ATC IssuesA place where pilots may enter the 'lions den' that is Air Traffic Control in complete safety and find out the answers to all those obscure topics which you always wanted to know the answer to but were afraid to ask.
Isn't it too much for direct entries?
5 months in school plus pre -OJT , than OJT,than an examination process.
UF! It sounds like 12 months,before full salary!
I can´t tell you anything about the pay conditions etc.
But I know that you won´t get bored at the academy! You´ll be introduced to how wonderful the DFS is, to its philosophy and German laws (and we have lots of them!!!). And for those who will get jobs at Langen I wouldn´t be surprised if you´d get some German language courses. Especially in German phraseology. That´ll be enough since there´s not too much German speaking traffic on ATC-frequency.
And after that you´ll spend some 2 months in the simulator in order to make you familiar with local procedures. Believe me! You won´t get bored!
With all that training why do they want experienced controllers? With 5 months in the classroom, including two months in the sim, then 5-6 months OJT I could train a keen student straight off the street.
I also hope the 'rumour' of training pay until validated is just that, a rumour. I would think it very unlikely that someone already employed by DFS would revert to training pay if they were to transfer from say Bremen to Karlsruhe. So why then should direct entry experienced controllers be fiscally penalised?
With all that training why do they want experienced controllers? With 5 months in the classroom, including two months in the sim, then 5-6 months OJT I could train a keen student straight off the street.
Classroom, sim and OJT take about 3 years for ab initio trainees here.
Did I read that right??? You're telling us that from the day a person walks in off the street into the classroom at Langen until the time they talk to an aircraft on their own licence takes three years In my experience it usually takes one year to train a tower controller, 14 months for an area controller (I will not say where, as I'd like to stay incognito, but a very complex ACC). For experienced overseas controllers it will take anywhere from 3 months to 6 months depending on the sector/s including sim and classroom time, it usually can be sooner but minmum training times are set down for the various validations. I'd be interested what the times are in other places...
As you work there, or close by, can you tell us whether internal transfers, ie Langen to Bremen revert to training pay until they validate in the new ACC?
Ab initios spend 1 year in the classroom, half a year in the sim and then another 18 months (maximum) in OJT. Experienced controllers will most probably need 6 to 10 months in OJT to get fully validated.
Nobody ever said that German airspace is easy to get familiar with!
Most of them take a longer time until all licences are achieved!
But everything between 3 years and almost 4 years is a good value to calculate with for ab initios!
You are getting new, ready-to-work ATCOS in one year???!!!
Hm.....that is why some in DFS are thinking of good assements. Not every controller is able to cope with the central european airspace, it is definetly the most complex one in Europe. I have no idea about the amount traffic in other parts of the world, but central Europe with all its hubs is not easy to work and they (DFS) made experience in former times with ready entries (at least at Karlsruhe UAC): Only a very few made it!
Good luck to all - do your best! We´re waiting for you!
Only 2008 until this week in average 8,6 % more traffic (only for UAC, lower sectors not as much as here) in respect to 2007!
FY
Edit: If a ATCO changes the center, he will get the normal salary! No downgrading during training!
Slightly offtopic @ FLF: In The Netherlands training for from Ab-initio to fully licensed is at Tower/Approach about 4 years, and for Area about 2,5 to 3 years!
Yes I agree, I certainly wouldn't expect to drop back down to the same salary level as an ab initio trainee.
But, that said, I'm guessing there will be some form of reduced pay structure until you actually validate. Obviously at this stage of recruitment it's distinctly bad form to start asking your interviewers about salaries so I was wondering if anyone already working there had any idea what the pay structure would be, or if anyone has dared to ask during the telephone interviews??!!
With all that training why do they want experienced controllers? With 5 months in the classroom, including two months in the sim, then 5-6 months OJT I could train a keen student straight off the street.
In addition to what my German colleagues have already stated, DFS is faced with the problem that they don't get enough applications by ab initio trainees. I don't know exact figures but say you need 10000 applications to actually find 100 suitable candidates, and you only get 5000 applications in the first place, then you need 50 ready entries to make up for that deficit.
From what I hear DFS needs about 300 additional controllers over the next couple of years.
Is there a deadline on CV submission?
I think I'm going to apply. This kind of application makes me crazy. I mean... I prefere to fill a form instead writing a CV: I have nothing to write on it!
In my experience it usually takes one year to train a tower controller, 14 months for an area controller (I will not say where, as I'd like to stay incognito, but a very complex ACC). For experienced overseas controllers it will take anywhere from 3 months to 6 months depending on the sector/s including sim and classroom time, it usually can be sooner but minmum training times are set down for the various validations. I'd be interested what the times are in other places...
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