FAA PPL - Qustion & Hello

[kokpit]

Hi y'all, as they say here in sunny Georgia.

I just stumbled across this site and thought I'd pop in to say hello, seems like quite the place to be, some great forums. :D

Anyway, a question for you guys (and girls) in probably, not quite so sunny, UK.

I am stationed in the US with the RAF (yes a hellish job, but someone had to do it :ok: ) and took the opportunity to get my PPL while here. I'm pushing the wrong side of forty, it was purely for personal reasons, and have no ambition to take it up commercially.

Much to the wife's frustration I am now starting the instrument rating, hoping to get that before I'm dragged back to the UK, as well as the complex and high performance ratings.

I know there are various places in the US, and I presume also in the UK, where you can convert FAA into JAA licence's but have no idea of what is involved, apart from more expense and grief from 'er indoors.

Is it necessary?

Is it feasible to fly in the UK with an FAA licence, and if so, with what restrictions if any?

Any other related info would be greatly appreciated.

Equally, if there's any help or advice I can give from this side of the pond, just holler.

Safe skies...........

[Charlie Zulu]

Hi Kokpit,

Flying over here in the sunny UK (yes it is very warm for the last couple of days - I brought the nice weather home with me from Florida on Sunday!) on an FAA PPL is perfectly possible.

Basically the United Kingdom CAA allow ICAO PPL holders (of which an FAA PPL is one) to fly G registered aeroplanes in United Kingdom Airspace in VFR conditions only. Thus if you have an FAA PPL/IR this would only be valid for VFR - ie your IR wouldn't be valid.

However if you source and buy an N registered aeroplane (non US citizens will need to do this on a trust company scheme) then you will be able to use your FAA PPL/IR in all airspace under VFR and IFR rules anywhere in the world and that includes Europe.

I've just got back from Florida where I obtained an FAA CPL/IR. I'm now trying to source an N registered aeroplane to hire so that I can use my IR on. I also have a CAA PPL/IMC/Night and currently fly a G registered aeroplane, but wouldn't mind being able to fly IFR in Europe - thus the need for the N registered aeroplane myself.

Good luck with your Instrument Rating... just remember enjoy the course and look forward to the flight test.

Hope this helps.

Best wishes,

Richard.

[kokpit]

Thnx Richard.

So an FAA IFR Cert is of no use in the UK then :hmm:

Can you still keep it current though?

Also, what will you do for FAA Bi-Annuals and Med Certs, I presume they are available in the UK?

[Flyin'Dutch']

Hi Kokpit,

In addition to what CZ posted:

The FAA PPL/IR can be converted but at the expense of time and effort. You will have to do the groundschool IR and an additional 15 hours and the CAAFU exam.

FAA PPL/IR holders are also allowed to exercise the same privileges as PPL/IMC holders in UK airspace.

With regards to the issue of keeping your FAA stuff valid. There are plenty of FAA AMEs and CFIs over here to get you sorted out. And you can of course keep the IR valid by ensuring you don't fall foul of the 6 in 6 months rule.

HTH

FD

[Circuit Basher]

Kokpit - welcome to PPRuNe!

As one who wears light blue part time (with space cadets!) I thought I'd pop up and say hello!

There are N reg aircraft in the UK (in fact, I know of one that was ferried into the UK within the last week - I was helping to hangar it last night!), but they are few and far between. Depends what your long term aim is - if you want to fly professionally in UK, then I'd suggest doing the groundschool and JAR conversion for your IR.

If you want to have the IR as a 'extend your flying options' route, then hook up with an AME who can do FAA medicals, an instructor who can do FAA BFRs and make sure you shoot the requisite number of approaches to stay current. As previously stated, you can use your FAA IR as a UK IMC. Only drawback is trying to fly a G reg aircraft outside UK airspace in IMC (and there have been long drawn out threads on this topic!!).

[ncusack]

Hi Guys;
Interesting this post should appear this morning when I have just the question. I am going to Naples in September to do my PPL and ATPL groundschool and hour building. I have been told by the school that the FAA PPL is the one to go with as it is the less stressful with less exams etc etc.

I could then in theory so an FAA IR which counts towards my JAA IR? Does this sound familiar? Is it normal for someone who plans to train to F/ATPL level for JAA states would start off with an FAA PPL?:confused: :confused: :confused: :confused:

Thanks for the info;

Ncusack:confused:

[englishal]

A few common misconceptions here :D

The FAA PPL privileges can be exercised in a G reg aircraft, including all FAA ratings you have [for example ME and IR and not limited to day VFR as the FAA PPL includes night as 'standard']. However you are not allowed into controlled airspace while flying in accordance with IFR. Becasue of this restriction on the IR holding an FAA IR doesn't quite give the same privileges as an IMC rating, though the CAA will issue you one for £67 if you hold a JAA licence as well as the FAA certificate.

You can keep your FAA IR / PPL current in the UK no problem. If you need a Bi-annual or IPC then there is a place at Enstone, Oxfordshire who have their own CFII who does all this. They even get an examiner over once every 8 weeks or so if you need to take a flight test or something...

Cheers
EA:D

[Flyin'Dutch']

EA,

I was under the impression that the only place in the UK where you can do any FAA flight tests is American Flight Training in Norwich.

FD

[englishal]

Nope, you can even do a full FAA IR from start to finish at Enstone. You do the writtens in Norwich, then the flight test by arrangement with the FAA examiner.......

Cheers

[Flyin'Dutch']

I daresay, that is interesting.

Do you happen to have a telephone number hanging about.

Am I correct in assuming (dangerous I know) that the CFII is Bill Tollerton, and do they have N reg machines to do the ratings?

FD

[englishal]

Am I correct in assuming (dangerous I know) that the CFII is Bill Tollerton
No :D

Have a look at http://www.acflyers.co.uk/ . I've been up [up, relative to a southerner of course:D] there a few times, and they have a nice setup and good aircraft.

Cheers
EA:D

[Julian]

The N Reg is a twin Beech Baron.

On the G they have a TB9, TB10, TB20 & a Diamond Star.

Julian

[IO540]

When training for an FAA PPL and FAA IR in the UK, can one do it legally in a G-reg plane or does it have to be in an N-reg?

I own a G-reg plane (complex single retractable) and due to the equipment in it I would not want to train in a school plane.

I've also met a few people who can do FAA PPL or IR training (but not the final exam) - they appear to offer to do this freelance, is that legal too?

[englishal]

Yep you can do it in your own aircraft. I know the guys at Enstone often train people in their own G reg's. An FAA CFI / CFII is not restricted to training in an N registered aircraft, nor from a licenced field. For the purposes of JAA / CAA training I think you have to initially touch down at a licenced field. An FAA CFII is also not restricted to train people from an "approved FTO" unlike the CAA / JAA.

Just thought of one thing though, if you take the check ride in a G reg I believe the guy in the RHS has to be the JAA FI [they're dual FAA and JAA FI's at Enstone], as the examiner can't legally act as PIC in a G reg [madness isn't it :D]. The examiner then sits in the back as a passenger or something along those lines. Give 'em a bell and ask how they do it if you're interested.

EA:D

[bluskis]

How do G reg group owned planes on private CofA stand when it comes to FAA IR training?

[Flyin'Dutch']

No problem, methinks as long as you hold an IMC and you log the IR training as additional training for the IMC.

You have to have done a few things for the FAA but not necessarily have followed a particular syllabus.

FD

[englishal]

I don't think it matters.....though best check with someone in the know.

EA

[IO540]

Bluskis

AFAIK you cannot train in a Private CofA plane for the initial award of any License or a Rating.

What I don't know is whether this applies only to CAA/JAA licenses or ratings; I suspect it applies to the whole lot.

If you flew your Private CofA plane to the USA and did your training there, it would still be subject to the CAA CofA restrictions.

Not that anybody is likely to find out; I know for sure that lots of people have been trained up in Private CofA planes especially in the past when instructors could freelance. It comes down to your view of the insurance issues!

[RodgerF]

The issue of Private C of A for training has been aired in various threads. Basically if the person receiving training is paying someone else for the aircraft the instructor cannot be paid.

So if you are a sole (possibly joint owner) of the aircraft then there is no aircraft payment involved and the instructor can receive 'valuable consideration' If its a group owned aircraft (legal entity) then the instructor cannot be paid.

Article 130 of the ANO is the relevant article plus an AIC which clarifies the situation for renewal, revalidation or initial tests.

Training for an FAA licence of rating would IMHO still be classed as aerial work. Provisions of article 130 would still apply in this case.

[Lance Murdoch]

Kokpit,

to convert an ICAO PPL to a JAA PPL requires the following

if you have under 100 hours, you need to pass all the JAA exams and pass the skills test

if you have over 100 hours, you need to pass the Air Law and the Human Factors exams and pass the skills test.

If you are just planning to fly for leisure then Im not sure Id bother converting as this just adds to the hassle and expense for no real gain as you can fly on a FAA PPL in the UK. It would be useful to spend a few hours flying dual with an instructor in the UK as met conditions and RT procedures are subtely different.