Flying Instructors & ExaminersA place for instructors to communicate with one another because some of them get a bit tired of the attitude that instructing is the lowest form of aviation, as seems to prevail on some of the other forums!
examiners exercising their privileges outside their state oF licence issue
Don't we have enough paperwork to fill in and/or rules to follow.
Now if I have to take the LPC of someone who does not have the same state of license issue, I need to get the approval of that state to be able to do his LPC.
In my company our pilots have license which are issued from all european countries, it's going to be a nightmare to ask every state to be approved to do the exam. Even if this is only a one time brief, that's going to be impossible to follow and probably adding an extra fee every time !
i thought that it was working perfectly within the JAA system (At least at a TRE level for LPC on MPA), you just needed to know which license you could revalidate yourself by signing it and those who did not allow it.
Now if I have to take the LPC of someone who does not have the same state of license issue, I need to get the approval of that state to be able to do his LPC.
It's always been like that. It is up to the NAA whether they will accept another states JAA Examiner. Our company employs pilots from all over Europe and I have to secure permission from many NAA's to conduct tests. I have never been refused but don't take it for granted that they will accept.
Be interesting to see if it actually changes under EASA but I doubt it despite the promises of everything being joined up.
There is a charge now for authorising none UK TRE's/exminors which I expect the other authorities will also be doing.
It has for years been cheaper for some nationalities to get there checks done in other states due to the expense of getting a local to do it.
Also as well it will stop folk going to second countrys for type ratings unless the TRTO/customer stumps up for the authorisation fee. Before you just need to send the sim cert and examinor paper work and they would issue the TR.
Maybe its to stop pilots migrating to one authority which costs the least. I know alot of swedish pilots converted to the UK purely because every time they did a check it didn't cost them anything were as at home it would have cost them 400-500 euro to just get it entered on thier license. ATPL upgrades were done with a company TRE and were a paper work exercise where as at home it was a seperate sim session with a state examinor and cost a fortune.
Bose-X, I never had to ask for permission to perform a check from a different NAA. our standard team had a look at it and specify what I could or could not do, for instance sign or not the license and that was it.
Think about company like CAE, Flightsafety which employs UK examiner and do training and checking on all the european countries pilots. If they have to sent all their SFE/TRE to each different EASA country to receive a briefing, do you imagine the price of it or if they have to pay a fee to get it authorize, do you imagine the cost.
Looks like EASA did one more big **** up again, not listening or asking the people doing the job!
So I heard that CAE, FSI, .... are not going to do it. and if EASA disagree they will stop doing any checks until it is sorted out. we will see how that works !
As Mj says, thats exactly what we have always done.
Send a copy of the Examiner certificate and when I do a test enclose a copy with the paperwork.
As I said, we have never been refused but it is entirely up to an NAA whether the accept an overseas examiner or not. It is a simple curtesy to do so and is easy enough to do. It's amazing how playing the game reaps benefits further down the road!!!
Quote:
So I heard that CAE, FSI, .... are not going to do it. and if EASA disagree they will stop doing any checks until it is sorted out. we will see how that works !
Ah yes, the old cutting your nose off to spite your face ploy!!!
Like I said, I don't know what the landscape is going to look like under EASA, until I do I will continue on the way we have being doing things.
The new fee in the scheme of charges is for a non-UK authorised examiner/instructor who wishes to examine/instruct in the UK. It says nothing about a non-UK authorised examiner wishing to examine the holder of a UK issued licence outside the UK.
This clearly stems from FCL.1015(c)
Quote:
Holders of an examiner certificate shall not conduct skill tests, proficiency checks or assessments of competence of an applicant for which the competent authority is not the same that issued the examiner’s certificate, unless:
(1) they have informed the competent authority of the applicant of their intention to conduct the skill test, proficiency check or assessment of competence and of the scope of their privileges as examiners;
(2) they have received a briefing from the competent authority of the applicant on the elements mentioned in (b)(3).
Unfortunately (or not) the Authority have not thought through the wording of the schedule and so while non-UK authorised examiners wishing to examine the holder of a UK licence outside the UK will have to comply with FCL.1015(c), they are not subject to the fee.
Under EASA (i.e. from 1 July 2012), UK authorised examiners wishing to examine candidates who do not have the UK as their competent authority will have to comply with FCL.1015(c). Note that there is no requirement to obtain the approval of the competent authority, merely to inform them
Examiners are supposed to receive a briefing from the authority. I don't think the UK will do that freely.
Let's hope that some common sense remain in those people and they will sort out something like a Powerpoint presentation showing the paperwork required to exam such people. And that once you have done it, you won't have to do it every time you are going to do a LPC on someone.
I conduct LPCs on pilots with licences from Sweden, Denmark, Holland and Germany (apart from the majority from UK) and my rights vary. All allow an LPC by a UK JAR TRE, though Germany requires their LPC form to be filled in. Sweden and Denmark allow me to sign the licences, but the others do not, however Sweden won't let me sign a licence after a renewal - only a revalidation. It will be interesting to see how things change - if they do - after next month!
examiners exercising their privileges outside their state oF licence issue
