ATC IssuesA place where pilots may enter the 'lions den' that is Air Traffic Control in complete safety and find out the answers to all those obscure topics which you always wanted to know the answer to but were afraid to ask.
Perhaps if management wasn't so busy involving themselves by giving extra breaks to someone, who at worst has to work 4 out of 7 hours, and instead spent more time doing what needs to be done then things may improve?
Obvious who hasn't been working the traffic on shift for a while. If you are sitting there scratching your arse, then working more hours is fine. When you are dealing with "27 on freq" (as you admit in another thread), 4 hours per shift is quite enough. So, maybe, in the absence of the manager being able to persuade those above that more staff might be a good idea, the manager sitting on the console to help out is actually the best thing he could be doing under the circumstances.
Quote:
Maybe it will stop when "management" actually starts managing?
"Management" might find that a bit rich coming from someone with the ability to do so much ppruning from work? "Pot to kettle, pot to kettle, how's your workload today?"
Dude, several times lately you have demonstrated on here your lack of brains. "gilding the lily" is an expression that means "To make superfluous additions to what is already complete" or "Not quite telling the truth", which doesn't make sense in the context of your post. Perhaps "feathering your nest" might've been appropriate? (And still misguided) Although I know you don't have a lot of time to think about ppruning, because you are so busy catching up on "risk bearing incidents", Doc 9859 etc.{quite bizarre that someone in your position has so little knowledge of the topic} Vitriol- if you think my post was vitriolic, you need to have a long look in the mirror. Message and messenger? You crack me up. Why would I want to discuss anything with you, bru? Re-read the thread.
<<I am certain I saw a Cathay A340 flying in the opposite direction pass us VERY close indeed (must of been close to standard 5nm separation if anything) >>
You are using the word "of" instead of "have". Remember that for written exams.
Even in the air it is difficult to accurately judge distances from other aircraft. Maybe the other aircraft was climbing or descending, so giving you a different perspective which can be confusing.
If an aircraft got as close as you are suggesting - such that the registration might nearly be readable - do you not think that one or other of the crews would have taken avoiding action?
I always wondered why BAH was the only one to read out our full overflight routing and hardly ever gave shortcuts, this thread explained that, so thank you for the education.
How much has changed in the Bahrain FIR since the original discussion?
Mutt.. "has much changed?" Well, it's hard to say. Over the last few years, they have re-sectorised and hired a LOT more controllers, which has helped enormously. However, they are always playing catch-up. IATA stats show another 14.7% increase in traffic for the region in January. On top of that, Serco are mis-managing the contract into the ground, and a mass-exodus is gathering pace. It's going to get ugly over the next year or so (these things take time to get going, and time to fix).
<<On top of that, Serco are mis-managing the contract into the ground, and a mass-exodus is gathering pace. It's going to get ugly over the next year or so (these things take time to get going, and time to fix). >>
Please give us the benefit of your wisdom and experience and tell us what form is this alleged "mis-management", and what you would do to improve things.
Please give us the benefit of your wisdom and experience and tell us what form is this alleged "mis-management", and what you would do to improve things.
Yep, would be interested in a reply to this question. Ferris has been denouncing management in the Gulf for over 10 years now but still no sign of any input of his having been taken up. Au contraire
To infinity and beyond and, hopefully, back in time for a pint of Theakston's Old Peculier.
What happened with the Eurocat system which was being tested? Surely some modern equipment and getting rid of the paper strips would have been a massive help.
In what way is the Serco contract being run into the ground. I had heard that Bahrain management had their stuff together and ran a nice operation. I can imagine the recent "trouble" in the country wouldn't have helped though.
Last edited by Baileys; 6th Mar 2012 at 11:34.
Reason: spelling
Please give us the benefit of your wisdom and experience and tell us what form is this alleged "mis-management", and what you would do to improve things
I'm quite happy to elaborate (and as those who know me will attest- one of the few prepared to tell it DIRECTLY to the managers responsible). The local management have been neutered, as far as Serco is concerned (so lets be clear where the blame lies). In much the same fashion as the Abu Dhabi contract was mismanaged into the ground, the Bahrain contract is going the same way. There is a constant 'conditions creep', where working hours slowly increase, duties expanded, leave days/availability reduced etc etc- all against a backdrop where living conditions in Bahrain have materially fallen, freedoms infringed etc. In short, it's becoming less inviting to work and live here. Not all of these items are under Serco's control. However, the things which ARE- terms and conditions, and primarily....MONEY, have simply been the subject of rape and pillage. Do Serco rise to the challenges of the environment here....well, here's how they deal with things:
- They now typically take 4 months to calculate the annual payrise/review. It used to be available in the first week of January. While it varied greatly in amount, it usually kept up with cost of living- as a minimum. Now, it seems to take 'head office' 4 months to calculate a 3-or-so percent pay rise. Is the end of the year a fu$king surprise? If needed, I could email them around September each year to give adequate warning of the impending year-end.
- Cost of living? Do they have no grip on reality? The cost of living increase is a lot more than 3% in the ME. Their argument that 'rents are falling' could be balanced against the 'USD is falling', and left out of it. When things are getting $hitty (living/working), you need to come up with better than CPI-type increases...ESPECIALLY when there is a LOT OF FAT IN THIS CONTRACT. Now is not the type to milk it and shaft the workforce. If they continue to grow the gap between what Serco is paid and what the workforce is paid, it drives a move to direct hire (exactly as it did in Abu Dhabi). Can they not see this, or are they just seeing how far they can push?
- The centralisation of power, and 'all the contracts will be standardised' is just BS. Living/working in Bahrain is NOT THE SAME as living/working in other places. Conditions will ebb and flow in each location, so a 'centralised' approach is just plain ignorant.
- Summary cancellation of individual conditions (downwards) because they 'are not in your contract' (despite them being honoured for, in some cases, 15 years) is a great way to win hearts and minds, right at a time when a lot of change is afoot and goodwill might be precious.
I could go on, but they are the biggies. The clueless in Dubai have been taking the piss lately, and it shows on the floor, as the main topic of conversation is where people are applying, when they are going etc. They are having no trouble replacing the leavers, at the moment, but are primarily hiring retired US controllers. That is going to create a whole new can of worms, but is beyond the scope of this particular thread. Unless the brains trust in Dubai lift their game (empower the local management, come to the table with some decent improvements etc etc) it is, indeed, going to get ugly. People ARE leaving. If you can get the same money across different locations in the Gulf, WHY would anyone come to BAHRAIN? People are leaving here to get the LESS money to the east.
Quote:
Ferris has been denouncing management in the Gulf for over 10 years now but still no sign of any input of his having been taken up
And the evidence is legion. Serco has what, 10 controllers left on the Abu Dhabi contract? How did that work for them? It's not rocket science- it's people management.
Well, ATC was chaotic in 1977 when I first started my ATCO career in the Middle East. Low staff levels unsuitable CNS infrastructure, high traffic load.
Classic mix, so, 30 + years on, no change......
Maybe you should wait until one of Akbar Al Baker’s fleet has a serious near miss that makes the European press* and Flight magazine. Then he might jump up and down and talk some sense into the people who are obviously ignoring the investment requirements. He seems to work this way with Airbus.
* Similar situation in Aberdeen in the 1980’s. No primary radar – airmiss – Sunday Times – SSR installed 6 months later.
Ferris agree with much of what you say but when you have in the Gulf the GCC (oxymoron there) there is a long way to go. There are/were plans for a common GCC ACC to be based in Saudi but the rest: UAE, Bahrain, Oman, Kuwait threw hissy fits and the plan was watered down to a common ACC but with the sectors being based in, you've guessed it, UAE, Bahrain, Oman, Kuwait and Saudi!!! so no change there. The military cooperation is much further advanced. Basically there is very little input that an expat controller can have. The locals with 4/5 years experience are regarded as being on a more knowledgeable level than the expats, this with them having done attendance courses (not necessary to pass exams) at various ATC colleges and then being taught by the expats. Being local they will, of course, get elevated to the decision making and planning levels long before they are ready.
ICAO in Cairo is a waste of space.
Basically all that an expat controller can hope for is to be a PIPO (Plug in - Plug out) and take the money until his particular bucket is full!! Very sad 'cos there is a wealth of talent amongst the expats that could be utilised to reorganise the ATS routes, airspace, etc, and bring it into the modern world to cope with the various Sheiks willy waving as to who has the biggest airline.
The moment a close encounter of the terrifying kind takes place, and it will: 1. The controller concerned and most likely his Satco will be incarcerated. 2. The PANs OPs chap responsible for procedures will very quickly join them. 3. Serco will go out of business in the Middle East due to their insurance liabilty payout.
Cheers
P.S. All this grim scenario being enhanced with the Irani nuclear issue. Good luck!
Last edited by Vercingetorix; 8th Mar 2012 at 03:22.
Basically all that an expat controller can hope for is to be a PIPO (Plug in - Plug out) and take the money until his particular bucket is full!! Very sad 'cos there is a wealth of talent amongst the expats that could be utilised to reorganise the ATS routes, airspace, etc, and bring it into the modern world to cope with the various Sheiks willy waving as to who has the biggest airline.
The moment a close encounter of the terrifying kind takes place, and it will: 1. The controller concerned and most likely his Satco will be incarcerated. 2. The PANs OPs chap responsible for procedures will very quickly join them. 3. Serco will go out of business in the Middle East due to their insurance liabilty payout.
You missed number 4. The entire Middle East will grind to a halt as each and every one of those expat controllers that make the system work (ok, maybe minus the Saffers) pisses off back to the real world.
Point 5. There aren't the jobs in the real world at the moment.If all the expats ''P**S off'' back to the real world,then there will be a lot of shelves getting stacked down at Tescos.
Yep, silly me, I forgot all about the Saffers. A dedicated bunch, if ever!
The major problem for all the expats if they p**sed off home is that their previous employers wouldn't exactly welcome them back with open arms and an obligatory bottle of free Champagne. Very rare for them to go back on the same terms and conditions that they left on. Better they stay and fill their bucket with coin and then go. There will always be a flow of newbies willing to try the ME until reality sets in.
At least one major well-spring for controllers is changing their re-hire policy (due to mismanaging staff issues at home), and with the demise of the USD, I'm not so sure there will be an ongoing flow ready to sample the sand- unless you count the aforementioned US controllers. Either way, it takes a long time to turn the ship around....but you have to spot the iceberg first.
