Problems with ATC Accusation
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Uruguay
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Problems with ATC Accusation
Hi, WE been accused from decent a minimum altitude in BEEF ISLAND Airport in our final approach.
We follow the instruction by the san juan control and the ATC from beef and after we land ATC make us call to san juan control, the guy said that we are under investigation under the statement that we decent below route minimums but we follow their instructions.
We decent a maintain 3300ft after that ATC Told Us to decent and maintain 3000ft regard the sector altitude is 3300ft.
So we don't understand the accusation.
Can someone tell me what are the troubles if we are wrong (fines or something like that).
We try to send our statement but we are waiting someone to call us.
We follow the instruction by the san juan control and the ATC from beef and after we land ATC make us call to san juan control, the guy said that we are under investigation under the statement that we decent below route minimums but we follow their instructions.
We decent a maintain 3300ft after that ATC Told Us to decent and maintain 3000ft regard the sector altitude is 3300ft.
So we don't understand the accusation.
Can someone tell me what are the troubles if we are wrong (fines or something like that).
We try to send our statement but we are waiting someone to call us.
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: glendale
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Was your plane in RADAR contact? An altitude given by a radar controller is usually quite safe and legal (they do make mistakes )
Sector altitudes are really sort of emergency only altitude and are not the min enroute or similar altitudes.
Were you established on a feeder route or other published part of the approach?
Sector altitudes are really sort of emergency only altitude and are not the min enroute or similar altitudes.
Were you established on a feeder route or other published part of the approach?
Without details on what approach was being flown, the clearance given, etc hard to give firm answer. But, if SJC ATC files the report with the FAA, the FAA Legal office (Enforcement Branch is its title) will forward the report to the ICAO in Montreal to be forwarded to your Civil Aviation regulator fir action, if they find it warranted. Assuming you are operating under the Uruguay DGCA, you might make some quiet inquiries or just remain quiet and wait. It'll be them that takes any action.
GF
GF
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Air safety reports, at least in the country I live in, are impersonal, using the provided form you just report that in such place at such moment something occurred and the office in charge need to investigate if those operations were following or not the given standard, point, ATC units are not supposed to explicitally blame someone or give the personal judge, everything should be done under the just culture policy, if you were wrong you will learn something from it.
Join Date: Mar 2014
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Like said in a previous post by glendalegoon, the magic phrase is "RADAR contact", once you've been identified descend is on me/the controller, and I'll add for wind and temperature as well.
Where I work, the MSA is 5300ft, but once you're on radar, we can take you down as low as 3100ft in certain areas. But when the radar is out for maintenance, or power cuts (happens, rarely but it happens). Then it's the 5300ft and then YOU, being the pilot, have to add for temperature and wind aloft, we help a bit by stating when giving the MSA that it's not temperature corrected.
We have a few that adds for temperature and wind, even when under radar control, fair enough, it's always better to be safe than sorry. We just notify it's already been done and everything is smooth again.
But be carefull, there has been accidents through the years where aircrafts has crashed due to the pilots not understanding that they themselves were responsible for terrainclearance.
Where I work, the MSA is 5300ft, but once you're on radar, we can take you down as low as 3100ft in certain areas. But when the radar is out for maintenance, or power cuts (happens, rarely but it happens). Then it's the 5300ft and then YOU, being the pilot, have to add for temperature and wind aloft, we help a bit by stating when giving the MSA that it's not temperature corrected.
We have a few that adds for temperature and wind, even when under radar control, fair enough, it's always better to be safe than sorry. We just notify it's already been done and everything is smooth again.
But be carefull, there has been accidents through the years where aircrafts has crashed due to the pilots not understanding that they themselves were responsible for terrainclearance.
