Carson Air SA226 Metroliner (cargo) missing between YVR and YXS
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Carson Air SA226 Metroliner (cargo) missing between YVR and YXS
Search expanded for missing plane Carson Air Flight 66 from Vancouver to Prince George - British Columbia - CBC News
Missing since this morning, last radar contact somewhere in the hills north of Vancouver. 2 POB.
Missing since this morning, last radar contact somewhere in the hills north of Vancouver. 2 POB.
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Wreckage located north of Mount Seymour in Needle Mountain area. SAR is on site, 1/2 hr of daylight left now.
http://www.news1130.com/2015/04/13/d...ight-66-found/
http://www.news1130.com/2015/04/13/d...ight-66-found/
Last edited by Grizzz; 14th Apr 2015 at 02:50. Reason: added news link
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In Canada - the SA226 is not authorized to fly single pilot.
Sad day. The outcome is not good. The area they went down in is nothing but steep cliffs, trees, and small narrow valleys. No place to set down at all.
Sad day. The outcome is not good. The area they went down in is nothing but steep cliffs, trees, and small narrow valleys. No place to set down at all.
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Quote: In Canada - the SA226 is not authorized to fly single pilot.
The SA226TC is certified in Canada under FAA type certificate A8SW and is certified for single pilot operation.
Carson Air operates theirs with two pilots.
The SA226TC is certified in Canada under FAA type certificate A8SW and is certified for single pilot operation.
Carson Air operates theirs with two pilots.
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Carson Air Flight 66 fell from sky in uncontrolled descent
Carson Air Flight 66 fell from sky in uncontrolled descent - British Columbia - CBC News
The plane was not equipped with cockpit voice or flight data recording systems.
Carson Air Flight 66 fell from sky in uncontrolled descent - British Columbia - CBC News
A cargo plane that crashed in Vancouver's North Shore Mountains yesterday fell from the sky in an uncontrolled descent, the Transportation Safety Board said Tuesday at a news conference.
(All) indications are the two pilots suddenly lost control of the aircraft, dropping from an altitude of 2,400 metres to about 900 metres — the height at which the wreckage was found — in less than a minute...
"The radar track showed a very steep descent," he said. "The crew did not call, declare an emergency or have any stress, which gives us an idea that whatever happened, happened suddenly. The radar track gives us information on how fast it was descending ... and that is consistent with uncontrolled flight."
(All) indications are the two pilots suddenly lost control of the aircraft, dropping from an altitude of 2,400 metres to about 900 metres — the height at which the wreckage was found — in less than a minute...
"The radar track showed a very steep descent," he said. "The crew did not call, declare an emergency or have any stress, which gives us an idea that whatever happened, happened suddenly. The radar track gives us information on how fast it was descending ... and that is consistent with uncontrolled flight."
Without wishing to preempt the official investigation, the Metro had a problem with wheel bay fires causing structural failure at the wing root. Aircraft have been lost before due to this.
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Would be strange to lose control due to icing after just 23 min. of flight without the crew noticing how bad things were and attempting to return to the a/p. Not saying it couldn't happen.. we almost lost a Bandeirante climbing out of Geneva one bad night back in the 90s and that was only 15 min after departure but that had a far less capable climb performance than the Metro.
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As a reader who is resident of the area and weather-conscious, can say that icing may have been an issue but winds probably not. After a long spell of mild, dry weather we have seen a few snowfalls on those "hills" (mountains really) and for the past three days the snow line has been at about 700 metres above sea level. From what I recall of weather conditions on the morning of the crash, there was probably a lot of cloud between 500 metres and flight level, at least moderate icing but probably nothing unusual in terms of wind or unstable convective cloud. However, that very rapid descent rate does sound like in-flight breakup more than an icing problem, in which case I don't know if icing could have contributed to the break-up if that proves to be the case.
At the buffet of death ,you can only put so much on your plate before you are full.
If you are iced up ,an aircraft does not need much turbulence before you are a test pilot .
The icing that you can experience in a Pacific warm front can quickly exceed the capability of any aircraft. Add some bumps to that from an outflow and it can get confusing as the tail can stall out .Add the venturi effect to the barometric instruments and it does not take long to confuse or kill even an experienced pilot.
Flying into a "low pressure valley "created by high winds and your altimeter will indicate a climb even if you are descending. A low level jet will give a similar mind fcuk ,if you are caught in the downdraught of a severe local low pressure area .The GPS altitude will be indicating a descent and the Altimeter will be indicating a climb, add ice and it is way more than most pilots are trained or ready for. The indications can be thousands of feet off depending on intensity of the local low created by local winds.
If a pilot is trying to stop the false indication of a climb he may descend into the hill ,in a vain attempt to keep the correct altitude.
If you are lucky you might see the hill before you hit it.
And some pilots wonder why I ask them how to find the GPS altitude feature on the GPS for flights in mountainous areas.
It is one tool you should be using if you notice any large change in groundspeed near big hills.
If you are iced up ,an aircraft does not need much turbulence before you are a test pilot .
The icing that you can experience in a Pacific warm front can quickly exceed the capability of any aircraft. Add some bumps to that from an outflow and it can get confusing as the tail can stall out .Add the venturi effect to the barometric instruments and it does not take long to confuse or kill even an experienced pilot.
Flying into a "low pressure valley "created by high winds and your altimeter will indicate a climb even if you are descending. A low level jet will give a similar mind fcuk ,if you are caught in the downdraught of a severe local low pressure area .The GPS altitude will be indicating a descent and the Altimeter will be indicating a climb, add ice and it is way more than most pilots are trained or ready for. The indications can be thousands of feet off depending on intensity of the local low created by local winds.
If a pilot is trying to stop the false indication of a climb he may descend into the hill ,in a vain attempt to keep the correct altitude.
If you are lucky you might see the hill before you hit it.
And some pilots wonder why I ask them how to find the GPS altitude feature on the GPS for flights in mountainous areas.
It is one tool you should be using if you notice any large change in groundspeed near big hills.
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TSB says plane likely broke up in flight.
Plane that crashed in North Vancouver may have broken up in flight: TSB | News1130
Plane that crashed in North Vancouver may have broken up in flight: TSB | News1130
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One small question in this tragedy...
Reports say it was 25 minutes (6:43-7:08 am) between take-off and loss from radar. While the maps show the distance covered to be ~25 nm, even allowing for a curved flight path.
Is that simply confusion between "left the ramp" and "left the ground" - or am I missing something that would involve a Metroliner travelling only 60 knots, net ground speed?
Reports say it was 25 minutes (6:43-7:08 am) between take-off and loss from radar. While the maps show the distance covered to be ~25 nm, even allowing for a curved flight path.
Is that simply confusion between "left the ramp" and "left the ground" - or am I missing something that would involve a Metroliner travelling only 60 knots, net ground speed?
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According to FlightAware's track data, the actual takeoff time was around 7:02am PDT, and radar contact was lost around 7:08am PDT -- so only approx. 6 minutes of flight time before the accident.
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FlightAware certainly does not have direct access to Canadian radar data. They use ADS-B info from different sources including commercial satellite tracking services. There is a lot of trafic FlightAware does not see and some we don't see simply because our radar system does not subscribe to FlightAware's ADS-B network.
So DaveReidUK is correct in saying that FlightAware data doesn't mean radar contact or radar service from ATC.
So DaveReidUK is correct in saying that FlightAware data doesn't mean radar contact or radar service from ATC.
