RP04 destroyed my life

[Colonel W E Kurtz]

My roster this year so far has been excrement. Many others I have spoken to are of the same opinion. I have formed the opinion that those that voted for RP04 should be dragged into the street and burned alive.

[cadence]

Good thing it's only a trial...

[Penske]

We are only 3 weeks into the year and the implementation of RP04. Is it not too early to be declaring this trial a failure?

Can you shed some light on the particulars of RP04 that are affecting you so differently than the previous rostering deal? I have been on leave and have not been affected yet.

For everyone's sake I certainly hope the bugs can be worked out.

[6feetunder]

The glaring one I see is 12 hour rest in YVR. Anything else?

[Agent Mulder]

Beware of Rostering system trials!

As background, QF initiated a trial of a Preferential Bidding system in 1986 ish and it is still going. It is the subject of much scrutiny and debate amongst the Pilot body and it appears that it will have significant changes forced upon it in the near future.

Personally I was surprised that Cathay instituted a Preferential Bidding system but on thinking about it I think I know why.

Previously all Pilots in Cathay were united against the company when it came to inefficient rostering practices. When you introduce the preferential system, the Pilots at the bottom do the !!!! and the Pilots who have been in longer get the goodies. This creates animosity and turns Pilot against Pilot. Good ploy by Cathay as previously they copped all the flak. Now they will appeal to the greed, which unfortunately exists in nearly every Airline Pilot I have ever met, to turn it into a Pilot to Pilot issue. Very clever!

Share the flying (Trips) and share the reserve and whatever you do, don’t allow a system to be introduced that creates an envy environment. It makes it extremely difficult to unite a Pilot body on rostering issues.

Want to know how difficult? Ask any QF A330 Pilot about the !!!! fight currently going on with “Integration / Interleaving” on that Aircraft type. If the Pilots shared the flying and the reserve there would be no issue. Unfortunately, some on the Aircraft see things as “Theirs”. How ridiculous, no one owns the flying except the Company.

Hasten with caution is my advice to you folks at Cathay and consider all of the consequences. Seniority exists for promotional purposes alone, not so that one bloke can have every say in his working life and another bloke has his dictated to him.

[Oasis]

Actually, my roster seems ok, maybe I got lucky. Probably depends on the fleet.

[Truth Seekers Int'nl]

nothing wrong with the rosters, good job and good money. old saying "nothing wrong with a bit of hard work", so let's get on with it . same all over the world check out Oz, Emirates,Bahrain....just accept it and get on with life, its GREAT!

[BusyB]

Usual c**p from TSI.

-400 rosters not good, based 340 rosters not good, 777 seems OK. Hopefully all will improve afterthe first few months or the trial will be rejected.

[Truth Seekers Int'nl]

so, busy bee flys all three aircraft so he would naturally be an expert on what the rosters are like. give it a rest pal, nothing wrong with the 400 roster and it's only trial time.

[kenfoggo]

BusyBee- don't bite at TSI s adolescent baiting. Almost all of his postings are inflamatory posturing, which is sad as it reduces the value of this site.

I don't think that this rostering system will ruin my life but things could be made easier with a seniority based bid system. Never going to happen.


rgds
KEN

[spleener]

TSI; Please do not assume to speak for everybody old chap... my -400 roster for JAN/FEB is worse than previous.
& no, I didn't vote for RP04 either!!!!!:}

[Truth Seekers Int'nl]

sorry spleener,should have said nothing wrong with MY 400 rosters. guess I don't have to much to complain about really. when you have been brought up doing it hard it's easy to see when you are on a good thing!

[akistar]

What is a SO usual monthly roster like? 2-3 long flights/mth?
Does anyone has a sample roster? How many days are each flight? And how many days off each time before the next flight?

Thank You

[BusyB]

TSI,
You prove your total selfishness every time you post. Anyone with any consideration for his colleagues can look at others rosters before voicing his opinion.

"You're alright, so all's well with the world"

Pratt covers it!

[shortly]

Bit of 'kettle and pot' calling going on here now.

[BusyB]

Shortly,
This thread is about RP04, contribute your roster opinions or go elsewhere to stir your pots!

[rjer]

yes please.

I would love to see a sample roster here.

Anyone?

[jacobus]

Well, I can only speak for the HKG -400 roster, however, the early prognosis would appear to be that it is b#llocks. I would particularly like to meet the genius who condoned 6 days of 12 hour reserve (all separated by min rest) with no payment , and the added attraction of being liable to be called out at any stage during that reserve period for an LAX, for example., without any penalty to the company, as we have allegedly spent the preceding 11hrs. 44 minutes having quality rest.. no kids, distractions, pile drivers, Hong Kong cab drivers etc..I'm sure you get the picture. Not even the UK CAA would have worn that one.
This RP 04 has been sold by "the ghost that walks" as allegedly giving us some control over our lifestyles...the only possible contriol on a primarily ULH fleet would be the so called super compact rosters which allow us perhaps to recover and get home occasionally...it would appear however that there are surprise, surprise, inadequate numbers of lines to achieve this therefore only the privliged few will get these, the rest of us untermensch get to pick up all the sh#t that's left..ie 72 hours of reserve a month.
I have also failed so far to meet anyone willing to profess that they voted this thing in..in addition the company seem suddenly and mysteriously very keen to achieve some form of rapprochemement and or concensus with the AOA over this; given the parlous state of the AOA membership right now, over half the workforce had no say in RP04,and therefore have to accept it as a fait accompli..it does beg the question if they are looking for some form of "whipping boy" when it all goes wrong.
Finally TSI, take a look at a Captains 'COMPACT' roster, ie what's left after failing to be given a super compact, ULH trips separated by 2 days on occasion 4..giiving up 5-4-3 was a huge mistake..imho.:{

[spleener]

Not that it's ruined MY life, but well said Jacobus!
And TSI: if your idea of fun doesn't include back to back LAX et al, you get min G-days with no 543. Oh apologies I forgot, you did it hard so I actually should prefer RP04.:8

[DITW]

TSI is ineligible to become a member of the AOA and is most probably an SO. Pretty hard to have a crap roster when all you do is ULH.

[cpdude]

The problem we now have, which was brilliantly orchestrated by the company, is we have based crew happy because they can do their 2-3 ULH flights with no recourse for the loss of 5-4-3. The loss of 5-4-3 is primarily destructive for the HK based crew.

I agree that 6 days of reserve is ridiculous. Most patterns don’t exceed 3 days so why not have rolling reserves rostered like R,R,R,O,O,O. Then the next guy could start a similar roster on your day 4 with R,R,R,O,O,O. This way they could still utilize you on your day 3 reserve for a 3-4 day pattern.

Here we have the old divide and conquer. People happy with the new RP04 will counter vote those unhappy with RP04.

[Saturn]

Guys, RP-04 is only a month old. It is gonna take, I figure six months to iron out the kinks. In two years if we don't like it, it goes back to the former roster practices. There will be some good stories and some bad. My roster really did not change at all. It will also depend on fleet and position, Capt/FO/SO/Relief etc... Give it some time.