to their senses, and MAS mainline will get what is deserved...:8

[flightleader]

If you are going in as a widebody FO,you are in the way of at least 500 FO who are trying to get themselves into widebody.If you are going in as a narrow body captain then you are in the way of 800 FO who are trying to get their command. Would you be treated nicely? Depends on who you speak to. Good luck.;)

[ClimbGodammitClimb]

Just a word of advice and caution,

Don't cross an Official Picket Line.

[freightdriver]

Flightleader

Point well taken, like I said I for one are not trying to get in anybody's way during my 3 year contract as offered.

Hopefully at the end, something else will turn up for me back here or elsewhere. Not that I would not consider staying on at MAS, but I would only do that if they take me on as a regular employee and I will probably the first to join the ranks of my brothers seeking fair and better treatment....(I am known for that)

Anyhow hope to see you and hope you are one of those who'll have an open mind about us coming over.....
:ok: Have a good one!

[freightdriver]

ClimbGodammitClimb

:confused:
Is MAS pilots assoc considering going on strike?

If this is the case and IFALPA makes a ruling I don't think any of the guys who attended the open interview at WIII will want to cross the line.

But we need an official confirmation that this is certainly the case. anyone?:ouch:

[Jon Lei]

Mr Freightdriver,

Expats arriving at MAS is definitely gonna piss a lot of people here. Like mentioned in other posts, expats will be stepping and leaping on many aspiring for a promotion. The pilot's assoc is in the midst of negotiating a better deal for locals. You guys coming here will surely throw all their efforts down the drain! Remember it’s not about having an open mind or not. Ultimately you guys will be held responsible if the pilots get a bad deal.

The fleet where you can make a few friends and not be noticed will be DHC-6 Command or FO, or the F-50 FO. Get posted anywhere else and you will find yourself getting cursed in foreign languages, ignored (by the girls too), not being served meal choices or drinks on time, spending layovers alone in the dark, doing all the work (and I mean all sectors and relevant paperwork). Just ask the Indonesian FO’s.

So all the best for your sim check ride.

[Outlaw]

Hi Mr Jon Lei,

U mentioned about DHC-6,just want to know do u know about their operations in MAS?Would like to know about the conditions,number of flights per day,the ticket price and so on....

Will really appreciate it...thanx.

[freightdriver]

C'mon! I don't believe the situation could be as bad as described by Jon Lei.

At the end of the day we are professional and you all should see where we are coming from. Most offered a position at MAS is seeking a better condition.

So either you guys go on strike and we will honor your picket lines or.....:hmm:

[Giant88]

Strike in MAS is not an option. MAS considered as national carrier. Any strike talk will be considered as sabotage to the government. And government will use the ISA (Internal Security Act), ie jail without court order for at least 2 years.
Gov has a special branch (SB) stationed in any company where there is a gov interest. Latest SB was stationed at crewing section (dept which monitor crew utilization) after the report leak that a lot of flt delayed coz of nil pilots. The idea was to find out if pilots are sabotaging MAS by purposely refusing or delaying any flt.
The fact is most pilots are limited by FTL. Most are reaching the max allowed FTL.
The monthly roster now is just another piece of paper which by the end of the month, we might just do 60% of the rostered flt. The rest either called up frm standby or we just can't do the flt coz of the high hours.....

[speedtwoten]

:) latest issue are that all expat going for MAS from Indon, are non GA pilot's . MH and GA have sort of understanding : GA will deliverd or fill in the pax for GA route in int'l flight including cargo which is operate by MH fleet and MH must not accepted any GA pilot's applying for MAS except those who's assigned by GA in the Join Operation for B744/A330, so people must be aware by now that expat coming to work for MAS are not from GA, those are from other domestic company such as Lion, Mandala, Batavia Air etc.:\

[Brianigham]

Kaptin M

Upgrade F/O's who are not yet ready, in terms of experience?

Actually Kaptin there are many first officers on the 737 who already have more than the required "experience" for promotions to the wide body fleets, but can't all be released because.............the cow jumped over the moon, the little dog laughed to see such fun and the dish ran away with the spoon. Once the cadets get on line I am sure they would put more SVN's out.;)

What is really sad though is the lack of accountability. For a company to be "national interest", the people put at important enough positions should at least be held accounable for the exodus.

If it was a surprise, then they can be excused. From what I hear the management was informed of this impending exodus way back in 2003. The fact that they did not prevent this from happening, or even try, just tells me what kind of people sit in office in this company.

:( :( :(

[triplebogey]

freightdriver,

Knowing full well the situation here and you are still pushing to come over here is fine and a decision to "make a better living" is respected but please do not go on and say you will honour our picket lines because by coming here, you are already not honouring our cause..... Aside from that, if you do come please take our advice and read the fine print on your contract and make sure it is not erasable ink otherwise you will be joining the picket lines regardless ....

[flightleader]

And please don't turn green green when local boy get payrise,bonus,special payments etc, because your contract say nothing about it!!

[Brianigham]

:) Hi frieghtdriver.

As long as you stay out for the time being you will be respected as a fellow pilot. Come over now and you will no longer be one of us. You will not be given the courtesy of a fellow pilot. Thats the facts bro. Stay out . Then when we get this situation rectified I am sure we will invite you in with open arms. The pilot shortage is not going to go away soon. Its the mismanagement that we are trying to highlight now and the general terms of our career. Most other airline Pilots should get it! . Those few guys who have got in despite knowing the situation are traitors as far as I am concerned. They are going to be very lonely, and I dont wish them well at all. ( Cant believe I just said that .but hey!) Stay out for now bro and that would be the sentiments of nearly all of us. Come in when things have calmed down and you will see that the pilots in MAS, Malay or not will not even notice you are an expat.

Hope that gives you an idea how those ten or so guys have already started screwing things for us. And it not the money bro. We are used to being payed less. We are used to being screwed by management, but this time they have really pushed us too far with too many lies to the BOD. Too many things in the MOU not being honoured, Too many terms and conditions modified to screw us.

[EY777]

Freightdriver, as you would now realise, the situation has turned ugly.As much as the locals would like to embrace you, the timing is a little off.

Picketing in Malaysia will get you a 'go straight to jail' card.As it is, the Mismanagers of MAS are telling everybody including the powers that be in the Gov't that the MAS pilots are 'sabotaging' the schedules, when it is through their own mismanagement that flights get 'retimed' (get use to that word, as MAS never has any delays.....all are retimed :p ) So, you can't join the picket line, there is none whatsoever.These guys are nowhere near the edge of a cliff, but the mismanagers are pushing them there!

Again, if you decide to come, it will be at your own peril as MAS or rather the mismanagers of MAS will make their own 'interpretations' of your contract at your own expense.This should be your bigger concern than being 'boycotted' by the locals.Remember, if they arbitrarily screw the locals......what's gonna happen to you? :sad:

BTW, for those of you not in the know, MAS has the required number of local pilots with experience to fill the slots, unfortunately, through creative mismanagement there is now a catch 22 situation where, locals can't be promoted as there is a serious manpower shortage at all fleets.This came about by the arrogance of the mismanagers to acknowledge the 'exodus' & rectify the succession of retiring pilots.In other words the mismangers (not a spelling error) "Screw Up Big Time!" :mad:

[MAStake]

Looks like the movement OUT of MAS is gaining momentum. We can expect a considerable number of resignations very soon from the ranks of the senior captains and senior first officers.

Plenty of opportunities from all and sundry to join the airline that "goes beyond expectations."

[speedtwoten]

;) you think it will scare MAS all pilot of MAS may go, and the Indon desperate driver are keep coming MAS management has known that so nothing to worry them, you are the one's who worrying MAS not the management, you are nothing to them, so good bye lah:{

[freightdriver]

Speedwoten :confused:

I resent your labeling of Indon drivers as being desperate, they can't help it if the local economy can't pay a decent driver's wage and have to look elsewhere for greener pasture....

For me being both a NorthAmerican and an Asian I chose to be here to be close to my roots and besides NorthAmerica is not doing to hot in terms of driver's market.:}

I could appreciate how the influx of indon drivers will cause tension to those who chooses to stay on at MAS, but do keep in mind at the end of the day is about survival and being able to pay the bills..sad but that's the fact jack.

Go figure why there is so many westerners working in the fareast, like they say the grass always looks greener on the other side....or girls or whatever floats your boat!:ok:

[freightdriver]

:confused:
Thank you all for your comments and inputs on this difficult subject

I hope I have made myself clear enough that I genuinely feel for what is going on at MAS presently as so many of you have pionted out.:ugh:

As far as my decision to go or not to go, I still have ways to go before they offer me anything (sim ride, 2nd interview etc) so in the mean time I will have to do some soul searching and hopefuly something else will turn up (with less headache).

I have been trough what is going on at MAS a few years back, so I know what you guys are talking about. In my case only a few stayed on with the cause and ended up without a job, it's hard to confince your fellow drivers that management can't replace all of us at once...

Reality: I am going to be without a job again soon and would like to get settled somewhere, I am beating the driver's statistic, I actually have a very supportive loving family who I would still like to support on my driver's pay and lived happily ever after.....blah blah...

but that's my story...again thanks for all your sincere responds and anytime you're in WIII area give me a shout first round on me....
:ok:

[MAStake]

It's not a matter of being afraid of the Indonesians. After all, we have more than a million of them over here, legal and illegal. Another hundred or so won't make much difference. Everyone is entitled to seek a better life.

MAS pilots won't make your life difficult. But if I were a foreigner seeking employment with MAS I would be very wary of the way the toad and his cronies interpret the contract.

The grass may be greener on the other side of the fence because the soil is more fertile. It would serve you well, however, to note that the gardener uses human waste (read Local Pilots) to fertilize the land.

[speedtwoten]

freightdriver and MAStake , you must be on the cargo, what I mean TOADS don't care whatever the local's driver would do, the show must go on, and you both right everyone is entiteld for a better living, but I believe you have to come in the right time and nicely welcome

[Kaptin M]

From my (almost 30 years) in airlines, MAStake, it is my opinion, that threats of "considerable numbers" of pilots leaving are simply that - threats, which rarely come to fruition, leaving the pilots who made those threats look stupid, and giving management more confidence to indulge in further cutbacks of the remaining pilots' conditions.

The FACT is it takes a helluva lot, before a pilot will decide to uproot his entire previous life, and leave his friends and family (and association with his employer).
Pilots are eternal optimists, hoping for a new change in direction with a change of management, and as a result are usually willing to stick it out for the long haul, rather than resign.

Yes, there ARE much better rewarded jobs than MAS, on offer with other companies. And it is a shame to see the very loyal, and HIGHLY professional pilots of Malaysian not being rewarded as they deserve, (having flown with many pilots from other countries, I - and others who have worked for MAS - can state that, in all honesty....you guys DO, individually, have VERY good standards.)
But sense of family, State, and company will see the vast majority of you remain in the hope that there is an impending improvement - even if it's finally by way of an unleashed Ringitt.

Reverse the situation, how many of you in MAS would take a job in Indonesia, placed in the same situation as the Indons?
Similar cultures, lifestyles, language, and your new country of residence only a stone's throw from home.

Supporting each other, will benefit all.
Scrapping between yourselves, diverts the attention away from where your focus should be!

[MAStake]

Foreign pilots are most welcome and the opportunities are aplenty. It was a note of caution to those intending to join that terms and conditions have been eroded over the years and the fact that almost 100 local pilots have left says a lot when you consider that most pilots find it difficult to uproot.

Yes, standards are high among the pilots and many acknowledge that . It is the standard of ethics among the managers that all of us question.

We don't want pilots, be they foreign or local, to be cannon fodder. In the community of pilots we support each other and it is only fair to remind those intending to join that the greener pastures may be just an illusion that will vanish when those who call the shots feel they are threatened.

There is a lot of difference between scrapping with each other and a friendly note of caution.

We do understand that uprooting, be it from Malaysia to the desert or Indonesia to the greener pastures, takes a lot of consideration. Shouldn't the pilots be given more information before making such a move?

[freightdriver]

Ok

Though I agree with some of your points MAStake, and do appreciate your insight to the problem from your perspective.

The fact remains at the moment MAS is short of pilots, (pls confirm this) meaning if they can't get people to come in and keep their a/c flying on sched they will loose more money which means they will not able to meet any of the demmands of present MAS employees (Pilots, Flight Attendant, Ground staff, Maint and many others) THis is all theory of course, airline management in recent history has always claim loss to avoid improving conditions for employees.

So first and foremost the mission at hand is to try to save the carrier and I tend to agree with Kaptin M in that a better way to approach this is to have reps of the pilot group included in the hiring process of additional expat drivers and inform them of present goals and mission.

What you have to keep in mind as well is the offer as far as I know, new drivers will work for a 3rd party agent and not directly for MAS.

dunno if I make any sense or not, care to comment Kaptin M? (lack of sleep on my part):8

[BusyB]

I don't know if its a reflection of the pressures MAS pilots are under at the moment, but as a regular into KUL I have noticed a decrease in the professionalism of the MAS crews. Twice in the last week we were impeded by MAS aircraft who were not seeing the "big picture" and made life difficult for both ATC and ourselves.

Hoping that you MAS pilots can get a satisfactory resoulution to your problems with the company before any incident occurs.
Good Luck

[EY777]

Whoa!

Obviously, there is more than what meets the eye on the present situation in MAS.

Ok, we have known so far for a fact that nearly 10% of the locals have left within a period of 1 year to date.This number doesn't include the attrition rate of the expats (which are dynamic in any airline).

The present 'apparent' shortage of pilots were caused by the mismanagers (of Flight Operations, consisting of pilots themselves) duping the upper management & hoodwinking the DCAM through a period of 10 years.Now, the fruits of their labour have turned to bite them back very hard in their well licked posterior.This was a well executed plan, with a disregard for ICAO SARP's by nearly doubling the max hours per year limit (through the augmented crew operations) & was only stopped after MAS ops were pressured by 'external' forces.This practise is now being copied by other operators around the world who work hand in glove with their respectives CAA or DCA equivalent :} Thanks a lot for that MAS :mad: And we all think SQ was shrewd :ooh: This inflation of 'extra' man hours available, bolden the mismanagers to promise almost everything including the moon to their superiors, not to mention making all the managers scoring brownie points!

Obviously, all good things must come to an end, & the straw that broke the camel's back had been thrown ironically after the Camel was ousted & 'Doctorcon' was installed to stop the internal politicking of the ambitious management pilots (including a power crazed shortie) If you guys wanna stop me here, & say it sounds like the new Star Wars movie, well unfortunatley the storyline has a few parallels :E

The forces of good & evil battled it out....whooops wrong story :p Well, after the dust settled & a new Boss was installed (both the new management & the SGMFO) things went downhill again for the pilots.Again it takes a pilot to screw a pilot, & these guys are desperate as their retirement age is coming up & they need to line up their nest.Again, promises were made.Hence the situation that the local pilots are in now.As all leave are being frozen to meet up with the demand of the new trailblazing routes & extra frequencies, the core issues of the locals work rule (the MoU) which is inclusive of the approved FTL limits (by DCAM) were dispensed to meet up with the new patterns.No new extra cadets were available to relief the manpower shortage as the mismanagers promised to their bosses that they will be able to absorb the requirements even when they earlier theatened the pilots of retrenchment when the financial crisis happened & again when the SARS epidemic took hold.To add salt to the gaping wound, the screws are tightened to squeeze what ever little perks that the pilots have to make MAS more 'cost efficient'.Push come to shove, some have made the move (including yours truly) as we had enough of this circus called MAS.

So currently, the bosses applied a 'smokescreen' to dupe the Joe public & more importantly,their superiors (even the Gov't, I believe) that the numerous flight retiming are caused by pilots leaving for the unexpected 'pull' factors of other airlines & not of their incompetencies.They also went on the offensive with a media coverage of the 'pilots greed' in asking for more money & boldly suggests that the pilots are 'blackmailing' them.The truth is they did it to themselves.

So guys, ask yourselves if you truly want to be part of this.Or would you rather wait a while till the issues are settled.As it is, my ex-colleagues do inform me that whatever happens, the pilot shortage will still remain for the short to medium term.Even with the 'apparent' 300 cadets coming in, they will all only be online in a period of 5 years (most optimistic planning at the current rate with no expansion!).

As for us 'traitors' (this term was used by the SGMFO in a meeting with the pilots) who made the excruciatingly painful decision to venture out for a better living for our family, we will always be a 'persona non grata' to MAS even after our unflinching & unwavering loyalty to MAS :( In other words our bridges were burned the day we handed our resignation letters........ :sad: Unlike others in the professional industries (managers,CEO's etc) which are welcomed back to their former employers, pilots who work for vindictive airlines aren't accorded the same treatment.Sad, very sad indeed.

A word of caution to those who think that working in MAS through a contract agency would bypass some problems, it will unfortunately & effectively create more.Cases have happened to earlier contractees where their contract were not honoured & the agency couldn't (or is it wouldn't) do anything to 'rock the boat'.Again my sincere advice, be wary of 'strangers bearing gifts' :E

[speedtwoten]

;) yes I found the agency for expat in KL you may contact TransAsia Aviation, Mr. Azis Taufik at +60 3 31413446 jalan Sri Bayu 7. Taman Sri Bayu. Bagan Lalang. 43950 Sungai Pelek Selangor, may be they can find you job other than MAS :)

[Quietachiever]

If all of the pilots stayed in MAS and took some action they would not be in this position today. Do not blame expats for taking positions that they have greedily
left for CI, EK, Etihad, KAL.
After these guys leave then they must realise what a pack of ***** all the others are and they can't come back except on their days off.

[aspire1681]

Quietachiever

If all of the pilots stayed in MAS and took some action they would not be in this position today. Do not blame expats for taking positions that they have greedily
left for CI, EK, Etihad, KAL


You're so naive...... is either you're not within the airline community or simply your brain is below your knees.
Go n play somewhere else

[EY777]

No, he's just the brown noser reading these forums to report & curry favour to his 'bosses' :}

Then he was 'instructed' to sow the seeds of hate & confusion.Or maybe is it 'the toad' can suddenly use a computer?

[Quietachiever]

EY 777.
What you say is completely true but the world does not care about aviators.
Hope you enjoy lots of nights at Abu Shakra and some chinese takeaway.

[Quietachiever]

Pilots in MAS are not really a disadvantaged group as salaries relative to the community are quite high. Although F/O salaries could be better, if the average B744/777/A330 Captain can not afford to survive on RM 35000 per month they probably will not survive on Etihad salaries either.
Do not execute yourselves because you hate your management.

[EY777]

if the average B744/777/A330 Captain can not afford to survive on RM 35000 per month they probably will not survive on Etihad salaries either

Quietachiever, I don't know where you got this figure, suffice to say you're trying to achieve another smokescreen to dupe the public & the aviation community again.Obviously, you are oblivious to recent newspaper clippings, which in graphic form compared MAS pilots salaries to the other 'airlines'.

The correct figures should be max at rm20500.This isn't accounting for the taxes at max rate (about 30%) & other miscelannous deductions.The rm35000 a month is what the ex MAS pilots get as starting pay at Etihad my boy.& don't let me get started on the other nice perks which come standard with the tax free salary :p

Now please,go back in your playpen,check your facts before posting unless you want to discredit yourself further.Remember this is a global forum & not the 'kampung ' that you are used to. :}

[EY777]

My,my, have you just discovered this forum my dear "the toad" brown noser?What's happening?You've been slagging everybody in this forum.

Do you suddenly realised that you are about to retire & have nothing to show, & you had to be 'the toad' machai?Well my friend, sorry to hear about that.I will be sipping my JD's overlooking the gulf with my boat at the jetty & the Cayenne in the garage & think of you my friend :p

Oh well, it's not all that fun in the 'sandpit', Quietachiever I do have to worry about what I need to spend my Dirhams on........

[Quietachiever]

My dear friend. I did not leave to go to a wonderful position in Abu Dhabi. It was all your work and frankly it is not worth it. You may get upset when I question your decision to leave a perfectly good job in MAS as probably a Capt on the 777 and I know you made more than RM 20000 per month.
I know a 777 driver gets paid at least RM 28000 pm before tax. B744 drivers closer to RM 35000 before tax.

EY by name EY by nature.
Hope you enjoy the JD \'s ,the Cayenne and the family back in KL.

[aarongth]

Outlaw,
Since you asked about DHC6, some info for you. operates in Sarawak and Sabah for rural services where airports and pax load
are small. There are 5 numbers currently and ticket prices range from RM 30 to RM 100 dependeing where you fly to. DHC6 home is in Miri. The planes are old but still very nie to fly in.

[EY777]

Quietachiever,indeed you have showed your true colours.Maybe you are just egging me,but for the time being I will indulge you as long as you discredit this forum with lies.You do not know your facts of the renumeration system in MAS.Neither are your quotes for the salary figures correct.

If you have a search engine, please look into a few articles of the Malay Mail circa last 2 months.Look under MAS pilots pay.Then read it & weep.I have to say the reporter for the said article had done a through research, unlike you.

I believe you are also not familiar with the IATA code for Etihad.....it's EY just like MAS = MH. Again you show your ignorance.And again you show your naivety by stating that EY has 777's.EY will only take delivery of their 777's in October 2005.As for the family,any airline with a good track record will offer a good roof over our head at their respective base with good schooling plus good medical perks to boot.Unlike MAS medical scheme, which is not only a farce but a semi insured scheme.Imagine I used to pay a yearly amount to subsidize the scheme! :}

The joke is on you Quietachiever.You have just showed how conniving & vindictive MAS Flt Ops Mismanagers are.:mad: Btw, what's your cut in the big scheme of things?An Audi TT, E class or the 5 series Beemer? :yuk: What cheapskates you guys are!

[Brianigham]

:8 Quietachiever,

Please la brader, dont do this. You not gonna achieve anything but cause a lot of agony to a lot of people who have done you no harm.

You are talking about mas. Any Mas pilot reading this forum will recognise EY777 as the real thing and you as someone really not up to the standards( brain wise ) to fly with MAS.

I have been around for more than 10 years and take home about RM11000 per month. My batch mates who left are getting 3X the amount. Simple facts kiddo!

RM11000 is how many euros....OK OK....lets see it in USD...around 2900

So dont even start.

[speedtwoten]

:confused: Quietachiever so you see how the world spinn and the jet engine running the MH driver are looking for better and respectable salary from U$ 2900 to U$ 9000 and the Indon driver are looking from U$ 1500 to U$ 2900 no magic that's the of live, so what EY777 had is normal way of life:ok:

[triplebogey]

Quietachiever

1) Got all the facts wrong
2) not a pilot
3) sound envious of pilots
4) brown nosing for the toad
5) justifying why they taking expats now
6) in denial that they are a bunch of 'mismanagers'

Yes you are quite an achiever...brown nosing your way out of that dingy little office at complex A till getting a nice little ill gotten vehicle recently.What can i say...nice going...now go back to your brown nosing and leave us alone...you got work to do man...got some expats lifes to screw with now. Oh and its time to get rid of the moustache cos i heard your bosses complaining its ticklish..

[CAPTAIN WOOBLAH]

Quiet,

I bet you are Da' Toads minion. I have not heard this amount of dribble in years. What are you trying to pull here?????

Anybody that has ever worked in Mas will know that the figures you quoted is abseloute excrement. Do you know what that means!!!!!!

Perhaps the figures you have quoted are salaries for the rated expats Mas intends to hire directly to the wide bodies!!!!!!!!!!

We voted with our feet and there is no regrets whatsoever. I have lots of time with the family, probably much more than the poor souls working their butts off in Mas trying to cover the schedule. What you got to say to that you phoney!!!

Your best bet is to stick your head into a spinning N1 of a Trent for a haircut. :8 or go back to your stall and fry an egg

7sex and all the boys well said. The truth will prevail.

May The Force Be With You..............................

[MAStake]

Wooblah, unfortunately for all of us here in MAS, the air "force is with us."

I have oftentimes wondered how one guy could have conned so many pilots for so long. We're waking up now and voting with our feet. Toad did the same when he left the air force but his "short"-sightedness has prevented him from seeing that taking away from the pilots has only benefitted himself.

Quiet, you may think you're sucking up to Da Toad but when the time comes for you to be sacrificed you'll realise why so many MAS pilots have made the move to other airlines.

Good Luck to all who have left/will be leaving. Anything will be better than rotting here and hoping for a better deal (or even the same deal.)

[Skyline]

EY777 I truely enjoy reading your postings. I could't have said it better myself. Indeed it is the push factor and mismanagement. Classic case of the lights on but noone inI wish I could run away for a better life, unfortunately my wings are clipped. For now anyway... You have paid your dues to the airline, its time to sit back and enjoy life. Cheers!

[Brianigham]

:ooh: Oh dear ....Oh dear!

I just overheard MH #(KUL LON) with one of the new "profesional" drivers. I was on approach when I heard a radio call that was worse than some I've heard at flying school. THIS IS ON MH #. I nearly hit my head on the control column. What a shame . What a shame. MAS has to stoop so low just to protect somebody's behind.

Send them to the Otters so the guys there can come up. Do we really have any capable people calling the shots.

:{ :{ :{ :{

[power ke?]

guys,
i was an mh pilot. i've recently became a traitor. i left because i deserve better. i was a mas cadet full of enthusiasm 13 years ago. how things change. (by the way, the mapa boss back then is the flt ops boss now...yes..how things change). with my 330 bond completed, i left. it wasn't a hard decision. no one in the office asked me why i was leaving. nobody said goodbye either. people say action speaks louder than words. hopefully my action would bring some good for me also for you guys my ex colleagues back home. i know things don't look good right now. i know how you guys feel because i was there. but i decided to change it by leaving and i don't regret it one bit. remember, at the end of the day it's still just a job, and you don't really work for mas or emirates or etihad or whatever, you work for yourself and your family. you and your family deserve better. decide and good luck.

[Brianigham]

power ke?


Hmmm! betul juga tu ye! Thanks for that perspective bro. All the best in the new world.

[power ke?]

and all the best to you too my brother

[speedtwoten]

:) power ke you are absolutely right hope you will find the best for you and be happy;)

[MAStake]

Excellent choice. Go anywhere that you'll be appreciated.

Not much point in flogging a dead horse. Or even a live toad.

[Shintaro9]

Hi

Latest batch of pilots for world's airlines (this time Emirates) being "released".

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Saturday/National/20050604074005/Article/indexb_html

Cheers!

[jonjie]

Got sms'ed an invitation for a walk-in interview with MAS last week. Apparently, they didn't get their quota or didn't like what they saw..and again set up another 3 days this week, with more publicity this time. I reckon everyone from 250-hour flight instructors to retirable spray pilots came. I "almost" got seduced in coming over but after reading this thread, i have to thank you guys for saving me 50 pesos worth of photocopying and at least 200 pesos worth of gas for my car!

[rsull]

Has anyone got any more news regarding the walk in interviews in Manila? has anyone been recruited?

[longlatif]

Any walk in interviews in Malaysia coming up?

[moeen23]

Does anybody having latest info on MAS induction???

Cheers and good luck to all.