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Old 13th Sep 2017, 21:42   #41 (permalink)
 
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I like the new presentation.

Things change, no point getting worked up about it.
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Old 13th Sep 2017, 22:04   #42 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by Turnleft080 View Post
With the Jepp SIDs I find it astonishing they have deleted the 25 MSA circle and
the ACD frequency.
I like the new charts. To scale and with the MSA's shown on the plate so you know exactly which sector you are in.
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Old 13th Sep 2017, 23:25   #43 (permalink)
 
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Sounds like you guys all need an Airbus. Set the assigned altitude in the FCU and push to manage. Honours all constraints without any additional workload!

Australian pilots getting worked up over minuscule things again? Never!
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 00:21   #44 (permalink)
 
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As does almost every other type with some kind of vertical Nav. Problem is the assigned altitude. Hopefully the "descend via" will assign the commencement altitude of the iap from cruise. That way v/nav can manage the constraints without extra radio calls/intermediate Alts in the way down.
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 00:41   #45 (permalink)
 
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Sounds like you guys all need an Airbus. Set the assigned altitude in the FCU and push to manage. Honours all constraints without any additional workload!
Until it gets a few knots fast on descent and just flies out of the profile with no other indication.
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 00:45   #46 (permalink)
 
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As does almost every other type with some kind of vertical Nav. Problem is the assigned altitude. Hopefully the "descend via" will assign the commencement altitude of the iap from cruise. That way v/nav can manage the constraints without extra radio calls/intermediate Alts in the way down.
In the US, when you're given a 'descend via' clearance, you are cleared to the lowest altitude constraint on the STAR. ATC doesn't actually give you the altitude to descend to as it's already published in the STAR and they assume you will set that altitude in the alt selector. This took awhile to get used to, but it seems to work well with minimal chatter on the radio.
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 02:05   #47 (permalink)
 
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Until it gets a few knots fast on descent and just flies out of the profile with no other indication.
Do ya job and crack the boards then

What morno said
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 02:11   #48 (permalink)
 
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Do ya job and crack the boards then

What morno said
Waddaya think I do, FFS?

My point was that it's not just a case of set & forget, 'honours all constraints with no additional workload' as was implied. (And certain non-Airbus products do it better.)
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 03:12   #49 (permalink)
 
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Well itsnotthatbloodyhard then eh
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 03:50   #50 (permalink)
 
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apart from the extra words, i'd expect no changes to the way things are done now.
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 04:10   #51 (permalink)
 
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Well itsnotthatbloodyhard then eh
My wife's been saying much the same thing.
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 04:46   #52 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by itsnotthatbloodyhard View Post
My wife's been saying much the same thing.



Abcdefg
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 10:41   #53 (permalink)
 
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My wife's been saying much the same thing.
Clever. Ixily, what do you think?
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 11:18   #54 (permalink)
 
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As does almost every other type with some kind of vertical Nav. Problem is the assigned altitude. Hopefully the "descend via" will assign the commencement altitude of the iap from cruise. That way v/nav can manage the constraints without extra radio calls/intermediate Alts in the way down.
Won't happen any time soon. Australian SID/STARs aren't configured with enough requirements / hard levels. Airspace boundaries and separation requirements will mean exactly the same number of level assignments as now - just more verbose. Not looking forward to it
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 11:55   #55 (permalink)
 
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Airspace boundaries and separation requirements will mean exactly the same number of level assignments as now
To have multiple RPT jets every hour doing the step-down dance on Dick Smith's CTA steps is madness. I feel sorry for every international crew that is told "further descent in 5 miles"...

As the man himself says... rediculous.
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Old 14th Sep 2017, 13:01   #56 (permalink)
 
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Pending new proc BOREE SEVEN PAPA ARRIVAL looks to be designed to take advantage of the above. In theory, could be given 'WHEN READY DESCEND VIA STAR TO 3000 QNH 1020' before T/D.
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Old 15th Sep 2017, 11:28   #57 (permalink)
 
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The "descend via STAR" really works. Going into LAX from oceanic, a clearance to descend via the STAR saved a heap of radio chatter. One clearance, cleared the NNNNN STAR, descend 7000ft via the STAR and you turn up at Seal Beach, SLI, at 7000ft and 220Kt with little chit chat.
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Old 16th Sep 2017, 06:07   #58 (permalink)
 
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Yep, It seems to work just fine in other parts of the world.
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Old 16th Sep 2017, 06:45   #59 (permalink)
 
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In other words, nothing's changed except we're adding the words "via the STAR" because some countries/operators have taken upon themselves to ignore the established STAR rules, and we now need even more verbosity to compensate.

We already do these "flash" STARs without the new verbiage. We've already got speed limits and altitude limits to comply with on current STARs. If ATC has internal processes that require it to assign intermediate levels, then that's an internal problem and has nothing to do with this new change, as far as I can tell.
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Old 16th Sep 2017, 07:49   #60 (permalink)
 
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Mustafagander,

The new stars into LAX, particularly the rydrr onto 24R have a bunch of altitude restrictions, including Below x and above y at the same waypoint, effectively building a funnel towards the runway.

The problem lies in the requirements imposed by our company brought about by the Boeing FCTM which requires each lmiting altitude be set on the alt sel, so you end up quite busy.
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