Step Climb
Thread Starter
Step Climb
Any ATCOs able to shed some light on this?
http://www.pprune.org/tech-log/56201...practices.html
A regulatory reference would be great. Aside from regulations, what do you prefer to see in our selected altitude on a step climb departure? What's the best way for us to fit ion the overall 'system'?
Thanks
http://www.pprune.org/tech-log/56201...practices.html
A regulatory reference would be great. Aside from regulations, what do you prefer to see in our selected altitude on a step climb departure? What's the best way for us to fit ion the overall 'system'?
Thanks
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Can't find a relevant reference. Your FMS set up is not ATC's concern. What is ATC's concern is that you do not bust your cleared level.
I suggest you keep it simple. Set the level in the MCP you are climbing to at the time. Mode S will allow ATC to check you are following the correct SID altitude (stepped climb) or the altitude ATC has just cleared you to if different.
I suggest you keep it simple. Set the level in the MCP you are climbing to at the time. Mode S will allow ATC to check you are following the correct SID altitude (stepped climb) or the altitude ATC has just cleared you to if different.
...in which case it sounds like "ATC" and the likes of Boeing are going to have to enter into discussion about procedures and their compatibility with Mode S .....which is the subject of debate elsewhere.
Have to say that certainly in some parts of the world ATC can cope perfectly well with clearing us for a stepped descent "via" the STAR, even in very busy airspace such as LAX, where there's a similar problem since again the MCP is set to the terminating altitude of a convoluted procedure with multiple crossing above or at restrictions...then again maybe they haven't discovered the joys of Mode S yet!
Have to say that certainly in some parts of the world ATC can cope perfectly well with clearing us for a stepped descent "via" the STAR, even in very busy airspace such as LAX, where there's a similar problem since again the MCP is set to the terminating altitude of a convoluted procedure with multiple crossing above or at restrictions...then again maybe they haven't discovered the joys of Mode S yet!
Thread Starter
EastofKoksy
By that rationale, what ATC see on my enhanced Mode S in this case isn't my concern as long as I don't bust a level?
How to set up my cockpit isn't what I'm asking. I'm asking what helps ATC. If it's the first altitude of the step climb, then I'm happy to do that. I'm asking for input from different aspects of the system I operate in.
By that rationale, what ATC see on my enhanced Mode S in this case isn't my concern as long as I don't bust a level?
How to set up my cockpit isn't what I'm asking. I'm asking what helps ATC. If it's the first altitude of the step climb, then I'm happy to do that. I'm asking for input from different aspects of the system I operate in.
Last edited by Journey Man; 27th May 2015 at 20:06. Reason: I took a deep breath.
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Journey Man
No, that is not what my first paragraph says.
As far as helping ATC is concerned, we need to know what level you have told the aircraft to climb/descend to at the present time. Depending on the airspace you are flying in, the ATC data system could identify a discrepancy between what is downlinked by Mode S and the cleared level input by the controller. An alert will be generated as a result.
No, that is not what my first paragraph says.
As far as helping ATC is concerned, we need to know what level you have told the aircraft to climb/descend to at the present time. Depending on the airspace you are flying in, the ATC data system could identify a discrepancy between what is downlinked by Mode S and the cleared level input by the controller. An alert will be generated as a result.
EastofKoksy
But that was the whole point of the procedure that now, with the advent of mode S, some are objecting to.
The problem as I see it from our side of the operation is that setting the MCP to give ATC the mode S readout they want so they can confirm each and every step on a complex SID doesn't keep it simple for us, it makes things more difficult. It increases workload and there's an increased the risk of us failing to make a mandatory step up - if we forget to wind the MCP altitude up to the next step quickly enough, for whatever reason, you'll have an "hard" altitude capture and the aircraft may trundle on at a constant level, regardless of any subsequent steps required by the SID/ATC and programmed into the FMC....
Journeyman - Apologies for continuing to hi-jack your threads. I'm minded of the early days of TCAS where a pilot questioning ATC about separation usually got short shrift (at best) because we were told TCAS didn't have the complete picture and didn't tell the whole story.... I do feel perhaps the boot is on the other foot here and it's an issue that you rightly point out needs resolving.
I suggest you keep it simple.
The problem as I see it from our side of the operation is that setting the MCP to give ATC the mode S readout they want so they can confirm each and every step on a complex SID doesn't keep it simple for us, it makes things more difficult. It increases workload and there's an increased the risk of us failing to make a mandatory step up - if we forget to wind the MCP altitude up to the next step quickly enough, for whatever reason, you'll have an "hard" altitude capture and the aircraft may trundle on at a constant level, regardless of any subsequent steps required by the SID/ATC and programmed into the FMC....
Journeyman - Apologies for continuing to hi-jack your threads. I'm minded of the early days of TCAS where a pilot questioning ATC about separation usually got short shrift (at best) because we were told TCAS didn't have the complete picture and didn't tell the whole story.... I do feel perhaps the boot is on the other foot here and it's an issue that you rightly point out needs resolving.
Last edited by wiggy; 28th May 2015 at 07:53.
