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Old 2nd August 2001, 20:30   #1 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: ME
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Post OZ domestic fuel reserves.

Would you mind explaining the Australian Domestic Fuel policy to me,

I was looking through some paperwork which stated:

> Diversion = 45 mins continued cruise
> Hold = 60 mins at max endurance
> Cont = 15% of block fuel.

Under the FAR rules, we only need to consider:

> Diversion to closest Alternate
> Hold = 45 mins

Why do you have to carry so much fuel?

Thanks.

Mutt
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Old 3rd August 2001, 12:33   #2 (permalink)
Capt EFIS
 
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Our fuel requirements in Australia are found in CAR 234 and CAAP 234-1.

Companies will have their own fuel policy but in general, a charter operator (piston) must carry:

On top of flight and alternate fuel:
Fixed Reserves: 45 min at holding rate (1500ft above aerodrome)
Variable Reserves: 15% of flight and alternate fuel
Holding: as required by wx / traffic etc. conditions.

From your info, I can't only assume that on that flight, the aircraft had to plan for an alternate aerodrome that was 45 min away, where the wx conditions had a TEMPO or 60min holding.

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Old 3rd August 2001, 14:57   #3 (permalink)
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After flying in the CARIBBEAN and Central America. I have concluded that AUSTRALIA is the only country thats has TEMPOS AND INTERS in their forecast system. Are there any other expats out there who agree, or am I wrong?
Basically Mutt I suggest going to www.casa.gov.au look up legislation. And then look the quoted CAR and CAAPS from the above response.

Regards
Sheep

[ 03 August 2001: Message edited by: Sheep Guts ]
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Old 3rd August 2001, 22:43   #4 (permalink)
 
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Thank you gentlemen, the information is appreciated. I will check out the CASA site.

Mutt
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Old 4th August 2001, 12:45   #5 (permalink)
 
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Tempos are an icao standard and can be seen on just about any taf worldwide. Inters on the other hand are peculiar to OZ, at least for now.
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Old 4th August 2001, 15:17   #6 (permalink)
 
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Mutt,
Typical jet RPT/Charter min fuel would be,

Taxi/take-off fuel
+
Flight Fuel (which is from 1500' on departure to 1500' at desto and on to 1500' ovrhd Alternate if required)
+
Variable Reserve= 10% of FF
+
Fixed Reserve = 30 minutes
+
Approach & landing

Given that the fuel flows they dictate for calculating FR are often unrealistic, do you really burn the same rate at 1500' as in crz?, I think the carrying of the 10% for the diversion is good and I've used the entire VR more than once.
It seems the only difference is the VR applied to the diversion fuel.

Chuck.

Edited because typing in the UBB code didn't work!!

[ 04 August 2001: Message edited by: Chimbu chuckles ]
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Old 12th August 2001, 13:04   #7 (permalink)
 
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Wantok,

I am confused:
Quote:
Given that the fuel flows they dictate for calculating FR are often unrealistic, do you really burn the same rate at 1500' as in crz?, I think the carrying of the 10% for the diversion is good and I've used the entire VR more than once.
It seems the only difference is the VR applied to the diversion fuel.
What has the start of climb altitude and end of descent altitude got to do with cruise fuel flow?

As I understand it, the Oz 10% variable is made up of 5% for met variations (same as FAA/JAA) and 5% for aircraft variations, the latter being something of a catch-all because very few operators have valid aircraft performance decrement measurement systems.
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Old 12th August 2001, 13:36   #8 (permalink)
 
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FWIW

The Aussie fuel regulations were founded on the "sub-divide and conquer" principle. i.e. the regs basically only say that you must carry 'an appropriate quantitiy of fuel for the flight', without giving a further regulatory definition (remember, the CAAP's are not strictly legally binding, though they do provide 'expert advice'). This paves the way essentially for each and every company in Australia to have it's own interpretation of 'appropriate quantity' via the legally binding fuel policy pages in each individual ops manual (take a close look, its surprising how much this can sometimes vary between all manner of GA and bigger companies).
So, Mutt, strictly speaking, there is no Australia wide fuel policy, but as a generalisation the CAAP's (Civil Aviation Advisory Publication) usually hold true with:
Fixed reserve: 45 min
Variable reserve: 10% for turbine, 15% for piston
extra holding as required by weather, traffic notam (eg 20 mins for most of us @ SY, differs at different airports at different times), etc.
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Old 12th August 2001, 15:30   #9 (permalink)
 
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Download the Guidelines for Aircraft Fuel Requirements from the CASA web site.

SUMMARY

Aeroplanes

Piston:

Fixed Reserve: 45 minutes
Variable Reserve: 15%

Turbine or JET:

Fixed Reserve: 30 minutes
Variable Reserve: 10%

Helicopters

Fixed Reserve VFR: 20 minutes (VFR) & 30 minutes (IFR)
Variable Reserve - PVT & AWK: Nil
Variable Reserve - RPT & CHTR: 15%


As lackov said, the CAAPs are not legally binding. However, if you want your Operations Manual approved with a fuel policy that is not compliant with the 'expert' CAAP recommendations, be prepared to surrender sufficient operational documentation and working evidence to CASA to prove that your company fuel policy is adequate.

In the light of operational experience (particularly with regular freight or RPT) you will soon determine exactly how much fuel is required for a particular operation.
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Old 12th August 2001, 17:05   #10 (permalink)
 
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The very broard interpretation of the CAAP is:


"don't run out of fuel"
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Old 12th August 2001, 20:38   #11 (permalink)
 
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Once again, thank you. Unfortunately I cant get into why I want this info, but I most certainly appreciate all the input.

4-dogs,
We used to have a valid aircraft performance decrement measurement system on some of our older Boeing aircraft. They were called Flight Engineers!

As for your question What has the start of climb altitude and end of descent altitude got to do with cruise fuel flow?

Under the regulations (FAA), you are obliged to have 30 minute International/45 minute Domestic fuel reserve for hold at 1,500 feet. However the regulations do not say what this fuel flow should be based on. You may find that it is generally acceptable to use the fuel flow for a normal cruise level for this time period.

The same applies for the 10% contingency fuel, using computer flight plans, this fuel is based on the fuel flow for the last two segments prior to the top of descent, this relates to the lowest fuel flow.

Mutt
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Old 12th August 2001, 21:13   #12 (permalink)
shakespeare
 
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Hi there Mutt. I think you will find most domestic jet airlines and regionals in Oz will have a 30 min fixed reserve, and a 10% variable reserve policy. The variable reserve can legally be used . Therefore you only have to land with the 30 min fixed reserve. Anything less than this constitutes a fuel emergency. As stated, this is based on a hold at 1,500 feet above the airfield. In VMC conditions, there is no requirement to carry alternate fuel, hence they don't.

If you want to see some pilots carry buckets of fuel around for no good reason, go to Europe. In some cases it is mind boggling.

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Old 21st August 2001, 20:35   #13 (permalink)
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Red face

Mutt,

Sorry mate, I was just querying what CC was actually saying.

I don't think that there is any doubt about how the Fixed Reserve is expected to be calculated - there should be a stated holding configuration and there should be matching fuel consumption data, hence the quanta is easily determined. Generally, this is manufacturer's data but can be properly derived operator data - it is not normally dictated by the regulator. I couldn't fathom who CC's "they" was.

I could not (and still cannot) see how cruise fuel flows would get a look in for calculating FR.

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