Oxford/bae Entrance Tests

[stevewood1973]

Hi,

I am about to apply for Ab Initio training (APP at OXFORD, BAE SYSTEMS (Jerez) or CABAIR).

My first question is which is the best school? Secondly what do the entrance tests consist of at OXFORD and BAE SYSTEMS? I can't find any mention of entrance tests for CABAIR unless anyone knows different.

I am hoping to start in about 6 months time. Is anyone else is thinking of going around that time?

Hope you can help!

Thanks,

Steve.

[b252]

Hey there,

Regarding which is the best, check the archives here for comparissons as there exists alot of info to trawl through.

As for what the assesments consist of, you are best advised to ring up each of the schools that you will be attending and asking admin to send you out an email regarding what each test entails. Oxford sent me alot of material I have since discarded as I chose not to go there, and BAE have told me that their test consit of the following: Co-ordination tests, spatial awareness...etc, verbal reasoning and numerical reasoning...all very similar to the process big companies use when recruiting graduates. If you head to Waterstones, or similar, you can pick up the 'how to pass numerical/verbal reasoning series to practice before each assesment.

Thats as much as I know, I am due to sit mine soon, so hopefuly someone else can provide a more detailed structure?

Good luck!

[stevewood1973]

Thanks for the advice b252. Good luck with your tests. Where are you hoping to train (bae?)? Hope all goes well. Let me know how you get on.

Steve.

[ecj]

Don't give up the day job unless you think the market will really improve by the start of 2005.

[b252]

No worries Steve, and yes, am planning on going to BAE, the weather and the school suit me best..each to their own!

Dont get put off by any of the negative comments here, some are useful, just bear in mind, 'where there is a will there is a way'. I recently went for my for my 1st class medical and was chatting with a first officer on the 777 with BA. When he left his school (he was self sponsored), the situation was the same as it is now so he took a job with a tiny regional carrier in Scotland that paid peanuts (but hey, he was flying), worked for them during the week and then worked at 'Homebase' at the weekends. 6yrs later and having worked his way up, he now flies for BA and has never looked back. Was it all worth it? Of course, you just have to be single minded and dedicated to doing whatever it takes and not just sit on the fence and talk of doom and gloom, just weigh up the situation before you decide which side to stay on!

Good luck, let me know how you get on!

:ok:

[stevewood1973]

Thanks again for your replies guys. I am quite lucky in that I am able to take a career break from my current job (Police Officer) for up to five years. So I can always go back to a decent salary should things not work out in the first five years. There seems to be mixed feelings about the job market. I was talking to a Britannia Airways FO last week who said that things aren't quite as bad as they are made out and there are jobs to be had.

I think its now or never for me. I have the financial opportunity to do it now so I think I would certainly regret it if I didnt take the chance.

Keep me updated on your progress guys.

Thanks again.

Steve.

[Touch'n'oops]

I wouldn't worry about the entrance exams. I think the schools use them to see how you will perform, rather than if you can attend.

Right now schools would take a monkey with a leg and arm missing as long as he waves the medical and cash at them!!!!!

As for the question of jobs... just look at all the post on it! People have spoken for months. To get a job I reckon its is a load luck and good connections!:hmm:

As for BAe, I'm here now... Come on in the life is fine!!!!:ok:

[stevewood1973]

Thanks for your reply Touch'n'oops. I like the look of BAE although it's a bit difficult to get the time to go over and meet them. It's certainly a top contender for my business. How long have you been there?

Steve.

[stevewood1973]

Thanks for your reply Touch'n'oops. I like the look of BAE although it's a bit difficult to get the time to go over and meet them. It's certainly a top contender for my business. How long have you been there?

Steve.

[yeboin]

Steve,

How long (if you don't mind me asking) were you in the police before they gave you the career break? It's just I have applied to join the West Yorkshire police after finishing my PPL so I can self-sponsor my CPL. I thought maybe work three or four years in the police at which point I'd have saved the money needed, but a career break sounds a good idea.

Cheers, Eoin.

[Touch'n'oops]

I've been here for the past 5 months and just about to go head to head with Phase1s!

I still think BAe was the right choice and haven't looked back.

Best advice I can give about choosing a school, is to go and visit. Visit for the day and try to get into the lessons. It is the best way to determin wether it's right for you!!

Happy hunting!

[stevewood1973]

Eoin,

I have been in the police for six years. However the career break scheme is available to officers who have completed their probationary period (ie after two years service). I am still there. I will work up until I find a flight training school and actuallt start training. I am looking to start before the end of the year.

If you have any other questions, particularly in relation to joining the police and the application process, I am more than happy to advise you with my limited knowledge.

Good luck with both careers!

Steve.

[yeboin]

Thanks a lot Steve.

When I get called for selection with the police I'll be bending your ear for advice! Apparently it will be september before I get the call as they have had a shedload of applications of late.

Incidently, and in regard to your question at the top of the thread, I have just applied to Oxford for their APP and they asked me to go for selection. The email I got said the selection process consists of four days with the usual psychometric testing and aptitude tests, a day long group discussion/interview session and a simulator test with a day in the middle to analyse your results and decide whether to let you continue or send you packing. The problem I have with it is that they can only (according to their website) offer a bank loan to cover 50% of the training cost, and at £58,500 for the integrated course + £12,000 accomodation you basically need around £35,000 in advance. I'm definately going to go for a look anyway.

Cheers, Eoin.

[Obs cop]

Steve,

Concerning Bae entrance tests, I don't know how accurate this is these days, but when I was looking at the PASS scheme run by Bae some years ago I sat most of their in house tests.

In effect they had 3 major sections. The first realted to eye-hand co-ordination and spatial awareness for which they used the GAPAN tests. These were computer based tests and very similar to the tests used by the armed forces. I don't know if Bae still use them, but plenty of practice at computer games can't hurt!:)

Further to this there were timed mutichoice papers for basic aritmetic and phyics eg. speed/time/distance stuff. Lastly, there were a few papers for psychological evaluation.

This was a few years ago (like 7 years!) and was for a part sponsorship scheme, so I honestly don't know how much or how little they may still use.

Yeboin,

Don't forget that the modular route is very useful once you are a serving police officer. I am a reactive police officer, and am ploughing my way through the modular system. The shift system means that I get plenty of midweek days off in which to go flying. What I would say is don't overestimate how much your take home pay from the police is. The initial salary seems very nice, but policing is my fall back should I not get a flying job. To that extent, I am in the federation, the pension setup (11% of your salary) and various other insurance options which drastically reduce my money. I had to buy a house and wait until the capital could be released by re-mortgaging.

By careful use of my leave and rest days owed, I figure that I can get all bar the IR completed whilst still working, meaning I will be able to have up to 5 years as a career break to find and hold my first flying job. If the market takes another dip in that 5 year period, I could still go back to policing relatively easili, and at the point I left it.

Good luck with both sets of plans.

Obs cop

[yeboin]

Thanks Obs cop


I see what you mean about the the pay after deductions, I'm planning to live at home and save like hell if I get into the Force, probably need to get a loan aswell. The flying school where I'm completing the PPL offers a modular course up to Frozen ATPL for £30K, but I'm going to budget for quite a bit more. Good advice about combining the day job with the modular route, it will certainly allow more time during the career break to get that elusive first flying job



All the best with it


:ok:

Eoin

[Obs cop]

My shift pattern is 12 hour shifts set up as 2 days, 2 nights then 4 days off. Plenty of time for flying:ok:

[stevewood1973]

Eoin,

It's true what Obs cop says; the pay isn't great but it's a good start to raise some cash. I have booked Oxford Seminar for 19th July at Oxford and one at Cabair on 2nd August. I don't know when you were thinking of going? Might see you there.

Steve.

[yeboin]

Steve,


I'm certainly hoping to go this month, I'm sure I can make the 19th.

Eoin

[Rowardennan]

So has anyone actually taken the Oxford APP three day assessment and feels like sharing?

I'm planning on taking the tests in a month or so and I'm just trying to get an idea of the level/type of tests

I'm expecting the usual Psychometric tests but just wanted an inside track on the standard

For example is it just basic IQ type testing? or do I need to get out the old trigonometry and Physics books for a quick read through

Thanks in advance

[P T Flea]

Yeboin: You seem to have got the pricing for the APP a little mixed up. The 58,500 includes your flying training and accomodation at Tyler, on top of this is the accomodation/food at Oxford and the food at Tyler (not sure how much this amounts to) and then there is 3,000 of CAA test fees.

Rowardennan: Yes I have done the APP selection. The selection process itself is quite difficult but I am not sure how high the selection standards are, if that makes sense. The computer based COMPASS tests are divided into quite a few sections and the mental arithmetic section is definently worth brushing up for. If you want to get some example type of questions then go to the CTC McApline thread in the Sponsorship forums (as they use the same COMPASS tests) where there are some examples described. There is also information on the individual parts of the test decribed on the EPST website http://www.epst.com/compass.html

Hope this helps,

PT
:ok:

[Rowardennan]

Thanks for the info Flea