Given the relative “lack of teeth” that ACAS actually has, if British Airways walks away from talks, staff will seethe at their union leaders for not getting a better deal – of course, the truth is that these union leaders don’t always represent the wishes of those they claim to be standing up for and will only have themselves to blame when mutiny hits home as British Airways runs out of money to pay for their whimsical demands.
Speaking with Virgin staff today, they were telling me that they are on course to match BA's loss of 400 million this year. I'm sure the wooly pully will massgae and hide the figures cometh the time to look better than BA. I haven't heard any of them say that geting rid of their top managers will solve the economic crisis though !
The A-Scale Union Reps are expecting to be at ACAS this coming Wednesday, and appear confident of a positive outcome for both sides. This from people who already underwent huge changes with the move to T5.
Meanwhile, bassa buys a new hat and goes to the races .....
Welcome and thankyou for being so bold as to say you will cross with us. Do you think we need a slogan - what about
Proud to work for BA - Proud to cross the Picket Line?
Nutjob you are so right - there are many, many more like us but as has already been said, it is SOOOO difficult, nay impossible, to make your voice heard above the militant chants. Not because the militants present any real argument or debate, but purely because they resort to name calling and threats of physical abuse. The BASSA and CrewForum websites and even now are own ESS site are truly frightening places. Arthur Scargill would be proud!
The many thousands of us that do not agree with the childish and bullying tactics, are simply lying low and waiting for the chance to cast our vote.
They are claiming on the Bully Forums that WW has somehow lost the plot and doesn't know what he is doing! However, here are just some of the hypocrisies of the BASSA hierarchy:
Proposed Temporary Solutions Only --- then offered permanent ones
Proposed "Say No to Mixed Fleet" --- then offered 767 to SH for...mixed flying
Slated Pilots Offer --- then offered the exact same for Cabin Crew
The list goes on....
There is only one side in all of this that is behaving like a headless chicken.....and it ain't WW.
Similarly has BASSA provided a cost breakdown to prove their claimed savings? Perhaps if both sides submitted their proposal and breakdown to an independent auditor then there could be no partisanship in play and crew can make up their own minds.
Coming at your questions as one who accepts that change is needed:
Quote:
Are you happy and prepared to accept the BA proposals in their entirety?
I am happier overall with the BA proposals than with those put forward by the unions.
I am prepared to accept more of the BA proposals than I would those put forward by the unions.
Quote:
Have BA provided you with all the information you require on the financial impact of the changes to your salary?
Not yet. Neither have the unions. What BA has done though, is to communicate with me in a calm, collected and respectful manner, offer explanations, asked my opinion as an individual, and remain open to questioning.
Quote:
Is your decision truely informed?
I went through the last little spat very uninformed, or illinformed even. Not this time round. Postings here, and on other forums (some seen by myself, others only reported to me) suggest that a large number of CC are where I was the last time.
Don't think there is any malingering here; boy, is it hot!
The other day I had to deliberately walk under the
shade across O'Henry street in downtown Dublin.
Are you happy and prepared to accept the BA proposals in their entirety?
There is certainly room for negotiation, as I have already stated. However, as they stand the proposals are not the death warrant that CC are making out and IF push comes to shove, I will accept in their entirety.
Quote:
Have BA provided you with all the information you require on the financial impact of the changes to your salary?
The only financial impact on my salary arises from the proposed Fixed Monthly Duty Payment. The amount of this has to be agreed between BA and Unite, therefore BA do not yet have all the information. Additionally, it was stated clearly yesterday on the live chat that this is still an option and BA are happy to leave the status quo on this. So, yes, I have all the information that is available at the moment.
Quote:
Is your decision truely informed?
Yes I believe it is. If you feel I have overlooked something then please say. I certainly believe it is far more informed than the theory that "BA just want to smash the Unions" which is nothing more than BASSA rhetoric to wind up the members to achieve their own agenda.
Are you happy and prepared to accept the BA proposals in their entirety?
Of course no one will be happy! Why would anyone be happy to cut back on anything?
You think the pilots are "happy" to take a pay cut and work harder? of course not.
The thing is that many cabin crew just "don't get it", the fact that the savings MUST be made and are NON NEGOTIABLE that is.
Six months ago pilots thought it was rubbish, everything is "negotiable" after all, it took a long detailed review by BALPA before they realised that the savings were indeed required and the figure was indeed "non negotiable".
Thereafter BALPA spent 3 months working out how best to make those savings.
Cabin crew all voted no to ANY savings, at least BASSA now realises that savings must be made hence their own "£173million" proposal.
Touble is it's no good because of all the wasted months.
Please tell me why many crew are still yet to grasp the concept of recession/financial difficulty/need for cuts even at this stage?
Is it lack of intelligence or stubborness?
A lot of us just don't get why you don't get it.
Edited..... just reading the last few posts it would seem a lot of crew do "get it" I guess some do and some don't, just which is the majority?
Last edited by plodding along : 4th July 2009 at 16:20.
Please tell me why many crew are still yet to grasp the concept of recession/financial difficulty/need for cuts even at this stage?
Is it lack of intelligence or stubborness or the result of being spoilt for years.
I think that's a little unfair - I know if BALPA were telling us the savings are not required and BA are being opportunist - we would believe them, after all this was our view a few months back.
Bassa has failed its members by not reviewing the companys accounts and to use PC767's words is not truely informed.
It was, sorry. It's just so frustrating to see so many people angry at the company and management when we should all be pulling together to get out of this mess.
Yes there were fines, yes there was a T5 mess up, (could also bring up terminal staff strike, groung staff walk out in sympathy with gate gormet and a two day shut down by cabin crew) but it's all in the past. We can't go back and undo it.
The costs of this company exceed the revenue it receives, simple as that.
whats good for the goose, is good for the gander!!!. Come on BILL I'll have the same as our flight deck. Good for CRM
My contract has been constantly changing or evolving for the last 10 years - so you guys will have to play catchup first.
And you can't cherry pick the good bits - Hourly pay - Force Draft or Draft Assign whatever it's called - only 2 days MBT's between any trip - it is expected that you will go above and beyond your industrial limits if needed or you will have to justify yourself if you don't! etc. etc.
get the important stuff out of the way first!
However, here are just some of the hypocrisies of the BASSA hierarchy:
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