John Farley's new book
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Nozzle angle
Hello John,
Re. the scale on the nozzle lever, may I ask did you ever use that for your steep climb take-offs from the hover ? I got the impression it was done by 'seat of the pants' instinct.
Another Test Pilot asked a Flight Test Engineer to monitor the nozzle angle readings on the fuselage side compared to those in the cockpit - I wondered how accurate the painters were who put the markings on, and how much it mattered anyway with such pitch control and all the variables - that was before a series of late FRS2, generally heavily loaded short ski ramp tests though.
I don't know if you're aware, but there was a sort of urban myth among groundcrew that you did those take-offs with one hand on the seat handle; even I could see the flaw in that theory, as you apparently needed three hands already !
Andy
Re. the scale on the nozzle lever, may I ask did you ever use that for your steep climb take-offs from the hover ? I got the impression it was done by 'seat of the pants' instinct.
Another Test Pilot asked a Flight Test Engineer to monitor the nozzle angle readings on the fuselage side compared to those in the cockpit - I wondered how accurate the painters were who put the markings on, and how much it mattered anyway with such pitch control and all the variables - that was before a series of late FRS2, generally heavily loaded short ski ramp tests though.
I don't know if you're aware, but there was a sort of urban myth among groundcrew that you did those take-offs with one hand on the seat handle; even I could see the flaw in that theory, as you apparently needed three hands already !
Andy
Per Ardua ad Astraeus
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00 - you may recall there was a fantastic picture in a paper of an RAF Harrier ejection in Cyprus while attempting to emulate JF's party piece, and forgetting that if you nozzled below 20deg (I think it was) you 'lorst the puffers' and that was NOT a good idea.
Do a Hover - it avoids G
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yakker.
Very much so. Great pity. Page 240 para three mentions when I went past 20deg one day (quite right on the angle BOAC) and with a little back movement on the lever all became sweetness and light again.
00
Yes it was a seat of the pants job. Very easy like that. If you felt you were accelerating forward then more back stick was needed and if you felt you were accelerating backwards then more nozzle was needed. All so much easier to do than write about.
The nozzle angle scale painted on the fuselage side side was a useful cross check between the cockpit nozzle angle gauge indication and the nozzle angle scale alongside the throttle box. However it would be wrong in my view to suggest that a few degrees of error in any nozzle angle used was going to have much effect the way the aircraft flew with two exceptions. One being the angle used to hover as this needed to be right or the fuselage attitude would be outside the range that suited the undercarriage on a VL and the other was the 20 deg we have mentioned.
Urban myths are just that?
JF
Very much so. Great pity. Page 240 para three mentions when I went past 20deg one day (quite right on the angle BOAC) and with a little back movement on the lever all became sweetness and light again.
00
Yes it was a seat of the pants job. Very easy like that. If you felt you were accelerating forward then more back stick was needed and if you felt you were accelerating backwards then more nozzle was needed. All so much easier to do than write about.
The nozzle angle scale painted on the fuselage side side was a useful cross check between the cockpit nozzle angle gauge indication and the nozzle angle scale alongside the throttle box. However it would be wrong in my view to suggest that a few degrees of error in any nozzle angle used was going to have much effect the way the aircraft flew with two exceptions. One being the angle used to hover as this needed to be right or the fuselage attitude would be outside the range that suited the undercarriage on a VL and the other was the 20 deg we have mentioned.
Urban myths are just that?
JF
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Yakker - of course, but in order to do that one needs to know what one has done to cause the problem in the first place! I suggest any 'ordinary' bona jet mate faced with a rapidly down pitching nose at around 100' in the hover might just also pull the handle (and then there's JF....
)
We did, of course, all absorb the expensive lessons from that accident.
)We did, of course, all absorb the expensive lessons from that accident.
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I went to the Flyer Bonus Day at Duxford yesterday to hear the excellent lecture given by John Farley. Thanks John for giving a very informative talk and signing my book. I could have listened to you for another couple hours!
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Yet another thanks to JF
I recently purchased John's book, and just wanted to add my thanks for one of the very best aviation books I have ever read (and I've been reading them since John started flying VTOL!)
Really excellent, a great mix of anecdotes, piloting notes and excellent explanations of a wide range of subjects.
I too was surprised and very pleased to find my copy had been signed by John. I'm not lending it to anyone, but will recommend it to everyone.
Really excellent, a great mix of anecdotes, piloting notes and excellent explanations of a wide range of subjects.
I too was surprised and very pleased to find my copy had been signed by John. I'm not lending it to anyone, but will recommend it to everyone.
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More J.F.
Chancros,
If you peruse a decent newsagent ( i.e, with plenty of aviation magazines ) you'll find J.F. has started doing a regular column for one; easy to spot as they wisely mention him !
I've started reading it regularly for just that reason ( I had the honour of working for John in a small way; later bosses have had a very rough time measuring up... ) - and mailed the magazine in question to tell them just that, as a bit of feedback.
Mods; if this is any transgression, and I hope not, it is entirely mine, John is unaware I'm posting this and I hope not embarassed.
If you peruse a decent newsagent ( i.e, with plenty of aviation magazines ) you'll find J.F. has started doing a regular column for one; easy to spot as they wisely mention him !
I've started reading it regularly for just that reason ( I had the honour of working for John in a small way; later bosses have had a very rough time measuring up... ) - and mailed the magazine in question to tell them just that, as a bit of feedback.
Mods; if this is any transgression, and I hope not, it is entirely mine, John is unaware I'm posting this and I hope not embarassed.
Last edited by Double Zero; 4th Sep 2009 at 01:26.
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Thanks Ghengis,
Though I think it's possible we're talking about 2 different magazines; I have seen articles by John in a certain magazine over the years, but now a rather more ' military ' based publication is making much of a new format bolstered by an interview with John, now followed by a regular column by him ( which judging by the heading and proposed subects covered, sounds like it will be both informative and amusing ) !
Whatever, I suggest anyone interested makes haste to the newsagent, as the latest copy of the mag' I'm referring to has a photo' & caption of John as an inset on the front cover, so is easy to spot !
Though I think it's possible we're talking about 2 different magazines; I have seen articles by John in a certain magazine over the years, but now a rather more ' military ' based publication is making much of a new format bolstered by an interview with John, now followed by a regular column by him ( which judging by the heading and proposed subects covered, sounds like it will be both informative and amusing ) !
Whatever, I suggest anyone interested makes haste to the newsagent, as the latest copy of the mag' I'm referring to has a photo' & caption of John as an inset on the front cover, so is easy to spot !
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John Farley Magazine column - it's too cryptic for me. Living outside UK I can probably get said magazine if I know which one or ones (? 2 diff mags).
Can someone PM me with a clearer hint as to the magazine Mr Farley has a column in (so long as this doesn't contravene rules or PPRUNE etiquet)?
Much appreciated
John
Can someone PM me with a clearer hint as to the magazine Mr Farley has a column in (so long as this doesn't contravene rules or PPRUNE etiquet)?
Much appreciated
John
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Hello John,
It seems the magazine I'm referring to is being a tad naughty in making it all seem a new thing; then again it suits all of us who somehow missed it the first time round !
I have occasionally seen articles by yourself in a more GA oriented magazine too...
As long as you get 'repeat fees' or whatever and aren't being fiddled ( I'd think that unlikely ) it suits we punters just fine !
There is the bonus that the mag' I was originally referring to, the more military one, has revamped itself and has a lot of other good in depth stuff too.
I still feel it's a little bit of a cheat making it out that you've suddenly burst into print for them, but I and others will enjoy reading it, and I suppose that's just the publishing business...
It seems the magazine I'm referring to is being a tad naughty in making it all seem a new thing; then again it suits all of us who somehow missed it the first time round !
I have occasionally seen articles by yourself in a more GA oriented magazine too...
As long as you get 'repeat fees' or whatever and aren't being fiddled ( I'd think that unlikely ) it suits we punters just fine !
There is the bonus that the mag' I was originally referring to, the more military one, has revamped itself and has a lot of other good in depth stuff too.
I still feel it's a little bit of a cheat making it out that you've suddenly burst into print for them, but I and others will enjoy reading it, and I suppose that's just the publishing business...
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Is Mr Farley's book "A view from the hover" still available ?
None in Amazon.co.uk it seems and certainly none in Singapore where I live. Have contacted a few bookshops but no joy.
I would be grateful for any pointers please.
Thank you.
K
None in Amazon.co.uk it seems and certainly none in Singapore where I live. Have contacted a few bookshops but no joy.
I would be grateful for any pointers please.
Thank you.
K
Last edited by kluge; 4th Feb 2011 at 06:01.
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Many thanks Ian - ordered a copy this morning and I gather it is already in the post! 
Tabs please !
This book has been on my wish list for some time, is the 2nd edition an expanded version ?