Qantas 787 recruitment for cadetship

[altocu]

If the choice was to accept a 777 FO gig on good money now, or hold out for the rumoured qf A330 SO gig that might or might not happen, I personally find it hard to fault the decisions made.

Unless of course you have worked for said operator. Having done so, I can assure you that the money is not as good as it seems. It's not about how much you make, it's how much you can save. Dubai has become ridiculously expensive. In addition, the rosters over the long term are simply unsustainable.

[galdian]

said operator, when you're young and starry eyed will give you quality F/O time, flog you to death perhaps....but you're at the right end of your career to be flogged....and you get into the system of bigger, shinier stuff whilst not waiting to be a librarian which, whilst all experience will give you something, I doubt anyone would disagree that F/O experience - for whatever reason - gives you more grounding than S/O experiences.

just another way of looking at "stuff".

cheers.

[The Green Goblin]

I'd take the FO 777 slot and retire in the backseat at qantas when they eventually call.

No doubt you'll be close to retirement age by that stage anyway.

[yadot]

So,

question is this. Why do CADETS get priority over direct entry pilots with real experience (not ICUS or P3 time) and get priority. Is this called 'saving face' due to HR/ GD/MJ screw UPS?

Qantas is so disappointing. What ever happened to the network of 2005? Anyone remember?

Sad to see Australian aviation sold out to our 'free' world of aviation.

[carro]

So Yadot,

Question is this - Do you not consider pilots with 4000-7000hrs, with a couple thousand Multi Crew Command as having real experience? As this is what the cadets that started in Industry Placement in 07/08/09 have. As such, some have applied to and are being offered Emirates positions.

Carro

[ClearanceClarence1]

Don't do it Ladies and Gents. I have worked for both and Qantas is heaps better. Think of where you want to be in 7 years. I have met lots of elderly happy gents in QF and that's who I intend to be. There is more to life than your rank and plane and you will figure that out when you have kids.

[Arewegettingjets]

Yadot,

Have you flown with any of these cadets before? One of them did my line check a few weeks ago! That's right mate, some of them are check captains! Do your research before you go mouthing off. Are you a check captain Yadot? Get real son.
The reason they are getting priority is because they are high quality applicants. Good luck to them. Even the most junior ones who started at QL 3 years ago are great pilots and people. QF will be very happy with the 50 or so they get.

[morno]

Exactly. Because you could say they have already done the interview and all that jazz, they've just been on a very long hold file.

I'd hardly call them cadets to be honest. Not like a traditional cadet anyway.

morno

[dr dre]

Originally Posted by yadot

So,

question is this. Why do CADETS get priority over direct entry pilots with real experience (not ICUS or P3 time) and get priority?

We're not going to devolve into another cadet bashing thread are we? Let's just say there's a reason QF have employed cadets in the past, are going to employ them in the near future and will probably (not confirmed ATM) restart their cadet program in some way, shape or form in the future.
If you're angry or upset about it, maybe have a look in the mirror.

[Di_Vosh]

I'd agree with (plenty of) previous posters saying that the Cadets getting mainline gigs have a reasonable amount of experience.

Didn't know about the Check Captain (must be in Sunnies) but there are two in Eastern who are Sim trainers.

There are around 50 cadets in Qlink. IMHO, you could put them against any other random 50 Qlink pilots and the standards would be indistinguishable between the two groups.

Even the last lot of Cadets who've joined have been with us for around three years. Anyone who's flown for Qlink for three years should be acceptable for SO placement.

The reason they are getting priority is because they are high quality applicants.

While I'd agree with the sentiment of that statement, my personal opinion is that QANTAS need SO's yesterday. Their pilot recruitment department is being rebuilt from scratch and in order to get some SO's in the training cycle, they're willing to accept the more senior cadets without them going through the complete recruitment process.

From what I had heard in January, the original plan was to have the 10 most senior cadets start their training in early February. (That didn't eventuate, so the plan may evolve).

ClearanceClarence1 while conditions at Emirates may be as you say (plenty of others say this elsewhere in Prune) you might not be aware of how hard guys at Qlink work:

Being rostered to fly 18-20 days out of every 28 is becoming common. Many of our overnights are "Min rest" in a very real sense. That is, five sectors on day 1, and leaving the airport at 8:30pm. Back there at 06:00am the next morning, where you typically fly another three sectors.

You try doing that six to eight times every four weeks, and you may be forgiven for thinking that conditions at Emirates are not so bad. In seven years they'll likely be a Captain over there. IF they have the right to work in Europe, then plenty of opportunities...

Just my thoughts.

DIVOSH!

[CaptCloudbuster]

QF Cadets

From personal experience 99% of the QF Cadets I've flown with operating as brand new 737 FO's are a credit to themselves and the integrity of the QF Program that selected them. They often have above average IQ (and more importantly EQ), they know and apply dillegently their SOPs, they demonstrate a willingness to learn, improve their skill set and within a very short time demonstrate equal or better stick and rudder skills than many of their GA counterparts.

My background is GA and I say bring back as many Cadets out there on industry placement as we can get our hands on.

[Keg]

Why do CADETS get priority over direct entry pilots with real experience (not ICUS or P3 time) and get priority.

In these specific circumstances it's because these cadets were identified by Qantas more than 6 years ago as being the type of pilot they wanted. They were tapped on the shoulder back then as being suitable, went through all the selection process, were crutinised whilst doing their ab initio training far more than their non cadet colleagues and when graduating were told that Qantas hoped to employ them ASAP.

So here we are 6-8 years later from when they went through the selection process and subsequent training, scrutiny and graduation, and you're asking why they should get priority over someone who hasn't been through that process at all and is a complete unknown to Qantas?

In general terms regarding cadetships, well that's a topic that's been done to death on this forum. In 20 years I reckon the various levels of government will have essentially killed off GA and the various cadetships will be the new pathway into airlines.

[Di_Vosh]

In 20 years I reckon the various levels of government will have essentially killed off GA and the various cadetships will be the new pathway into airlines.

Sadly, it wont be that long...


DIVOSH!

[ANCDU]

Sort of agree with you Keg, those that have been doing industry placement with QLink or Jetstar or some other job that keeps them flying should have the earliest opportunity. Unfortunately there were a number through choice decided not to continue flying, which to me shows little motivation towards the actual job, these are the cadets that shouldn't be given the earliest opportunity, they have the wrong motivation for the job, and will end up being one of those cadets that gives the rest a bad name.

Don't get me wrong, most are very capable, motivated operators. Good luck to everyone applying!, as someone else said will be nice to see some new faces around the place (...that don't have grey hair!!)

[In the Soup]

Keg has nailed that one on the head.

I have heard comments among the QLink community to the tune of "if it's good enough for them then it's good enough for all of us"

I also agree with DiVosh, there are many pilots in sunnies and eastern who maintain a standard well above company expectations and those pilots would be an exceptional choice for qf. But I don't believe these pilots should have an open door into Qantas for this reason without being subjected to a recruitment process to Qantas standard.

I think many people forget (most likely because it has been years since qf ran a cadet course), that the cadets were tested and scrutinised throughout the training phase - all to the Qantas standard.

ANCDU, I also agree with you. I would like to think the Lords at QF will be think twice about those who have had time away from aviation. There plenty of boys and girls who are highly motivated to join the company and it would be sad to know that slots were taken up by people who were less motivated

[maggot]

Originally Posted by CaptCloudbuster

My background is GA and I say bring back as many Cadets out there on industry placement as we can get our hands on.

I reckon qf generally maintains a good balance of recruits (back when we did recruit obv!), a good mix is good for the pilot body imo. (Cadet here too btw)
Except theres too many airfarce recruits

[dr dre]

Originally Posted by maggot

I reckon qf generally maintains a good balance of recruits (back when we did recruit obv!), a good mix is good for the pilot body imo. (Cadet here too btw)
Except theres too many airfarce recruits

Well it might be interesting to see the new "composition" of recruits, given that apparently they'll be changing what they're looking for in recruitment, doing it all on personality and other factors, the new breed of pilot could be a little different to what we've seen in the past

[maggot]

Yep selected specifically to deal with us

[CaptCloudbuster]

Airforce recruits....

... why do they insist on winding the pedals all the way in, seat to the floor and belts let out all the way??

[Brakerider]

Well it might be interesting to see the new "composition" of recruits, given that apparently they'll be changing what they're looking for in recruitment, doing it all on personality and other factors, the new breed of pilot could be a little different to what we've seen in the past

Chances are being a good handler won't be on the list..