PPLs claiming P2 hours for SEP reval
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The company I used to work for had their ops manual etc approved for multi pilot ops on a single pilot MEP.
Allegedly this actually came about as a suggestion of the CAA, as before this the company operated with one pilot and a 'safety pilot' and the CAA found out that lots of the 'safety pilots' were logging the time anyway, so they told the company that they could get their approved to fly as a multi-crew operation and if they implemented the proper training etc they could have FOs log hours.
We were LPC/OPC'd with the company and received an MPA/IR rating for the single pilot airplane.
Allegedly this actually came about as a suggestion of the CAA, as before this the company operated with one pilot and a 'safety pilot' and the CAA found out that lots of the 'safety pilots' were logging the time anyway, so they told the company that they could get their approved to fly as a multi-crew operation and if they implemented the proper training etc they could have FOs log hours.
We were LPC/OPC'd with the company and received an MPA/IR rating for the single pilot airplane.
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Know a few guys still doing it. They do both single and multi crew flights (mostly multi crew) and the CAA auditors have been trying to convince them to drop the single crew stuff as it would be safer to do it all multi crew.
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No its still going on Bose.
As long as the machine is set up for muticrew and the SOP's are set up for it They are more than happy with multicrew ops.
Now if they would be willing to except hours obtained outside a UK AOC is a different story.
I can think of 4 current UK AOC holders that are flying SPA as multi crew and the pilots are logging multicrew time.
Gamma
Directflight
Atlantic
FRA.
As long as the machine is set up for muticrew and the SOP's are set up for it They are more than happy with multicrew ops.
Now if they would be willing to except hours obtained outside a UK AOC is a different story.
I can think of 4 current UK AOC holders that are flying SPA as multi crew and the pilots are logging multicrew time.
Gamma
Directflight
Atlantic
FRA.
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The minimum crew may be one pilot, but I suppose the question is if the aeroplane as being operated as multi-crew (in accordance with the Ops Manual and with CAA approval) then the second pilot can claim P2 time?
This from Bristol Flying Centre website:
This from Bristol Flying Centre website:
Are the King Air and Citation Jet single pilot aeroplanes?
Yes, both the King Air and Citation Jet are single pilot aeroplanes. In Europe no jet can be operated public transport single crew therefore the Citation is a single pilot aircraft flown multi crew. The King Air is a turbo prop and can therefore be flown single crew however many operators are becoming 2 crew. In general terms a Captain for either aircraft will need 1500 hours total time, 500 hours multi and 50 hours on type. This is very much a general rule of thumb and will be dictated by the operators own requirements and those of their insurers.
Yes, both the King Air and Citation Jet are single pilot aeroplanes. In Europe no jet can be operated public transport single crew therefore the Citation is a single pilot aircraft flown multi crew. The King Air is a turbo prop and can therefore be flown single crew however many operators are becoming 2 crew. In general terms a Captain for either aircraft will need 1500 hours total time, 500 hours multi and 50 hours on type. This is very much a general rule of thumb and will be dictated by the operators own requirements and those of their insurers.
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Yes that's about it.
If the flight ops inspector waves his/her magic wand and deems your method of operating as multicrew and approves your manuals then the multicrew time can be logged.
The 500 hours multi is referring to multi engines not multicrew time.
The insurance requirements usually far outstrip any regulation type requirements.
Just in case any wannbies are tampering with themselves at the thought of going straight into the LHS of 1600 SHP turboprop with a CPL and a smile.
Its not normally an issue with hours acquired with a UK operator when applying for an ATPL. Rest of Europe it can get a bit sticky depending on the country they were acquired in eg Germany not a problem. Greece you might have a struggle on your hands. Outside Europe your basically stuffed.
If the flight ops inspector waves his/her magic wand and deems your method of operating as multicrew and approves your manuals then the multicrew time can be logged.
The 500 hours multi is referring to multi engines not multicrew time.
The insurance requirements usually far outstrip any regulation type requirements.
Just in case any wannbies are tampering with themselves at the thought of going straight into the LHS of 1600 SHP turboprop with a CPL and a smile.
Its not normally an issue with hours acquired with a UK operator when applying for an ATPL. Rest of Europe it can get a bit sticky depending on the country they were acquired in eg Germany not a problem. Greece you might have a struggle on your hands. Outside Europe your basically stuffed.
Last edited by mad_jock; 12th Jan 2015 at 12:37.
If it helps the original question I used to log any time that I had an instructor with me as P2 (now corrected) as in my eyes, the instructor was ultimately in command (that goes for gliding & sep).
Normally you'd be P/UT, unless they're just along for the ride, in which case you're PiC. P2 belongs in multi-crew operations.
G
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You can only claim P2 on an aircraft certified for 2 pilots. It has never been any different.
It has been different
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I have seen someone have to remove 800 hours to logging multi crew time on a AOC single crew aircraft without the required approval.
Got all a bit messy as he had moved on to a multi crew bigger biz jet with min hour restrictions from the insurance company.
Luckily he had only gone for the ATPL when there was a slot for the LHS available. So at the time of discovery he could continue working but unfortunately he couldn't go LHS.
He had though flown uninsured for two years in a 10 mill jet.
Got all a bit messy as he had moved on to a multi crew bigger biz jet with min hour restrictions from the insurance company.
Luckily he had only gone for the ATPL when there was a slot for the LHS available. So at the time of discovery he could continue working but unfortunately he couldn't go LHS.
He had though flown uninsured for two years in a 10 mill jet.
