SERCO Baghdad

[meddle east]

factual?

kiwi,

hard to say what is factual about baghdad, but that is just my 'opinion'.

If you are qualified for radar, you should have little trouble getting hired in Iraq by Serco. They are losing lots of people here for various reasons, but I have heard many controllers say (that would be a fact) that they are frustrated.

equipment, quality of life, management, Iraqi culture, leave policies, safety, visa issues

and the list goes on and on

I would consider this a short term solution to any monetary issues someone may have. Not really air traffic control here (opinion)

ME

[Number2]

Wonder how many Americans will stay once the last US troops have left at the end of the year?

[Vercingetorix]

Yep, what will be the security situation at the ATC facility when the American troops pull out?

[meddle east]

Security around here is more about appearances (IMO) than actually preventing anything.

two examples:

1. Water supplies not guarded when first put in. Huge tanks sitting outside camp, no one watching, anyone who wanted to could have unscrewed caps on top and put anything in.

2. mortar attack recently. management went to bunkers, some controllers never notified. Oh, and there are not enough bunkers for the people here. Oh, and no more are being built. ("bunkers do not really protect you...." heard said by mngt my me)

ME

[baghdadkiwi]

ME
You obviously have an axe to grind - this posting in Iraq is optional - you can always leave if you hate it this much!!!!

If you are qualified for radar, you should have little trouble getting hired in Iraq by Serco.

But as we all know - applications accepted by Serco are vetted by the Iraqi's and they have the final say.

TThey are losing lots of people here for various reasons, but I have heard many controllers say (that would be a fact) that they are frustrated.

equipment, quality of life, management, Iraqi culture, leave policies, safety, visa issues

and the list goes on and on

won't disagree but what I will say is you can either get caught up in it or you can just go what the f... and come to work, do the job as best you can and then get on the bus and go back to your room/bar/gym. For that you will (at the moment) get paid 530USD/day. I work in the approach room, on average I will work 6 hours of my 8 hour day on position so over 1 cycle I work 36 hours every 8 days. On conclusion of a year you would have been paid around 3730USD per week - tax free.

Not really air traffic control here (opinion)

Totally disagree here....most ATC systems around the world now are so streamlined, regulated, x this point at this time, your slot is....etc etc its taken the enjoyment out of it. Actually having to think.

The ATC here below FL230 is pure ATC, its random, quiet,busy, frantic, frustrating......everyone (mostly) have to get vectors around the **** load of military aircraft flying around that are not on your freq. All departures, particularly out of Baghdad are on headings and you have to weave them through all the traffic on another frequency. Yes there are supposedly procedures but very rarely adhered to so you have to just work the traffic to make it work. Sorry, but I class this as being an air traffic controller. But then again - if you don't like it, you can always leave.

hard to say what is factual about baghdad

My intent was that some may ask specific questions about the work over here eg roster rotation, ratings, living, pay etc - things that I could give a factual answer to. I do not like to to influence people on a career change based on my opinion ie what I like or dislike here and printed may influence someone to apply/not apply when their likes/dislikes would differ from mine.

Security around here is more about appearances (IMO) than actually preventing anything.

two examples:

1. Water supplies not guarded when first put in. Huge tanks sitting outside camp, no one watching, anyone who wanted to could have unscrewed caps on top and put anything in.

2. mortar attack recently. management went to bunkers, some controllers never notified. Oh, and there are not enough bunkers for the people here. Oh, and no more are being built. ("bunkers do not really protect you...." heard said by mngt my me)

Well that came out of left field...........the water, FFS....everyone knows here the water from the tanks are for flushing your **** down the toilet and showers. If you use it for anything else....what can I say....there is so much bottled water here than you could shake a bottle water stick at. I use that for my drinking water, jug water, teeth cleaning water. The only other thing I know the tank supply does is the ice machines....and it goes through about 5 filters before it even gets to the frozen stage. Even if some scrotum drove up to the tanks outside the camp where the flood lights are on and the guards have a video on permanent camera out the front, and injected something into the water supply...ahh I'm just raving now....

By the way....big new bunker down by my room...what mortars you talking about? The ones on the military base some time ago or the controlled detonations the other night that only some of us were told about?

[ferris]

Some things to think about

Baghdadkiwi...some clarifications;

you can always leave if you hate it this much!!!!

I am told by a recent escapee that you WILL hate it this much, and in a very short time. Anyone who does any research must surely know that, going in. It is a 'money grab', and that's it. On the topic of which...
- are you including your travel allowance and gratuity in your annual figure, and hence, other figures?
- are you neglecting to mention how much you will spend (be relieved of) to get in and out for those precious days out of country?
- is there any will to change the 6 on, 1 off 'cycle'? (anyone who has a job already should work out how much they will make working 6 on 1 off ad infinitum in their current job and see how much it works out to- and should probably think about employer pension/superannuation contribution as well).

Prospectives should probably compare other mid east gigs and determine if the Iraq 'premium' is acceptable (especially in a few months time without any US troops).

[SINGAPURCANAC]

is acceptable (especially in a few months time without any US troops).

quite acceptable if you ask someone like me, with significant experience combined NATO/civil flights in the same area. Once USA troops had left, shine and bright day began for our aviation community.


(N.B. as long as there is French Air Forces ,USA troops aren't the worst.)

[Frostie]

• What exactly is the ICAA looking at in one's application?
• What will happpen when the US troops withdrawal? Has Serco addressed that?
• Does the US provide security at the airport?
• Will Camp Victory closed after the withdrawal?
  
• Is there internet? how good is it, speed & reliability?
• What type of phone do most use? Do phone data plans work, specifically Blackberrys or iPhones?
  
• I've been told that rush trips out of Iraq can take a few days for a visa. Is that the visa "problem" you mentioned?
• What airline is best for travel?
• How is the coffee?

Those are a few questions I have.

[Plazbot]

As per Qs about US troops, I thought the Gurkas looked after security at the compound?

Either way, **** that.

[baghdadkiwi]

What exactly is the ICAA looking at in one's application?


Who knows.....its a complete mystery to all of us

What will happpen when the US troops withdrawal? Has Serco addressed that?

Yes they have....no one knows regards how the country will react


Does the US provide security at the airport?

No they don't - its a private company called G4S...the checkpoints we go through are Iraqi employed

Will Camp Victory closed after the withdrawal?

Not sure at this stage


Is there internet? how good is it, speed & reliability?

Yes...broadband wireless, its okay most of the time, can be a bit slow if everyone is downloading at the same time. I use it all the time to call home etc and never a problem


What type of phone do most use? Do phone data plans work, specifically Blackberrys or iPhones?

I use a Iphone Viber programe which means I can call home any time for free from both my abode or work. Skype is the same. Also have an Iraqi cellphone and number for emergencies so I can always be contactable. Works fine.

I've been told that rush trips out of Iraq can take a few days for a visa. Is that the visa "problem" you mentioned?

Visa requires giving up your passport for a few days while it goes into town to get 'stamped'. None of us like this but this is how it happens. If you need to get out 'quickly' there is a system in place where the camp manager here can go to the airport and get a 'get out quick' visa in 1 day.

What airline is best for travel?

Numerous airlines fly into baghdaddy....depends where you want to go to and all reputable airlines. I just paid for Emirates tickets for Jan vacation out of here, also you can fly Turkish, Jordanian, Iraqi, Global Jet, Etihad, Iranair, and a bunch of others that allude me now. As to the best.....well depends which side of the world your flying out too....eg most of the americans use Turkish to fly westbound to the states, same with the guys from european countries. I go the other way (thru Dubai). There is no problem getting out of here.


How is the coffee?[/QUOTE]

Pretty good.......

[baghdadkiwi]

Plazbot.......you have been misinformed

[baghdadkiwi]

I am told by a recent escapee that you WILL hate it this much, and in a very short time. Anyone who does any research must surely know that, going in. It is a 'money grab', and that's it. On the topic of which...
- are you including your travel allowance and gratuity in your annual figure, and hence, other figures?
- are you neglecting to mention how much you will spend (be relieved of) to get in and out for those precious days out of country?
- is there any will to change the 6 on, 1 off 'cycle'? (anyone who has a job already should work out how much they will make working 6 on 1 off ad infinitum in their current job and see how much it works out to- and should probably think about employer pension/superannuation contribution as well).

Prospectives should probably compare other mid east gigs and determine if the Iraq 'premium' is acceptable (especially in a few months time without any US troops).

193600USD is the total package tax free (at the moment)

No one really talks these days about the US troops not being here..and that being a stay/go issue. When I arrived at the beginning of the year it was all the talk and a concern particularly amongst the american controllers here. I haven't heard that concern for months ... its all been about working conditions.

you say a recent escapee tells you YOU WILL HATE IT...there in lies the issue with opinions that I was talking about earlier. There are issues but I don't hate the place and keep coming back after my leave.

The cost of flying in and out is part of that 193600USD. Depends on how you choose to fly out of here or what you do on your holiday as to how much you spend.

What else is there...yes the shifts, its been brought up time and time again...hopefully we are getting an answer this week from Serco management that addresses the issue of our work schedule..they have recognised that it is different over here and are addressing it. Whether or not something happens remains to be seen.....we are waiting.

[ron83]

1.How does validation is done? How long does it take? Are you get paid while on OJT?
2. Does anyone who used to work there, was able to get back to descent places?
3.How does an ANSP will look at your CV,when they see
BGW as your last employer?

Best regards.

[ron83]

My second question was part of a third. What I meant there, does someone,who worked at BGW for 3 or 5 years was able to get position at other ANSP when they left? But looking at answer on 3-rd I assume that,yes.

Back to Q.1. Validation up to me? So there is no other requirement than those 2 weeks,or if you said it has been dropped no requirements at all? How long it took for you to validate?

How long is the leave 8 weeks on 2 off? Can you do 16 on 4 off?

Regards.

[meddle east]

visa issues

I've been told that rush trips out of Iraq can take a few days for a visa. Is that the visa "problem" you mentioned?

Visa requires giving up your passport for a few days while it goes into town to get 'stamped'. None of us like this but this is how it happens. If you need to get out 'quickly' there is a system in place where the camp manager here can go to the airport and get a 'get out quick' visa in 1 day.

Seems odd that someone who likes 'facts' so much did not want to provide the full answer. One controller had a relative very ill... he did not manage to get out in one day. Two? Noooo,

Want to rework this one?

Is there internet? how good is it, speed & reliability?

Yes...broadband wireless, its okay most of the time, can be a bit slow if everyone is downloading at the same time. I use it all the time to call home etc and never a problem

This has not been everyone's experience. Some here have complained about the lack of both reliability and bandwidth here. Serco has gone to some lengths to improve the internet (already a warning sign IMO) and it seems to have worked. But I have heard many complaints of skype calls being so bad/dropped that the callers have given up. And not just by controllers, by management and outsiders here at camp also.

What the f are you asking here???? Your english is very bad.

Seems like anyone who does not think BGD is issue free will feel the wrath of Kiwi on the forum

For someone who would like a few more facts. The 14 day certification time has not been 'dropped' it is just disregarded at the whims of 'whomever'. There have been blokes let go. If Kiwi wants to argue this, ask Serco to put it in writing and you will soon see the error of his thinking.

Just a few weeks ago, two controllers were sitting around the camp hours before their planes were to leave without a visa/passport. Ask them how they think the visa program appears.

All in all, I am staying for another 6 months to finish out the year, but not everyone is. This place has a frustration level that will overwhelm some, grind on others, and never seem to affect others. Like many of these appointments I assume.

ME

[meddle east]

the water, FFS....everyone knows here the water from the tanks are for flushing your **** down the toilet and showers. If you use it for anything else....what can I say....there is so much bottled water here than you could shake a bottle water stick at. I use that for my drinking water, jug water, teeth cleaning water. The only other thing I know the tank supply does is the ice machines....and it goes through about 5 filters before it even gets to the frozen stage. Even if some scrotum drove up to the tanks outside the camp where the flood lights are on and the guards have a video on permanent camera out the front, and injected something into the water supply...ahh I'm just raving now....

sorry it took a bit to post an answer to this, wanted to be sure of my 'facts'...

Asked the cooks how many bottles of water they used when they made the soup: after many confused looks= NONE

asked the dish washers how many bottles of water they used per plate/ per cup:
more confused looks=NONE

apparantly water is used for more than your loo. But just to be sure, I checked with security about water supply and now there are two separate areas. One area is locked up with concertina wire on back side (where the cameras are NOT). Guess you are not the expert, and some do think, including security that potable water should be safeguarded. Glad you are not in charge.

By the way....big new bunker down by my room...

But the real question is: Are there enough bunkers for all the people here at the camp? (quick answer : NO) And are more coming? Seems not. To which management always seems to answer.... "the bunkers aren't really any protection anyway" Of course that did not keep them from occupying them during the mortar attack (not the controlled detonation-we all know the difference) while many controllers sat in their tin cans, unaware of any danger at all.

Since you like it, stay. Many here don't and are leaving at year end. Should be interesting since the present staff is already being asked to work well past 6 days in a row.

ME

[baghdadkiwi]

my oh my. Did you break a nail precious?

Asked the cooks how many bottles of water they used when they made the soup: after many confused looks= NONE

asked the dish washers how many bottles of water they used per plate/ per cup:
more confused looks=NONE

you obviously have a good command of their language because you could tell them "your mother wears Jack Boots" and they will look at you and smile and say yes sir no sir.......they do not understand english, hence the confused look you talk about.

apparantly water is used for more than your loo. But just to be sure, I checked with security about water supply and now there are two separate areas. One area is locked up with concertina wire on back side (where the cameras are NOT). Guess you are not the expert, and some do think, including security that potable water should be safeguarded. Glad you are not in charge.

And I guess they spoke fluent english as well and knew exactly what you were asking. The tanks are in one area, separated by the compound wall ie most of the tanks are outside the wall..next to the guard hut and 2 or 3 tanks are inside the wall..but none the less they are all confined to one area. Yes I can see someone coming up in a car...pull up outside the guard hut...climb up on the tanks...under all the spot lights ....and put in..well whatever you think they are going to put in. Please...... I'll leave it up to you to find the rest of the negatives ...guess you will find a negative in the 10% payrise as well....and you say your staying for another 6 months - my.... how you must hate being here.

Seems like anyone who does not think BGD is issue free will feel the wrath of Kiwi on the forum

whatever

Seems odd that someone who likes 'facts' so much did not want to provide the full answer. One controller had a relative very ill... he did not manage to get out in one day. Two? Noooo,

Want to rework this one?

I said in my post that there was a system in place..didn't say it worked. Having said that it has worked for a number of people who have had to leave quickly and on a couple of occasions it hasn't gone to plan and they have had to wait for a day....but you just go ahead and reword that how you want...

[LXGB]

If I was working out there, I would be a bit concerned about the beads in the windows. I think there are 7 by my count.

[baghdadkiwi]

But the real question is: Are there enough bunkers for all the people here at the camp? (quick answer : NO)

There are 3 bunkers on the Serco side of the camp...easily fit us all in spread between the 3..think standing space..you can cram a lot of people in to a confined area when all standing.

This has not been everyone's experience. Some here have complained about the lack of both reliability and bandwidth here. Serco has gone to some lengths to improve the internet (already a warning sign IMO) and it seems to have worked. But I have heard many complaints of skype calls being so bad/dropped that the callers have given up. And not just by controllers, by management and outsiders here at camp also.

if you say so...from my point of view it hasn't been a problem, sometimes slow, but I mentioned about that. It may be dependent on where you are on the camp so I won't refute what you are saying other than to say it has not been my experience.

Just a few weeks ago, two controllers were sitting around the camp hours before their planes were to leave without a visa/passport. Ask them how they think the visa program appears.

It might not be perfect and yes it is stressful waiting for your exit visa...but I have not heard of anyone missing their flight out of here due to a visa issue.

This place has a frustration level that will overwhelm some, grind on others, and never seem to affect others.

totally agree with you

All in all, I am staying for another 6 months to finish out the year, but not everyone is.

its 12 months service not a Jan to Jan type thing, I don't know of anyone currently here who has tendered their resignation effective less than 12 months service.

[ferris]

Talk it up as much as you want. However, considering the flightglobal ad is offering 177k usd for a gig in Abu Dhabi, WHY would you go to Baghdad for the coin on offer?
Risk/reward- it's a no-brainer!