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FIC - A Decision!

Old 10th Aug 2014, 16:31
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My understanding is that ALL FIs have the exact same privileges......one without CPL TK.....can only teach LAPL/NPPL only.
sapperkenno,
You seem to have contradicted yourself.

The privileges of an FI, and how to obtain them, are enshrined in EU Law and listed in Part-FCL. CAP804 is based on (cannot contradict) and quotes from Part-FCL.

Part-FCL Licences (certainly UK issued ones) list the privileges held on them. If a privilege is not listed then a Pilot/Instructor does not have it.

Everyone does the course, passes the FI skills test etc, then goes on to instruct. There isn't one FI course for CPL TK passes people, and one for everyone else, likewise with the skills-test.
How many different courses do you want?

What this means is an FI currently restricted to only teaching for the LAPL does not have to do the whole FI course, and take the test, again once they gain CPL level knowledge - but they would need to apply to the CAA to have the additional FI privileges (PPL, SEP) added to their Licence before exercising those instructional privileges.
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Old 10th Aug 2014, 17:08
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FIC - A Decision!

It would seem I had contradicted myself if I had said it how you quoted, but I didn't, by adding "with the exception..." that you replaced with your set of dots and then misquoted me.

What I am getting at, is not about introducing different courses/tests, but simply that a "LAPL-only" FI is for all intents and purposes the same as any other FI, does the same course and passes the same test, bar being able to teach an EASA PPL. I don't know how to describe that any simpler. All this blabbing on about SEP/SSEA ratings and making up restrictions which aren't in the legislation seems rather pointless, especially as a CRI can do some of these things, and (although I've seen nothing official) the general consensus is an FI ticket includes embedded CRI privileges?!

So (playing devils advocate) if blogs has gotten himself an FI ticket, and it doesn't contain any restrictions therein, then is it a drafting error on behalf of the CAA when they issued their ticket (surely they have a way of checking who's passed the exams) and does it mean this person isn't restricted to LAPL-only as it doesn't say so on their licence?
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Old 10th Aug 2014, 19:01
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It would seem I had contradicted myself if I had said it how you quoted, but I didn't, by adding "with the exception..." that you replaced with your set of dots and then misquoted me
You did state ALL (in big letters) which means there shouldn't be any exceptions. You pointed out one but there are, in fact many.

What I am getting at, is not about introducing different courses/tests, but simply that a "LAPL-only" FI is for all intents and purposes the same as any other FI
But they are not.

I don't know how to describe that any simpler. All this blabbing on about SEP/SSEA ratings and making up restrictions which aren't in the legislation seems rather pointless
But THEY ARE in the legislation.

Ignoring stand alone CRIs, IRI,s TRIs, etc for a moment - Think of an FI Rating as the minimum basic foundation required to do any instruction at all.
What an FI is actually allowed to instruct for depends on what additional qualifications they hold. The exact Instructional Privileges an FI holds will be listed on an EASA Licence on Page 4 in the Remarks and Restrictions column next to where it says an FI is held.

Since the legislation says an FI holder without CPL level knowledge will be restricted to only teaching for an LAPL then that will (or should) be annotated in the Remarks and Restrictions column.

If such an Instructor wishes to instruct for the SEP Rating then either they will have to gain the CPL level knowledge to remove the 'LAPL only' restriction from their FI Rating (actually remove it from Privilege a) and add Privilege b)) or apply for a separate, stand alone, SEP CRI rating.
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Old 10th Aug 2014, 19:46
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FIC - A Decision!

My brain hurts...
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Old 10th Aug 2014, 20:05
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that was exactly my POV when I did my last instructor renewal.

SLMG, TMG and all the other "things"

thankfully I only did a couple of NPL's and the rest were all normal JAR PPL's.

its no wonder your normal private pilot is somewhat confused with all the different license and rating types. I don't have a clue either just know I have an ATPL with a SEP and IMC (although that going to be something different.) and a couple of multicrew IR's types.

Seems to be the further away you are from ATPL the more confusing it gets.

Good job there isn't an exam in the FIC and instructor renewal about all the different flavours available. Their would be an instructor shortage pretty quick.
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Old 10th Aug 2014, 22:21
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A valid Pilot's Licence (including valid Medical) entitles the holder to act as a Pilot.
Does this mean they can legally fly any aeroplane they want?
No. They also need to be qualified to fly a particular aircraft by holding a valid relevant Class or Type Rating, and also possibly requiring Differences Training to be have been signed off.

A valid FI entitles the holder to Instruct.
Does this mean they can legally instruct for anything they want?
No. They also need to be qualified to give a type of instruction by holding the relevant Instructional Privilege.

What's the difference?

Good job there isn't an exam in the FIC and instructor renewal about all the different flavours available. Their would be an instructor shortage pretty quick.
During an FIC the candidate certainly should be taught, and quized on, the Instructional Privileges they are attempting to have granted. For every Renewal an FI will need to attend either a Seminar or a Test with an FIE (possibly both). Instructor requirements and Privileges should be reviewed at these (even if not tested).
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Old 17th Sep 2014, 11:02
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FIC Decision made!

Hi all,

A couple of months ago i posted about doing a FIC - usual questions about age, experience, opportunities etc.

Got some excellent replies, all helpful, some sobering but none unsupportive. Following that and a highly tolerant family I am now ploughing my way through CPL Ground School with GTS and despite having to squeeze it all in with my 'normal' job I am enjoying every minute of it.

A long way to go but determined to get there.

Just wanted to say a big thanks to all who responded
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